• Hello!

    Either you have not registered on this site yet, or you are registered but have not logged in. In either case, you will not be able to use the full functionality of this site until you have registered, and then logged in after your registration has been approved.

    Registration is FREE, so please register so you can participate instead of remaining a lurker....

    Please be certain that the location field is correctly filled out when you register. All registrations that appear to be bogus will be rejected. Which means that if your location field does NOT match the actual location of your registration IP address, then your registration will be rejected.

    Sorry about the strictness of this requirement, but it is necessary to block spammers and scammers at the door as much as possible.

What to say to people who support the killing of rattlesnakes?

Kilala

lemme go! I'm sleeping!
Okay, long story short:

I was talking to some people about how I would love to end all rattlesnake roundups and they flipped. They're like: Don't they kill people? Why would you want to save bad things like that? rattlesnake roundups are good, because they make cities safe!

Yeah, I know, it's shocking.


I could show them all the great info out there, but these people are clearly too stupid to comprehend that stuff. What can I say that will convince people at this mental level?
 
That they don't carry diseases, yet vermin do..... And they keep the vermin population down..... Thats good in my books....
 
What would I say to them? Nothing. I don't bother talking to people like that - they're not going to change their minds. The only outcome is higher blood pressure for me.

If they're not actively involved in it or actively supporting it, just steer clear. Otherwise you're just inventing yourself a new problem.

Sorry - I'm feeling a bit sour towards the lowest common denominator today! I used to have a badge that said "Be kind to the Mundanes - they can't help it". I think it applies with people like this.
 
A few months ago there was a youtube video of a bunch of stupid teenage boys stoning a rattlesnake to death and then beheading it- I teared up and was enraged. I can't comprehend any animal being killed unless it is sick to end suffering, but these boys were laughing like what they had done was funny and posted the video as an accomplishment. If they were my boys I may lop something off of them- just kidding but I don't get it at all.
 
A couple years ago, Texas Fish and Game magazine, a fairly prominent hunting and fishing magazine in Texas ran an article about killing rattlesnakes. I replied and they published my letter a few months later. Now, my letter may not be exactly what you are looking for, but I am sure that some of my points can help you out.

Texas Fish and Game Magazine said:
"Rattler! Hunting the most feared creature in North America" by Russell Graves

