fter reading that UV light can blind snakes maybe I turned mine off was 73 cold side

i'm scared that if it gets colder in the tank that he will get sick. please advise cuz i did turn it off and now i'm wondering if i should have...


thanks!



-Nick

Do you have a way of knowing how low the temp goes on the cool side? It's ok! You haven't fed him yet, he isn't needing the heat for digesting, he can go to his warm hide if he feels too cold- and if you are going to obsess about it all night just put a towel on top to keep the heat in. He'll be ok!!

Nanci

Well if the warm side is still warm and the cold side is 73 that's just fine!
Unless you mean that there is no heat whatsoever. But like nanci said as long as he isn't digesting right now the 73* won't hurt him

My house temp got down to 63-65F all winter, and everyone is fine! Don't worry! Now if your house is getting down to about 50, I'd definitely add extra heat.

Nanci

The cool side on 4 vivs right now is 67, but the warm side is 85 and that's what's important. If 67 gets too cool, they'll move.

I really don't think that UV is going to blind the snake. Low levels are probably even beneficial. They are technically a diurnal snake (although they act more crespuscular)and should be able to tolerate sunlight easily.

The only time I've heard anything about UV blinding a snake specifically involved albino burmese pythons, but I suppose it could be true for any kind of albino snake as well. If you shine bright lights of any kind in the eyes of a snake with no melanin, I guess it could damage it.

But then again, if you shined a bright light in your own eyes without blinking and without an appropriate place to get away from the light for long periods of time, I suppose it would blind you too after awhile...

And how many snakes just sit out in the open forever? Mine are in and out of their hides all the time or under the aspen. I would think blinding by UV light is about as likely as them growing hands...at least with all the areas to hide away in my vivs.

after reading that UV light can blind snakes maybe I turned mine off was 73 cold side .

Could you direct me to that information. I would like to read up on that.
Thanks. :cheers:

If it was true that uv blinded snakes then every snake in the wild would be blind! Most of our snakes have hides and substrate to hide in and wouldn't sit out in the open for long enough periods to blind. The other thing is that UV is only effective within a certain distance. For instance UV must be within 12-18" of lizards and turtles for it to do it's job. I plan on putting in low level UV/full spectrum lights in all my cages...even my nocturnal chondros cages. I think that although snakes don't technically need it to survive as lizards and chelonians do, they can still benefit.

I believe it was my info that started the UV/blindness risk discussion.

Just to clarify, there is no PROOF of this. However, my source is a lady in the UK who runs a well-thought-of reptile rescue. Over the years, she's taken in several blind Corns and occasional common factors were that a) they were lighter morphs that lacked the darker pigment that provides natural protection against UV, and b) their former owners had used UV in their vivs.

This really is only anecdotal from only one source. I just put it out there as I believe it's worth consideration - it's something I've based some of my husbandry practices on and so it may be of general interest.

On the other hand, I do feel that it's an established fact that Corns don't need UV in captivity, otherwise none would live for more than a couple of years without it and the majority of Corns in captivity would have developed some sort of problem from being without. Corns aren't exposed to strong UV in the wild, as they are active at dusk/night/dawn, when the sun is at its weakest or not up at all.

It's an interesting discussion. Certainly, when I've had a Corn under the weather during warm weather, my vet has advised that I take her outdoors for short periods each day, as he felt that the natural sunlight would be beneficial and give her a boost.

Another one of those lovely Corny situations where there is no absolute yes/no answer, just some shades of grey that we each get to choose from.

How do you in fact determine that a snake is blind? I can see a veterinarian that can use a scope to show retinal damage, but for the average person? Many of my snakes don't react a lot if I put a hand in front of their faces so how is she determining that they are in fact blind?

bitsy said:

Just to clarify, there is no PROOF of this. However, my source is a lady in the UK who runs a well-thought-of reptile rescue. Over the years, she's taken in several blind Corns and occasional common factors were that a) they were lighter morphs that lacked the darker pigment that provides natural protection against UV, and b) their former owners had used UV in their vivs.

