I can't get our little carpet to eat

[Jenstet]

I'll try to keep this short:)
We've had him for three weeks now and he hasn't eaten for us yet. We left him for a week to settle in but handled him a few times last week. We've tried to feed him 3 times .
The first in a bin. He seemed stressed just being in the bin and had no interest in the fuzzy. After that we have been trying to feed him in his viv.
The second we wiggled it in front of him when he was out for the night. He struck once but I think he was just irritated we were wiggling a mouse in front of him.
The third we slit the head of the fuzzy and while he flicked on the cut and I felt he was going to do something exciting he eventually backed off.

I weighed him when we first got him and he was 49 grams. He's 6 months old. He last ate for the breeder on January 1st. He lives in a 20 gallon long. A UTH on a thermostat set at 90. He has a basking light that gets to 90-92 in the hot spot. The ambient temp on the hot side is 80. On the cool side is 73. He never goes into the hides though. His humidity is between 35-50%. I spray 3 times a week to try to keep it up. He does have a big water dish to splash around in.

My big concern is that he is going to slowly deteriorate. Will he eventually get hungry and eat? How long can a little guy go without eating?

We have decided to stop handling him until he eats for us. Handling him is a process as he is pretty nippy. I think the handling adds to his stress.
I'm going back and forth between wanting to try harder to get him to eat and letting him have some space to adjust.
Our corn snake is so easy to feed and jungle carpets are known for being good eaters. I'm a little stumped.

[TheFrogman]

I wouldn't try to feed him every night, back off for a few days, like 3.

Dangle the fuzzy in front of his nose then move it away about 2 inches, keep doing that and see if it gets his interest. I learned this technique from Brian from snake bytes TV and it works.

If he struck at it once I would not give up, sometimes my Corn takes 15 minutes to get him interested., ya know, tease him a little.....patience and he should eat.

The handling defiantly adds stress

Good Luck.

[Joba]

http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=28342

Here's a thread that may help you. Lots of techniques you can try, but don't let it worry you, if possible. I have a young dumerils boa that goes on long hunger strikes; he last ate on November 28th. Last year he went four months w/o eating.

It may still be an adjustment for your guy, or it may be that he's a picky eater, and you may have to find the right combination of tricks to get him to eat, and even then it may only be occasionally, like my guy.

Personally, I would cover his cage and leave him alone for another week and then try feeding again. The last thing you want to do is add food to the list of things that stress him out. Ultimately, he may need to feed live. He may need to be left alone with the prey. You just need to be patient and keep trying different methods until you find what works. Good luck and keep us posted.

[Nanci]

Contact MysticExotics (Heather) here. She's our carpet expert.

[daddio207]

He lives in a 20 gallon long.
He has a basking light


These are the 2 things that stick out to me.

The size of the tank is too large causing him to be stressed.
Basking lights also cause stress.

:)

[Jenstet]

I will try to get in touch with Heather. thanks.

How does one provide a hot spot for a python without a lamp? He doesn't use hides and is always in the vines. It has a ceramic bulb if that makes a difference. I have wondered if the size of the tank is an issue.

I will try some of the scenting techniques.

Some other advice I received was to cover the sides of his tank with paper to get it darker for him. That may along the lines of what Joba means by covering the cage.

This is going to take some doing but I feel good knowing that he has been eating for a few months so he should be able to do it again.

[Nanci]

I sent Heather a PM.

[Jenstet]

thank you nanci :)

[Joba]

Some other advice I received was to cover the sides of his tank with paper to get it darker for him. That may along the lines of what Joba means by covering the cage.

Sort of. I eventually took my guy in to the vet and he had me completely cover Dexter's cage so he'd feel safe and relaxed. First, he even had me put Dexter into a small rubbermaid, shoebox sized container, and put that inside his cage, completely covered.

How was your snake living prior to you acquiring him? A small, dark, tub, most likely; that might be just what he needs right now to feel safe.

Just passing along that experience. I'd check with Heather first.

[daddio207]

It has a ceramic bulb if that makes a difference. I have wondered if the size of the tank is an issue.

The ceramic bulb is fine in a 20L. You posted heat light not lamp so assumed it was a white light.

It sounds like a stress problem to me.
A small snuggly tank or tub with hides would help with that. When a snake that has been eating regularly then stops when getting a new home, it's almost always a stress issue. At 49g you got time to correct the stress issue, what ever it is, with no worries for a while. :)

[Jenstet]

He came from a one of those plastic shoebox rack systems. From the basement of a childless house :)
I also have a 10 gallon tank I could use.
I'll wait to hear from Heather but I think that a smaller enclosure makes a lot of sense.