The weather was a bit cool the night before, but in late Match, the panhandle sun sliced through the cold front and warmed the rigged badlands of North-western Texas. Walking with my friend Todd Nelson, we explore the craggy rock outcropping looking for signs of one of the most misunderstood creatures in all of the Rolling Plains.
We do not have to look long before we find what we seek: At the bottom of the small knoll we stand upon, Todd spots the serpentine shape of a snake. The snake is so well camouflaged I do not immediately spot it. Instead, I study the rocks trying to pick out the irregularities in the shapes to no avail.
"Look between those two biggest rocks," instructs Todd. I squint and see a foreign shape among the broken aggregate, and soon pick out the triangle shaped head of a western diamondback rattlesnake. The diamondback's camouflage is impeccable. Its swarthy coloration and symmetrical back pattern works hides the snake quite effectively, which helps make it an effective and deadly predator.
I ease in close to shoot a few pictures while Todd readies his gear. Soon he reaches down and snatches the snake a few inches behind the head with a set of snake tongs. He deposits the snake in a bucket and we begin looking for another one. In the few minutes we spend on the knoll, Todd catches five fat rattlers and a sleek western coachwhip.
Todd will store the rattlesnakes until he markets them to a buyer that comes around in April. Eventually, the snakes provide some meat, the skins and rattles become assorted consumer products from belts to jewelry, and some specimens are delivered alive to biomedical manufactures of antivenin and other venom-based pharmaceuticals.
Rattlers have been the subject of many myths and misconceptions over the years. Legend says that when you cut off a rattler's head, the snake will not die until the sun goes down. Although the story is not true, it is testament to the deep-seated fear many people have of snakes.
The western diamondback rattlesnake belongs to a group of snakes known as pit vipers. This name derives from small openings or pits just in front of the eyes and below the nostrils. These pits serve as heat detectors, enabling snakes to determine the location of warm-blooded prey, thus making strikes more accurate and hence more deadly.
Inside the mouth of a diamondback are a highly specialized tongue, and a pair of fangs that deliver venom. The tongue, long and forked, is a scent detector for testing the chemical composition of the air. It sends data to a pair of receptors in the mouth known as Jacobson's organs. These organs process the scent and pass the signal to the brain. During hunting forays, a diamondback constantly flicks its tongue in and out of its mouth, searching for prey as well as threats to its survival. Compared to the species it preys on, the long-range eyesight of the diamondback is poor. Highly evolved senses of temperature and smell are its keys to survival.
The diamondback's fangs remain folded flat in its mouth in sheaths until they are used in a strike. The hollow fangs inject venom into the prey like hypodermic needles. The venom is a potent blend neurotoxic and hemotoxic agents containing more than 70 different proteins. These proteins affect the nervous system, causing paralysis, and break down tissue in a pre-ingestion digestion process.
The bite can be fatal to humans, but modern medicine has made death rare. Fewer than 2 percent of strikes result in fatality. Untreated, however, bites can cause extensive tissue damage and severe swelling.
When threatened, a diamondback will anchor the rear 2/3 of its body to the ground, wind itself into coils, and raise the anterior portion of its body off the ground in an "S" shape. Locked onto an intruder with a piercing gaze, the rattler emits a warning buzz from its tail and investigates the air with its tongue.
Another myth held that a rattler's unblinking stare "charmed" small animals into a hypnotic state. Studies have proven otherwise. The diamonback's defensive posture will last as long as the snake senses that a threat exists or until it yields ground and simply crawls away to safety.
Because rattlesnakes are ectothermic (dependant on external warmth to maintain body heat), finding their haunts is relatively east. Todd looks for dens in the early fall and late winter when Indian summer conditions bring warm daytime temperatures after a cool night. After the sun sets, the air cools quickly and the rattlesnakes seek the safety and warmth of a den. In the den, rattlesnakes huddle together to share body heat while soaking what hear they can out of the surrounding air and ground.
Once the sun rises, the snakes exit dens to lie on sun-warmed ground and rocks. Therefore, when conditions are ripe, snake dens are easy to find. After a cool night, wait until late mourning or afternoon and search around rocky outcroppings that face the sun, or around old houses.
The tools for becoming a snake hunter are surprisingly few. Actually, all you need are a good pair of snake boots, and a bucket with a closeable lid, and snake tongs.
For the snake boots I recommend a lace-up boot with a 16-inch top instead of cowboy boots. Bass Pro Shops sells Redhead brand snake boots, which can also double as turkey hunting boots.
To tote snakes, a 5-gallon bucket with a closeable lid fits the bill. To build a snake bucket, simply cut a 5x5-inch square out of the lid. Cover the hole with a 6x6-inch wide by 1-inch thick piece of lumber attached with a hinge. There is no need to put a hasp on the lid to keep it closed; you need to be able to quickly flip the lid open when you are ready to insert a snake.
When selecting a pair of snake tongs, get the kind with a closeable jaw. Snake hooks may work for moving reptiles, but with dangerous snakes such as diamondbacks, you want to grip them with snake tongs and control their movements more than hooks allow.
Snake tongs are inexpensive and you can find them at retail outlets such as Forestry Suppliers for $55 to $80. The price variation reflects length, and I recommend longer tongs to keep the snake away from your body as much as possible.
Once you have caught a passel of snakes, the obvious question is what to do with them. Preserving your catch is easier than you might think. For starters, skin the snake as you would a deer, coyote, or any other creature. A word of caution: a dead snake can still bite, so cut off the head and dispose of it before skinning.
Once the skin is off, scrape the meat from inside the hide using a spoon or dull knife. Once the skin is de-fleshed, soak it in a mixture of 1/2 cup borax to a half gallon of water and refrigerate it for 24 hours, "stirring" two to three times during that time.
Once the skin is well soaked, remove it from the borax solution and stretch it out on a piece of plywood with the flesh side down. You can staple the skin to the board when you stretch it out, simply let it lie unattached. Put the skin away to dry in a cool place for a couple weeks.
Once the skin is dry, you can treat it with a tanning solution. I have heard some use a 50/50 mixture of isopropyl alcohol and antifreeze and let it soak for a day. To dry the skin, hang it up for about a week so the solution can drip off. Alternatively, you can buy commercially made tanning solutions such as Snake Tan from Van Dyke's Taxidermy Supply and follow the manufacturer's instructions.
If you are adventurous and want to sample snake meat, slice across the snake's body and cut the meat into bite-sized chunks. The meat can be prepared in a number of ways, but perhaps the most practical is to simply bread and deep-fry as you would fish fillets.
Whether your intent is to catch snakes to sell, process the meat and hides, or just study them, I think you will find it is a great way to spend some time afield. Snake hunting is dangerous and not to be approached casually. Their lightning quick strikes and unpredictable nature makes hunting rattlers one of the most dangerous pursuits in Texas. Don't fret though. With a little preparation and a healthy dose of respect, snakes are the perfect quarry for the adventurous sportsman.


My Letter said:
To the editor:

The cover story for the August issue of the TF&G Almanac entitled “Rattler!” was at best irresponsible. It was not only
ethically irresponsible but also ecologically irresponsible. The idea of suggesting uneducated (not meaning unschooled, but meaning inexperienced) people hunt or collect venomous reptiles is ludicrous. A single bite from the western diamondback rattlesnake (Crotalus atrox) can leave one life or limbless. Because of your article many uneducated/inexperienced people will travel to the field in search of rattlesnakes, these people will very likely be many hours away form any form of medical help. If they are bit, which is likely as collecting rattlesnakes requires the right tools and experience; they will very likely need the aid of a very expensive helicopter ride to a hospital.
When the bite victim arrives at the hospital they will be asked which kind of snake bit them, and if they live in an area that only C. atrox are native to, that will be fine, but I am sure that many of your readers live and hunt in areas where other rattlesnake species call home.
The majority of Texas counties have at least two rattlesnake species, some of which are very toxic. When most people encounter a rattlesnake, all they know is it is a rattlesnake and they have no idea which species it is. This can lead to major problems as the Mojave rattlesnake (C. s. scutulatus) and the prairie rattlesnake (C. v. viridis) carry neurotoxins as well as hemotoxins. Neurotoxins attack the nervous system and a bite from the Mojave rattlesnake can be deadly if not treated very quickly. The venom of the Mojave is 10-50 times as lethal as the western diamondback’s while the venom from the prairie is 2-2.5 times as lethal as the western diamondback’s.
The article mentions nothing of a non-game collector’s permit, which is required to collect many species of reptiles in Texas, including all species of rattlesnakes. To suggest an idea and not tell the reader of a needed permit is absurd. Many people will unknowingly collect with out the permit and be “caught” by the local game warden. When in possession of the permit and actively collecting, one must by law, keep a record of all collections. Also, there are limits to the number of specimens one can keep at a time. There where no mentions of these parameters in your article.
“The only good snake is a dead snake” is the mentality most people have. This mentality combined with your article will undoubtedly lead to the decimation of not only one species, but of many. You should try educating the readers about the benefits snakes as a whole before you recommend the killing and collecting of a species. Snakes, including rattlesnakes, keep the rodent population down. If snakes were removed, rodents would increase. With an increase in the number of rodents you would see an increase in r-selected predators, like the coyote (and how many farmers and ranchers want that?).
The timber, or canebrake, rattlesnake (C. horridus atricaudatus) is a state protected species, and laws governing the killing and collecting of this vital species are the same as those governing the killing and collecting of animals like the Texas horned lizard and the Texas indigo. It is illegal to kill or collect any of these species with out the proper paperwork, and your article makes no mention of any reptile species being protected on a state or federal level. This would not matter, but the article fails to mention that there is more than one species of rattlesnake (eight total) in this state and most people hear or see a “rattle”
and shoot first and ask questions later.
I am not some left wing animal lover, I am hunter, and a reptile enthusiast and believe that these animals should be protected not killed unmercifully. I do understand that there are circumstances in which the snake must be killed (i.e. near children or animals), I myself have been there, but snakes do not need to be killed just for the sake of killing in the middle of somebody’s ranch far from civilization.

Michael Leidner
Kingsville, TX
 
A couple years ago, Texas Fish and Game magazine, a fairly prominent hunting and fishing magazine in Texas ran an article about killing rattlesnakes. I replied and they published my letter a few months later. Now, my letter may not be exactly what you are looking for, but I am sure that some of my points can help you out.

I am very impressed with your letter. It is very well written and I totally agree with you! I think most people react in the "shoot first, ask question's later", mentality out of basic fear. Something I can't slight them for. I think this also fuels the "round up" mentality as well.

I'm not saying that I'm as educated as some, in regards to venomous reptiles, but I know enough that these animals usually give a warning before lashing out and backing away is probably the safest method. But, if my child was incidentally placed in a position of being bitten by one of these animals, how would I react? I would probably revert back to that whole paternal instinct and shoot first, ask questions later mentality.

Trying to educate the uneducated that are already set in their ways, is pretty difficult. Regardless of what you tell them, they sadly already have their minds made up. You can try to make your point, explain the FACTS and show alternatives, but most of the time it would be to no avail.

I come across this type of mentality on occasion, because I too, am a hunter. I have the opportunity to meet people in all walks of life. Some greet my hobby with tolerance and others, well you get the idea. So all you can do is give your viewpoint and hope for the best. And, if you know that their activity is against the law, report it for the sake of the animals.

Good Luck

Wayne
 
"Eat up!"

Or

"Know any good recipes?"

:shrugs:
D80

I thought it was, I need a good pair of boots.
womens_snakeskin-boots.jpg
 
For the record, I have no problem with the human take of animals, be it snake or deer or cow or chicken or whatever. As long as it is done humanely and with conservation in mind (of course the chicken and cow comment was said tongue in cheek).

My problem was with the way the magazine presented the idea to "uneducated" public.
 
"Eat up!"

Or

"Know any good recipes?"

:shrugs:
D80

I thought it was, I need a good pair of boots.

Why? Why be like that considering the hobby/business you have decided to engage in. What if someone took the same stance with your personal snakes, just because they didn't like them? Shot deer and left the animal to rot because the antlers were too small!

I am not against using them or any other animal for food or clothing! But, I do have a problem with people killing an animal, just because it's there!! There is a difference between harvesting and killing! I do not believe in senseless killing of any species!!

Wayne
 
Sarcasm is a form of ironic speech or writing which is bitter or cutting, being intended to taunt its target.

Sarcasm appears several times in the Old Testament, for example:
Lo, you see the man is mad; why then have you brought him to me? Do I lack madmen, that you have brought this fellow to play the madman in my presence?

Hostile, critical comments may be expressed in an ironic way such as saying "don't work too hard" to a lazy worker. The use of irony introduces an element of humour which may make the criticism seem more polite and less aggressive but understanding the subtlety of this usage requires second-order interpretation of the speaker's intentions
 
Back
Top