Something's wrong

[newbie319]

Hi everybody, I've had quite a bit of help from everybody on here, and have another issue I really hope you can help me with. I have a May 2012 hatchling that I've had since July. I've had issues with her feeding in the past but she's been doing great since.

Ok here's the problem. I fed her a half of pinky (that seems to be all that shes able to keep down) on Tuesday Oct. 9. She's pooped numerous times since then so I held her yesterday but noticed she still had a bulge so immediately put her back. Well today I got her out for a bit and she just layed on my lap. She's usually very calm so at first I thought nothing of it. But after examining her more she still has a good size lump in the middle of her body, and she's very limp. She's moved her head some but other than that she won't move around. I know I should have been more perceptive to her and her actions. I just thought she was getting ready to shed, and that's why the low activity level. Well, she's almost so limp when I picked her up, and I really think something is seriously wrong and I've read and read and read. Can't find out anything that could be the cause of this.

Does anybody have any ideas why after 8 days and numerous poos she's still got a lump? And why the no activity or hardly any movement? I'm scared I'm gonna lose her.

Please help

[OCsnakeman]

A few questions...

1. What are your warm side/cool side temps? Have you made sure they are 80-85 on hot side?

2. What kind of substrate do you have your animal on? is Impaction a possibility?

3. Do you have any pictures? They speak a thousand words, especially with all the pros on here who could help you with a visual. ( I am NOT as good at this stuff as they are )

4. Have you tried a room temp bath? sometimes the water will loosen things up a bit.

Just a few thoughts. I know someone here can help you!

OC

[newbie319]

I have her in the top tub of a 4 tub snake rack. Her hot side fluctuates between 85-89(outside the tub) on top of the heat tape. Her cool side right around 78 (inside the tub). She is on newspaper, had her on aspen when first got her but newspaper seemed better for now(I can find her easier). I will get a pic of her now and try to upload it. Never uploaded a pic on here before! Thank you, I will try the warm bath. And I hope it's nothing serious, she just seems so out of it and don't care about anything around her. :(

[OCsnakeman]

It might just be my preference, but I prefer to keep them on 80-85 on hot side. I look forward to seeing your photos.

[URL="http://http://www.shrinkpictures.com"] - A very useful tool for photo uploading.

[starsevol]

I hate to be the one who brings this up, but the mid body swelling really has me concerned.
Plus you mentioned that she can only keep down half a pinky which tells me that she has regurged in the past.
All I can think of is the possibility of crypto.
Crypto is fatal and contagious.
Where did you get her?

[newbie319]

:cry:She just passed in my hands, was barely moving and then her head just went limp......I would still like to know what maybe caused it. Thanks for your replies. I don't think I will do babies any more, matter of fact, no more snakes for awhile. :'(

[newbie319]

Reptmart....I got her before I found all you guys and had no IDEA of reptmart and what everybody thought.

What is crypto and would it affect my garter snake? He's in an aquarium separate from where she was but she was in that tank before(even though I washed it with bleach and water) and the rack system is right next to the aquarium stand.

[starsevol]

:cry:She just passed in my hands, was barely moving and then her head just went limp......I would still like to know what maybe caused it. Thanks for your replies. I don't think I will do babies any more, matter of fact, no more snakes for awhile. :'(

OMG I am so sorry.
I have never dealt with crypto, so I don't know how much help I can be...but before you get another snake please research what needs to be done if a crypto positive animal was in your house before.
This is heartbreaking enough.....and I would hate for it to happen again.

Where did this little girlie come from?
If this was crypto that killed her, there is a good chance that other snakes from the same place are infected as well.

[starsevol]

Reptmart....I got her before I found all you guys and had no IDEA of reptmart and what everybody thought.

What is crypto and would it affect my garter snake? He's in an aquarium separate from where she was but she was in that tank before(even though I washed it with bleach and water) and the rack system is right next to the aquarium stand.

From what I can remember, bleach does not kill crypto. I don'lt know if gartersnakes can get it either....
Please do a search on it and it will help fill in the blanks.
Just from her symptoms it does sound like crypto is a possibility.

[Floof]

I'm so sorry for your loss! :( I agree--symptoms point to crypto or at least something similar.. Can you get a necropsy done by a local reptile vet? They can do tests for crypto and, hopefully, find the cause of death... Just make sure you refrigerate her until you can get her to the vet if you decide to do the necropsy. Don't freeze her or leave her at room temperature. I'm thinking a necropsy is your best chance at finding out exactly what happened... Especially since you do have another snake in the house (which, I'd be willing to bet crytpo IS contagious to garters).

[newbie319]

I would also like to know, but funds to do that aren't available. I will pay close attention to my garter. Is there any signs that I should watch for? He's as hyper as can be, eating well, and very alert.

As for her, she just started showing that something was wrong the past 2 days. I took her inactiveness as she was getting ready to shed, it never occured something could be wrong. She was always so calm since I got her. As for only eating half a pinky, a whole pinky seemed to big. She had trouble getting them down as a whole, and even regurged once. So I thought I'd play it safe and feed her what she could easily take.