[insomniac101]

I agree that he is probably stressed by going from a small rack tub to the 20-gallon tank. Try setting him up in a smaller tub, similar to what the breeder had. As others have mentioned, he needs to feel safe to eat.

Also, are you feeding rat pinks, or mice? Some carpets are very difficult to get feeding on rats - I've got a couple in my collection like that.

Kathy

[Joba]

Kathy::-offtopic

12.10 Cornsnakes, 8.5 Ratsnakes, 5.7 Carpet pythons, 2.3.6 Chondros, 1.1 Ball pythons, 0.1 Hog Isle boa

Now I understand the "Insomniac" label! Holy Cow!

[MysticExotics]

Just to clarify. You have had him three weeks. You left him alone for a week, then tried feeding three times in the past two weeks? You have a UTH AND a heat lamp?
What was the breeder feeding the snake? Did you offer the same type of prey he was used to or did you try feeding something different?
1) get rid of the heat lamp-that's too much heat
2) stop misting, they do not need it.
Have you contacted the breeder you got him from?
Do not try harder to get him to eat, you will just stress him out even more.
It won't hurt him to miss a couple meals. Leave him a lone for at least a week.
Do not offer food more often than every 7-10 days, at minimum. You could stretch it out to every two weeks, to make him hungry.
Cease handling him any more than necessary until he is eating for you.
Babies tend to be bitey, because they think you are trying to eat them. As they grow, they usually grow out of it.
You may need to move him to a smaller enclosure.
You may also need to just leave the food for him overnight. I have a couple that will not eat while I am in the room. They wait until I leave the room and shut off the light before they eat.

[MysticExotics]

I agree that he is probably stressed by going from a small rack tub to the 20-gallon tank. Try setting him up in a smaller tub, similar to what the breeder had. As others have mentioned, he needs to feel safe to eat.

Also, are you feeding rat pinks, or mice? Some carpets are very difficult to get feeding on rats - I've got a couple in my collection like that.

Kathy

Kathy::-offtopic

12.10 Cornsnakes, 8.5 Ratsnakes, 5.7 Carpet pythons, 2.3.6 Chondros, 1.1 Ball pythons, 0.1 Hog Isle boa

Now I understand the "Insomniac" label! Holy Cow!
I think that is a valid question, that could be part of the problem.

[MysticExotics]

Is the tank in a busy part of the house? If so, move him to a more quiet area, to reduce the stress.

[Jenstet]

First, thank you for taking the time. I sincerely appreciate the help.

Yes, I have both a UTH and a ceramic heat emitting bulb. If I remove the bulb the tank will go down to 73 ish degrees except for in the hide. This is okay? I thought he needed a hot basking spot. He hangs out under the bulb a lot in the evenings and has never gone into either of the hides I have for him. I'm guessing he will just find the heat he needs like any snake would.

I'm using the mice she gave me. She was feeding him 2-3 fuzzys once a week. BUT..I am almost out and there is an expo this weekend so I can pick up whatever you think I need.

He is set up in a low traffic area. I should say the lowest traffic area in our house.

All the other info you restated is correct. When we picked him up I went over everything I had for him and the only thing she questioned was the UTH. She seemed to think it wasn't necessary. She kept her adults in tanks with big red basking lights on them. This guy was in a rack and she kept the heat in the room cranked up. That was where I got the misting from as well. I had read it wasn't necessary but was just doing what was suggested. I have been in contact with her twice since we got him and she seemed to think he would just start eating on his own. He just needed time. She didn't have any specific advice for me just to wait out the "adjustment period". She did offer to exchange him for another but that wasn't really what we were looking to do. I will see her at the expo this weekend and see what she thinks as well.

okay, so here is the plan.
-move him into a 10 gallon tank with just a UTH set at 90 on the thermostat. no heat lamp.
-leave him for a week, no handling, no feeding attempts.
-after that week try again? and then only try every two weeks.
-handle him minimally (for cleaning purposes if need be) until he starts eating.

If I am using only a UTH I can also cover the tank to keep it dark. Do you recommend this?

As for the feeding, we will just do the dangle and if he doesn't go for it I'll leave it in there overnight. I think I'll put him on newspaper in the 10 gallon so there are no substrate mishaps.

anything here I need to change or may have misunderstood?

I should add that we had been handling him a lot after that initial week. Every other day or so. We were initially more concerned with getting him easier to handle than any feeding issues. We've obviously made some mistakes here.

[Nanci]

You can cover the sides of his viv with brown paper (if covering is what the experts recommend). I know for nervous BPs, it works to cover all the sides and then just gradually remove the paper little by little.

It might be confusing when you call the heat emitter a bulb. The common term for them is CHE.