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I wonder...... Is this due to the possibility that lights are used more in UK for a heat source??? Hmmm :shrugs:

I think the UV issue really has to do with albinos (none of them survive in the wild long enough to go blind). You can do a google search on UV light and albinos - there are several studies done on mices/rats that sugggest UV light is, indeed, harmful to the eyes of albinos.

I think that even if they survived in the wild, they would not go blind from the UV. Most cornsnakes are found out in the evening and early morning. By the time the sun really starts warming things up, they are getting cooled off in the shade where the majority of UV is filtered out by leaves. It's not like they are in the middle of the desert with little cover. The areas where they are found are for the most part heavily forested and has lots of cover. I could travel all the way to work around here (63 miles one way) and maybe go in the sun once if I wasn't careful. The rest of the time I could stay well within the trees if I desired.

Interesting points all, thanks.

I think that even if they survived in the wild, they would not go blind from the UV.

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Absolutely agree that they wouldn't take harm from UV in the wild. But this is for the reasons you state - that they're not active when sunlight is strongest and they have plenty of opportunity to keep out of direct sunlight.

UV in a viv or tank is a different thing to natural sunlight. It's a more concentrated form and the Corns have more limited options for staying out of it.

Most cornsnakes are found out in the evening and early morning. By the time the sun really starts warming things up, they are getting cooled off in the shade where the majority of UV is filtered out by leaves.

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I think that's reason that they don't need UV in captivity. They don't really get exposed to it for any length of time in the wild.

How do you in fact determine that a snake is blind?

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They develop visible cataracts. Their eyes take on the same kind of greyish shade as though they were about to shed, but it doesn't look as regular as a loosening eyecap does.

My vet is sure that my eldest Corn (19 years old) is blind due to cataracts. This was put down to age, as he's never had UV lights. His behaviour has changed as he gradually lost his sight, although you probably wouldn't know it if you hadn't known him before. I have to give him plenty of time to realise that my hand is near him and sometime I need to scuff about in the substrate and generate some movement before he notices me.

Is this due to the possibility that lights are used more in UK for a heat source???

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I'm not aware that using lights as a heatsource for Corns is any more prevelant in the UK than in the US. UV lights are a pretty inefficient heat source as that's not what they're designed for.

Interesting. I'm going to still provide some low level UV lights in my chondro tanks and perhaps in my corns tanks. UV is a natural killer of bacteria and I'm hoping to find out if it might lower the possibility of getting RI's from showing up. I will most likely use the lowest UV bulb available and provide one area on the perch where it will be close enough to provide UV The snakes also have lots of plants in there too. I know of at least one guy on one of my chondro forums that has indoor/outdoor cages for his snakes and they all make use of the outdoor areas. He feels they are much more healthy that way. It would be an interesting study.

I'd certainly be interested to know the effects Meg.

I wonder if it might improve things like the quality of sheds, reliability of feeding, increased fertility rates etc.? They're the sorts of things that we may not necessarily think of as "problems", but where a potential risk could be outweighed by a range of observed benefits.

Keep us posted - interesting to see how this develops for you.

I'll let you know, although this wouldn't be a very accurate experiment due to the small amount of animals and having no test group that just stays as is. But if I notice any different behavior I'll certainly let you know. An interesting note: a bit off topic to the cornsnakes but one of the members on my chondro forum did a thermo scan of his animals under the radiant heat panels and found that at 85 degree settings, the animals were actually showing 90 or higher on their body scans. No wonder most of them spend their time on the cool side! I've since turned down the temps to 82 for my chondros and they all seem more active and the ones that were grounding themselves are not doing it any more. Might be something to think about with the uth too.

MegF. said:

I think that even if they survived in the wild, they would not go blind from the UV.

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Assuming an albino snake, already handicapped by poorer vision, poorer motion perception, and poor sense of smell than that of a pigmented snake survives, it still lacks the melanin in the eyes needed to cope with UV light. It's a recipe for eye damage and eventual blindness.