Live Foods

[coralife205]

Okay, my corn snake is about 1.5 years old. 2 months ago I was stupid..I fed my snake a live mouse...well. I didnt realise at the time that it would begin to cost so much money...a buck fifty adds up after a whle per meal..

I try feeding my snake frozen thawd mice...nothing happens. It ignores it. It will let that mouse sit there all day and it wont touch it...then the miniute you drop a live mouse in the cage..that snake has that mouse before it even hits the bottom of the feeding cage....

my qustion is...

Is it possible to switch this snake back to f/t foods? I dont want to starve it for a few weeks because wouldnt that cause health problems? I need suggestions please.

Thank You.

[courtney1121]

i had the same issue with mine and yes. it is possible. get a pair of feeding tongs and when your ready to feed your snake the f/t wiggle it in front of him so it looks alive. if you just throw a dead one in there he will most likely not touch it. but if you wiggle it around so looks alive he will probably eat. thats what i had to with my year and 1/2 and now i feed him f/t too. so yes it is possible.

[Chip]

I'd also add, start with fresh mice! Not something that has been in your freezer since last year. And get it good and warm, 100 to 105. I've had a few stubborn live feeding corns, but almost all will switch over. Even pre-killing the live mice is a step in the right direction. Good luck.

[Kuzco]

1st, your snake can go a month with out eating and you won't notice a difference in his appearance. So no, going several weeks is not unhealthy for him.

2nd its done all the time. I fed mine for about 4 years live mice until I finally got a place to put frozen mice (wife wasn't having it inside our freezer) and they all took to the f/t instantly. I just put on a glove (so it doesnt smell like me) hold the mouse by the tail and dangle it in front of them and they go for it every time.

Also how are you thawing your mice? I get the hottest water out of the tap and rinse them in a tub for a few minutes than run them under 90ish degree water and dry them. Not a problem yet.

It could also be that your snake is getting ready to shed and its nornak for them to not eat if that is the case.

[Fatman608]

The answer to your question is YES and the very nice people above have told you how to do it.

[coralife205]

ok thanks everyone!

[BNR34RB26DETT]

great thread.
my stubborn baby would refuse F/T so i have been feeding live. I am planning on switching to F/T in the future.
It is good to know that it can be done with ease.
thanks

[coralife205]

My next qustion is...How do I know when to get my snake a bigger cage...and what size will I need when fully grown adult? a 20 gallon long seems...confineing for a potentily 6 foot long snake.

[Lolo]

You didn't have an option for "both live & f/t," so I went ahead and voted live... most of my ball pythons eat strictly live, the Australian pythons take either, and all but one of the colubrids will happily eat f/t. Gets a little confusing on feeding days, LOL - although I've got it down pat now. ;)

Switching from live to frozen can be easy or tricky, depending on the particular snake. As I mentioned one of my corns will ONLY take live, and I've tried all the tricks for getting her to eat frozen. Guess some snakes are just pickier than others, and since I already feed live to the BPs, it doesn't really matter to me. Have you tried different types of prey (mice vs rats, etc), and "braining" them? It's kinda gross, but some snakes are enticed by a cut in the dead mouse's head... didn't work for my picky corn, though. Good luck!

[wstphal]

What is he living in now? I would plan on moving him to an inexpensive tub, they can be found in 31-34Q, 41Q (I thing it's right, anyway, around that) and 64Q. See if he really gets to 6 feet, most corns don't although some do. If he really gets that long he's going to need housing more like that of a 6 foot boa, something 4 feet x 2 feet. Snakemaster24 has a king rat, Jasmine, and I think he converted a 100G aquarium (that he probably got from somebody relatively cheap because it didn't hold water anymore). If you are handy, DIY cage building is definitely an option. Diligently searching CL & KS & Fauna may yield a used 4 x 2 cage for a reasonable price in the Detroit area if you have wheels and someone to help move it. But don't worry about it for a while until you see if yours is going to top out at 6 feet.

[Lolo]

My next qustion is...How do I know when to get my snake a bigger cage...and what size will I need when fully grown adult? a 20 gallon long seems...confineing for a potentily 6 foot long snake.

A basic rule of thumb is that the tank should be approx 1/2 the length of the snake... so for a 6ft snake, anything with a 3ft length should be fine. If I'm not mistaken a 20gal LONG is around 3ft, and it's what most people house adult corns in. I house mine in Sterilite tubs, and all but one adult are in 28qt tubs - Dash the 1100g beast is in a 41qt. :uhoh: I'm not sure what those equal in gallons, but I think the 28qt is around 15gal & the 41qt is slightly larger (but shorter) than a 20gal. Snakes really don't need much space, and most tend to feed better in a tight/secure environment.