[Jenstet]

ahhhh
I wasn't sure what to call it :)
It's a 60 watt if that makes a difference.

[daddio207]

I saw that you are in NH (I'm in Maine) which is why I understood the need of the ceramic heater and misting.
In general.....
Using the ceramic heater for the cooler months is ok if that's the only way to get the temps right.
Misting is ok to get the humidity up as long as your misting away from the snake.
Those are the two easiest ways to keep the heat and humidity correct without raising the room temp and running a humidifier in New England.
I think that going to paper in a ten gallon is going to create a temp and humidity control issue also. Hopefully by switching to the 10 gallon, there won't be a need for the ceramic heater but if you need it then use it.
I agree with all the advice in general but what applies in southern or west coast states doesn't necessarily apply in New England and visa versa when it pertains to heat and humidity. :)

[Jenstet]

Daddio,
I appreciate your comments.
We also heat entirely with wood during the winter months so that can be drying. I have a thick piece of vinyl that covers 80% of the top of the viv to try to keep the moisture in and help a little with heat retention. I suspected that we wouldn't need the CHE in the summer. We have older windows so we have moved the snakes away from the windows because it can get cold.
Maybe a smaller tank will be easier to heat. I'll have to think some more on the substrate. You make a good point about the humidity.
I have a soccer mom friend whose kids have balls pythons and they have gotten rid of any kind of from the top heat source because they were having issues with bad sheds. They only have a UTH. She showed me how she dumps water into the substrate everyday to keep the humidity up and keeps syran wrap over the top all the time. To be clear, I'm not doing that but that's how she handles the humidity issues she has.

[MysticExotics]

First, thank you for taking the time. I sincerely appreciate the help.

Yes, I have both a UTH and a ceramic heat emitting bulb. If I remove the bulb the tank will go down to 73 ish degrees except for in the hide. This is okay? I thought he needed a hot basking spot. He hangs out under the bulb a lot in the evenings and has never gone into either of the hides I have for him. I'm guessing he will just find the heat he needs like any snake would.

I'm using the mice she gave me. She was feeding him 2-3 fuzzys once a week. BUT..I am almost out and there is an expo this weekend so I can pick up whatever you think I need.

He is set up in a low traffic area. I should say the lowest traffic area in our house.

All the other info you restated is correct. When we picked him up I went over everything I had for him and the only thing she questioned was the UTH. She seemed to think it wasn't necessary. She kept her adults in tanks with big red basking lights on them. This guy was in a rack and she kept the heat in the room cranked up. That was where I got the misting from as well. I had read it wasn't necessary but was just doing what was suggested. I have been in contact with her twice since we got him and she seemed to think he would just start eating on his own. He just needed time. She didn't have any specific advice for me just to wait out the "adjustment period". She did offer to exchange him for another but that wasn't really what we were looking to do. I will see her at the expo this weekend and see what she thinks as well.

okay, so here is the plan.
-move him into a 10 gallon tank with just a UTH set at 90 on the thermostat. no heat lamp.
-leave him for a week, no handling, no feeding attempts.
-after that week try again? and then only try every two weeks.
-handle him minimally (for cleaning purposes if need be) until he starts eating.

If I am using only a UTH I can also cover the tank to keep it dark. Do you recommend this?

As for the feeding, we will just do the dangle and if he doesn't go for it I'll leave it in there overnight. I think I'll put him on newspaper in the 10 gallon so there are no substrate mishaps.

anything here I need to change or may have misunderstood?

I should add that we had been handling him a lot after that initial week. Every other day or so. We were initially more concerned with getting him easier to handle than any feeding issues. We've obviously made some mistakes here.
The temps are too hot. 90 is way too hot and is likely part of the reason for refusal to eat. No higher than 86 in the hot spot.
In a 10 gallon tank, a UTH (that takes up about *no more than* 30% of the tank) should be good. The space of the 20 gallon may need additional heat (CHE) to get the warm end to 84-86 temp range. (But that too, needs to be on a t-stat. Any heat source needs to be on a t-stat.)
I have ambient heat in my snake room, with a dual t-stat (one is a back up for the other one).

I have only been keeping Carpet Pythons for four years, but I have gained my knowledge from others who have been doing this for a lot longer. My boyfriend, Howard Redding, has been keeping Carpets for 19 years.

There is no need for regular misting, no matter where you live. If the area you are in gets really dry, and your Carpet has trouble shedding, then misting during a shed cycle is fine. I would let him go through a shed cycle, and see how it goes.

Edit to add: As long as the snake is properly hydrated, (fresh water in the cage) the only time additional moisture might be needed in drier climates is during a shed cycle, if they tend to have problems shedding.