As for the snake rack she was in, she was in the top tub. How do I go about disinfecting it? I just bought the rack brand new, I'll post the link below. Am I able to get another snake or should I wait a certain amount of time. I don't want to go through this again. I only had her a couple months and once I realized she died as I was trying to take a pic, I just broke down in tears.
Here's the link to the rack system I recently bought.


http://www.reptilebasics.com/iris-sweaterbox-rack-32-qt-belly-or-back-heat

[OCsnakeman]

So sorry to hear that she passed!

I was hoping it wasn't disease, but Crypto definately seems to fit. I would let the store know, so they can check their animals. Many of the mass-sales stores don't keep them the way they should. I am very sorry for your loss!

OC :(

[newbie319]

Thank you all for trying to help, looks like I asked for help too late :( I will try to let Reptmart know, but since I have no proof on that was what it was, I don't know how serious they will take me. The more I read about it, the more I put 2 and 2 together. She had most the symptoms and I didn't even know it.

I know I shouldn't beat myself up for it and that there was nothing I could've done to fix her, I still feel so horrible for not noticing. I held her everyday!

It sucks I learned about it this way, but I'm happy I did so I can be more careful in the future, and be sure I quaritine any other snakes I do get. I love snakes and can't let this one death stop me from enjoying my hobby.

Speaking of which, when will it be safe to get another snake? I found on a site to use hydrogen peroxide not diluted, spray the surface and let it air dry, not to wipe it down. What's the chances of the next snake getting it, if I use a new tub that she wasn't in?
Don't worry, I'm not going to go out and buy a new snake right away, just for future reference.

[Floof]

Do a search for Kokopelli's threads regarding Crypto. He has been dealing with crypto in his collection, and has been kind enough to document the progress and some of what he's learned about this parasite in the General section here on CS.

Symptoms include, IIRC, regurgitation, refusal to feed, diarrhea (often mucousy), rapid weight loss, and mid-body swelling like you saw in your baby.

Considering the circumstances, if you can get together the money to afford it (or, heck, see what you do have and talk to the vet to see what they can do to help you afford it), a necropsy would be about the only way you'll be able to get a real answer...

As far as disinfecting, I'd chuck the tub she was living in and disinfect the rest of the rack. IIRC, ammonia cleaner (there's some certain percentage and amount of time that it needs to sit that I'm not privvy to) or steam cleaning (again, a certain amount of time it takes) are two ways to kill crypto on solid surfaces. There's more info on how to disinfect properly on Kokopelli's threads if you do a search.

Again, so very sorry for your loss... If it was crypto, I sincerely hope it didn't spread to your garter!

[newbie319]

Thank you for your replies. And I didn't realize how attached to her I was until well...you know. I keep tearing up like a child..lol. And I will do a search and read everything I can.

I'm going to school for vet tech and one of my classmates works for a vet that deals in exotics and is going to find out some information for me. It's an online school, so it's not like I can just take her to this vet. It's in another state :( But she's going to find out more about this crypto.

Again, thank you for your help. It's nice knowing there are people out there that care :)

[newbie319]

All his threads were very educating and interesting but at the same time depressing. He went through so much because of crypto. Thank you for pointing me in that direction, I read alot of his threads and plan to continue searching and reading.

I thought losing one snake was bad, he lost his entire collection almost. :(

Thanks again:)

[HermesMom]

:cry:She just passed in my hands, was barely moving and then her head just went limp......I would still like to know what maybe caused it. Thanks for your replies. I don't think I will do babies any more, matter of fact, no more snakes for awhile. :'(

I am so very sorry for your loss.

[newbie319]

Thank you :) It sucks and I'm still tearing up, but that's ok. I learned something new, and now I know what to watch for :'(

[Floof]

There's no shame in crying over a lost pet. I lost my bearded dragon recently, and cried like a baby! Again, I'm so sorry for your loss... It's so difficult to go through something like that, especially knowing it might be something as devastating as crypto. :(

[newbie319]

Yea, that's what scares me. I never even heard of crypto, even though I researched snakes tons before I actually got one. I will be more careful in the future about where I get the snakes from and definitely keep them separate for a long while from any other snakes!

[Campitor]

Sorrry for your loss newbie. Anytime something like that happens it's hard. They become part of your family if only for a short time.

[DragonsDenSerpents]

So sorry for your loss. :( My first thought was crypto from your initial post and I do hope we're all wrong. Hoping your other snakes are doing well!

[newbie319]

Thank you everybody! And yes, so far my eastern ribbon snake is just the same old hyper guy that he's always been. He looks good, been eating, and very active. I think if it was crypto, he would be somewhat showing signs. I'm keeping my fingers crossed he lives with me for a very long time :) Again thank you everybody, it's nice having people who loves snakes (and other scaly pets) as much as I do!