[wstphal]

[thread hijack]Lolo, do the dogs & cats want to get into the act on feeding days? My cats are VERY interested in the mice, and one of them snagged a chick I was thawing and ate it, leaving the beak and a foot as evidence.[/thread hijack]

[wstphal]

I house mine in Sterilite tubs, and all but one adult are in 28qt tubs - Dash the 1100g beast is in a 41qt. :uhoh: I'm not sure what those equal in gallons, but I think the 28qt is around 15gal & the 41qt is slightly larger than a 20gal. Snakes really don't need much space!

There are 4Q to 1G so a 28Q is 7 gallons but has a lot of floor space because of the very low height compared to an aquarium, and 41Q is a 10G by volume.

[bapkate]

Here's a question along the original lines of the poll: has anyone ever run into a person who's fed live because it's cheaper to buy live rats/mice one-off than it is to buy f/t? I just met someone the other day who said she fed live because it was cheaper.

[Lolo]

[thread hijack]Lolo, do the dogs & cats want to get into the act on feeding days? My cats are VERY interested in the mice, and one of them snagged a chick I was thawing and ate it, leaving the beak and a foot as evidence.[/thread hijack]

I have to kick out the dog (into the living room) on feeding day, or he gets REALLY upset... he's some kind of herding breed, so his instinct is to protect & guard anything smaller than himself. Today I fed a live rat who squealed really really loudly, and I could hear my dog whimpering downstairs - actually made me kinda sad. :( It is helpful having him for runaways, though, since he'll corner the rodent and wait until I come get it. He has no interest in the frozen prey, nor do my cats aside from maybe a curious sniff.

The two older (10 & 13 year-old) cats don't even notice feedings, since they're too busy sleeping... the young one will sometimes watch and/or bat at the critter keeper, but is pretty good about keeping her distance. On live feeding days, I truly have the whole food chain represented here - LOL. :D

[Lolo]

Here's a question along the original lines of the poll: has anyone ever run into a person who's fed live because it's cheaper to buy live rats/mice one-off than it is to buy f/t? I just met someone the other day who said she fed live because it was cheaper.

Unless she's found the cheapest live supplier in the country, I think that's a bunch of baloney! Cost is the only reason I bother feeding f/t to those who'll eat it, since it saves money overall... I pay $1.50 for one live adult mouse (cheapest place within 10 miles), whereas a frozen mouse from RodentPro is $0.45 or $22.50 for a bag of 50. They do charge about $50 for shipping, but when you buy large quantities it's still cheaper than live. Plus Shiari & I have been splitting orders, since we live in the same area - shipping is fixed per order, so we save about $25 that way. :)

P.S. If you're only talking about one or two snakes, I guess feeding live COULD be cheaper... since you'd have to order a large bag of frozen to save money, and they might go bad before you use them all.

[Jenn_Tigercat]

F/t all the way. I don't like the idea of feeding live, more risks to my snakes then I am willing to take. Even when my male stopped eating completely I didn't do live. He got pre-killed and took those fine. Thankfully now he is back to F/T :)

[coralife205]

I have tryed doing things to the f/t mice to make them more apatizeing...shakeing them , makeing them look alive...hiting the snake in the nose, chaseing it...to smashng it until its guts start comeing out (gross i know), and it still refuses.. But the one thing that Ihave NOT tryed, is TIME. ill wait 3 weeks and try again.

[Blue Apple Herps]

Some snakes just won't take f/t, even corns. I have a 5 year old lavender female who won't eat live. Weird thing is she started off eating f/t, but at about a year of age abruptly stopped and hasn't since. I've tried all the tricks in the book - you name it, I've tried it.

At first I thought she was sick, turned out she just wanted live. Ever since she gets a live mouse during feeding time. She is my only corn who won't take f/t, but from my 1st hand experience, some just won't.

[WingedSweetheart]

There are also weird tricks of dipping the f/t mouse in chicken broth, tuna juice, or rubbing lizard tail on it to sent, or dirty mouse bedding (I suppose any rodent bedding would work). I've even heard of a person who had luck with rubbing the mouse with KFC fried chicken lol. Even car rides I've heard can help. So there are a lot of thing to try before you give up. :)

[bapkate]

Thanks, guys. I was pretty sure that live couldn't be cheaper in the long run.

