Bloated and blue. Is this serious?

[James673]

I have a young Ghost Motley. He looks somewhat bloated and he looks bluer than normal. Where he is bloated, his scales look stretched and I think I can see the skin between the scales. The bloating starts about halfway and ends right at the cloaca. He seems bluer than normal in the same area. I don't see any particularly dark areas on his ventral, just a slight even discoloration. he kind of looks like he ate a large meal, but he has gotten bigger since his last feeding. he weighs 16 grams and he last ate a 3 gram (at most 4 grams) pinky on the 15th.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7022/6540541585_a863916f62_z.jpg
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7175/6540540425_951fea6ffb_z.jpg
This is the best picture I could get of his ventral:
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7020/6540543773_8fdee9b129_z.jpg

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[Shiari]

He needs to be seen by the vet soon as you can. That could be any number of things: impaction, abscess, tumor, or even crypto.

[Holly12]

Wow yeah a vet is what he needs to see right away like Shiari said it could be anything and it is better to be safe then sorry sorry to see he is not feeling well. :(

[James673]

Thanks for the Quick reply! I now feel a little less silly for having an appointment for 10 AM tomorrow. By crypto, do you mean cryptosporidium?

[Shiari]

Yes, I do. One of the common symptoms of it is a bloated stomach that makes the snake look like it's just recently eaten.

[James673]

I took him to the vet. Fortunately, on the way over he gave us a nice fresh poop, so they were able to look at that. They said it looked like an infection of spore forming bacteria, probably Clostridium. They gave me a regiment of Metronidazole to be administered orally. Anybody have recommendations for techniques to administer oral medicine to small squirmy worms?

[SteveP]

Anybody have recommendations for techniques to administer oral medicine to small squirmy worms?

James I am so sorry to laugh at you but...:roflmao: I have no sugestions but have been following this since last night. I could tell you a million way to give meds to horses and cows and goats and sheep and pretty much anything that would wiegh 20lbs or more but am lost after that. Sooooooo glad to hear it wasn't something more serious and youhave some light at the end f the tunnel here.

Steve

[James673]

Steve, you should have seen me torturing the little worm for the last twenty minutes. he was very tolerant of the torture, I just could not figure out how to get the medicine in him. If I had a third hand, it would be easy. Restrain the snake with one hand, open his mouth with another hand and then with another hand, squirt the medicine down the throat. I ended up just patiently putting drops of medicine on his snout and he would dutifully swallow it. My technique and/or equipment needs refinement.

[ceduke]

I'm glad you found a way to get his meds into him. I had to give oral meds to my Indigo once and it was NOT EASY. He wouldn't even take them in food. >.<

[James673]

Update time! I gave him his second dose yesterday. He looks much less bloated and his color has improved. If anybody is interested in pictures I can post more.
However, I still don't have a good technique for getting his meds into him. Fortunately, he seems to tolerate the torture very well.

[Sierra1167]

Glad to hear he is doing better!

[SnakeAround]

Can you get a very thin straw somewhere? You could suck the meds in it, somehow bend the straw or pinch it to keep the fluid from getting out, pushing/rolling the other end into his mouth and then release the fluid?

[Sierra1167]

You may try syringes. I use them to give meds and vitamins to cranky dragons sometimes. You can get needleless syringes from most pharmacies for less than a dollar. It makes it easy to measure the meds and if you get the smallest ones the tip is very small.

[SnakeAround]

You'd have to push the syringe further into the throat, not sue if even the smallest would fit since the thicker part is gonna be in the mouth

[Sierra1167]

Hmmm...I am not sure then. It may not work after all, but thought it may be worth a try. I know the ones I have are very small. Even the barrel is smaller in diameter than a pencil.

[SnakeAround]

Maybe it is not ideal, but it might work faster than your dripping method.

[kaypar2011]

Syringes for insulin injections are very small, you can get them from a pharmacy.

[James673]

I have a teeny tiny syringe that I have been using to measure and administer his medicine. The syringe goes up to One milliliter max, and his dosage is 0.05 mL every two days for fourteen days. And the dripping method is what I use WITH the syringe. I will put one drop on his snout, let him suck it down, put another, let him suck that down and repeat about a dozen times.
Fortunately, I think if I can mange to get the medicine INTO his mouth he will go ahead and suck it down on his own. I managed to squirt about half of the medicine directly into his mouth the last time and he went ahead and swallowed it. Since the medicine is mixed with what seems to be maple syrup, I think he doesn't have much problem swallowing it. The biggest problem has been just getting his mouth open and keeping it open more than a femtosecond.
If I restrain him with one hand, holding his head securely, then I can use a toothpick to open his jaw with my other hand. Unfortunately, the syringe just does not work like the toothpick and getting it in the right position to BOTH open his jaw and depress the plunger requires some serious twisting of my fingers. I found a small flexible tube that I am going to modify and try using it next time. For future reference: Two people would make this much easier. I may have to break down and find a third hand.

Another question: When do you think he can be fed? His last pinky was December 15.

[Susan]

Getting a set of metal feeding tubes is on my list of "needs" that every snake owner should have. They come in a wide variety of sizes to fit all size snakes, have a rounded ball tip to prevent injury to the inside of the snake's mouth and throat, fit onto the end of a syringe and has made administering oral medications much much easier so a single person can use them with a little practice. They come in straight and curved, I prefer the straight for snakes.

http://www.kimani.com.au/Images/straight_crop_needles.jpg

They may be slightly difficult to find, but have found a few sources for some curved and straight ones...they use them for hand-feeding baby birds (parrots, macaws, etc). A good pet shop that deals with large exotic birds might have them in stock without having to order on-line. Searching "feeding needles" and "crop needles" gave me the best results. Here are some links:

Cage'N Bird (http://stores.cagenbird.com/-strse-106/Stainless-Steel-Curved-Feeding/Detail.bok)
E&R Exotic Birds and Supplies (http://www.stuff4birds.com/cropneed.htm)
Foy's Petr Supplies (http://www.foyspigeonsupplies.com/catalog/1402-1408.html)
Just Bird Stuff (http://www.justbirdstuff.com/Crop-Needles-p-16506.html)

[SnakeAround]

I use a tooth pic or q-tip to open the mouth, leave it there cause usually the jaws pinch it anyway, and take the syringe which can then be put into the mouth, and with a little movement most of the time the tooth pic or such can be thrown out sideways.

[schnebbles]

Too bad you don't have one of the feeding tubes Kathy Love sells with the feeding kits. That would be perfect. I used it to give my snake nutribac.

Those tips Susan listed look nice too.

[James673]

Final Update! Just to wrap this thread up. I finally got the hang of medicating him (kinda sorta) based on suggestions here. I definitely need to consider the feeding tubes Susan recommended. He looks and behaves normally and is eating his pinkies very well. He has finished his course of antibiotics and has had a very good shed.

Thank you all for your advice and support!

[Sierra1167]

So glad to hear he is doing better! Thanks for the update!