[coralife205]

but guys you know what..feeding live has a very miminum risk to the snake...seriously, my snake atacks the live mouse sometimes instantly the moment it get droped in its feeding cage. the biggest "risk" i see is when the snake has the mouse surounded and it dident die instantly, and the mouse is fighting. he worst thing that can happen is the mouse scratches the snake...which is very unlikely.

[Sweetseraph]

You hit the nail on the head with time. Wait at least 2 weeks before offering the f/t and also leave it with the snake up to 24 hrs, preferably in a feeding bin. Place the feeding bin somewhere dark and quiet and don't bug him except for quick peeks occasionally to see if he ate yet. If he doesn't eat, wait 2 weeks again. Snakes can go a seriously long time without food without any harm. An adult snake should only be eating every 10-21 days anyways.

[wstphal]

Here's why I think f/t or p/k is best:

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44622&highlight=bitten+mouse

Sorry coralife. If you are dealing with a snake that will only eat live, once they are eating things better than pinks, be very careful. Mice have ~sharp~ teeth and will use them if the snake doesn't get a good hold on the mouse immediately.

[VickyChaiTea]

Feeding live is dangerous. There is no minimal risk to the snake, it is common for people to have their snake get injured or killed by a mouse/rat. It is also almost always avoidable. It is pretty uncommon to encounter a snake that will ONLY eat live prey.

Not to mention the fact that it's extremely painful to the food item, which are sometimes eaten alive.

[courtney1121]

Here's why I think f/t or p/k is best:

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=44622&highlight=bitten+mouse

Sorry coralife. If you are dealing with a snake that will only eat live, once they are eating things better than pinks, be very careful. Mice have ~sharp~ teeth and will use them if the snake doesn't get a good hold on the mouse immediately.


i recently started feeding my snake f/t for that exact reason! i didnt really think anything of it until he got bit and i switched immediately. he was fine but i didnt want to risk it again. he had to get used to it of course but he adjusted pretty quickly. but i strongly STRONGLY recommend f/t!!

[coralife205]

tell my snake that. not me.

[GSDlover]

I'm glad there are a lot of tips to switch over from live to F/T.
IMO he looked pretty thin, and he needed to eat pretty soon.
So we went live and he ate it within 20 minutes.
We even had to get a fuzzie since no where within like 20 miles had pinkies...

Will try to go back to f/t after another feeding or two.

[rich333]

all my babies eat f/t mice (4 corns). have since the day they came home. but my ball python refuses f/t. have tried several times to switch her over...even went 6 months without eating....and yes,she's been bitten by the rats she eats...so now...she only eats SMALL dark furred rats that are Waaaayy smaller that what she should/could handle....why?? because it was a medium sized white rat that bite her....i think she remembers the colors or the size...and will actually cower away from the prey item even when hungry. so she's been a bit of a challenge. she's at 1400 grams at 3yrs of age...Alot smaller than i think she should be. vet says she's fine otherwise...and says force feeding isnt really an option at this point.

[coralife205]

okay people I have a problem.

the last time i fed my snake was around thursday, september 16th...becasue im trying to 'starve' her to swiitch to f/t.

I started seeing those 'hips' and so i thought she could be obese... I asked my co worker at work (petsmart) and he said it could be constapated...He told me to soak it in warm water...well i just did it. and almost immedetly it let out a big stool about an inch and a half long...underwater, and it looked normel, except that it dident spread everywhere like it normaly would. it came out as one big, twisted chunk. ..thats obviously an entire mouse...the snake has been getting ready to shed these lsat few days...but still, it has been about 10 days and it has not fully digested yet until i just 'forced' or 'helped' it too??????

am i mistaken in thinking there is something wrong????? cause i thought snakes digest in a 5 day period...and this last mouse, you could still see the lump after 2 days...it has eaten mice about that same size for a few months with out any problems before...at least i think..

[Sweetseraph]

If digestion seems to have slowed down, I would double check that your temps are where they should be. That poop could have been from the last several mice if she hasn't gone lately. It can take a couple weeks for them to digest completely and poop. The meal was rather large for her, so dropping down a size would be advisable.

[coralife205]

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6075.jpg

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6074.jpg

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http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6070.jpg

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http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6067.jpg

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http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6065.jpg

[coralife205]

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6064.jpg

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6063.jpg

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6062.jpg

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6061.jpg

http://i387.photobucket.com/albums/oo313/coralife205/Corn%20Snake/IMG_6059.jpg

[coralife205]

what size food to feed it and is it obese..

[Chip]

Looks okay from the many pics. I'd go with weanling sized mice or large hoppers.