Sounds like he needs to be bumped up in prey size. I would offer a hopper. My boyfriend starts his hatchlings off on hoppers. Carpets can handle bigger prey, they are not like Corns.

I do not think it is necessary to exchange him, just make a few adjustments, and I think he will be fine.

I would reduce the amount of handling to a minimum, at least until he is eating regularly for you.

With the reduction in heat and in handling, try offering food once a week. If he still refuses, extend it out to every two weeks in offering.
Also watch for shed process. Many of mine refuse to eat when they're in, or about to go into shed.

You can switch to newspaper for the time being, if you're worried about substrate ingestion. I use newspaper for some of mine.
(What substrate do you currently use? I looked, but I'm not seeing where you wrote it.)

[Jenstet]

I don't think I mentioned the substrate.
We ended up getting Repti Bark. Then I read some reviews of snakes getting splinters from it. The breeder recommended Eco-Earth and we were thinking of switching at the next cage clean. The repti bark seems really rough and chunky. I looked at the Eco-Earth and it seems a little nicer on the belly but I pick up a musty odor from the bags. What do you think?

Yikes, our temps are really off. I will fix that right away and get the smaller tank ready for him ASAP.
He has a giant water dish that I've seen him take a dip in so I think he can get what he needs as far as humidity.

Thank you everyone for helping me get this straightened out. I truly felt I had done my research but what I'm doing is not working well for this guy. I'll be sure to keep you posted.

[MysticExotics]

Aspen is fine for substrate. I use paper towels for my babies, have used aspen, and I do use newspaper for some of mine. I only use Eco Earth in some of my gecko cages. I do not like it for snakes.

You're on the right track. No one knows everything. There is always something new to learn, not matter how long you have been doing this.

You forgot one thing....where's the pics of him?? :)

[daddio207]

There is no need for regular misting, no matter where you live.

You can switch to newspaper for the time being, if you're worried about substrate ingestion.

My house's humidity is in the single digits to the teens without use of a humidifier. I use a fogger in my reptile room just to get it to 30 to 40%
In the Northwest and Southeast states, humidity is usually a non-issue. In New England where the humidity inside the house could be 0-15% then it is prudent to get it up to a minimum of 30-35% and if misting the tank or tub is the only way to do it then it is necessary.
My comment on misting was not to disagree with your expertize in carpet pythons, only to give a New Englanders point of view on the extremely low humidity issues we have here this time of year.

My concern with using newspaper was mainly that the ambient temp could not be raised enough. The UTH thermostat will be set to a safe temp for the snake to lay on it if he crawls under the paper but the paper will cause enough of a barrier to keep the tanks ambient temp from rising high enough. Heat escapes thru aspen much easier raising the ambient temp. That was my thoughts on paper in her situation.



:cheers:

[Jenstet]

Here he is looking very approachable when we first got him home.

[Joba]

just throwing this out there and if it's already been addressed, forgive me, but when you said he was soaking, could mites be an issue? It happens, and it could affect his desire to eat also. Probably (hopefully) a long shot, but just to cover all the bases. BTW, he's a very handsome little fella.

[Jenstet]

The first day we brought him home he dove into the water dish and didn't come out until the next day. I got a little panicky because I read exactly what you suggested which is that it could be mites. I inspected him carefully before we brought him home and he didn't appear to have any. I also read they are good at hiding so what I did was.....my husband thinks I'm crazy......I strained the water he was soaking in through a white paper towel and we looked at it through a magnifying glass. I figured he would have drowned a few after all that time. I didn't see any mites. He has not soaked like he did the first day. I think it was his way of hiding. A week later during our first attempt at feeding we tried him in a bin lined with paper towel. I also checked then to be sure. I was guessing he may leave a few behind if he had them. I saw nothing.
That was also in my first call to the breeder. I asked her if she was dealing with mites. She said no....

I don't know if my method means for sure that he doesn't have them. I have never actually seen mites on a snake but I still haven't seen any indication of parasites.

[MysticExotics]

My house's humidity is in the single digits to the teens without use of a humidifier. I use a fogger in my reptile room just to get it to 30 to 40%
In the Northwest and Southeast states, humidity is usually a non-issue. In New England where the humidity inside the house could be 0-15% then it is prudent to get it up to a minimum of 30-35% and if misting the tank or tub is the only way to do it then it is necessary.
My comment on misting was not to disagree with your expertize in carpet pythons, only to give a New Englanders point of view on the extremely low humidity issues we have here this time of year.

My concern with using newspaper was mainly that the ambient temp could not be raised enough. The UTH thermostat will be set to a safe temp for the snake to lay on it if he crawls under the paper but the paper will cause enough of a barrier to keep the tanks ambient temp from rising high enough. Heat escapes thru aspen much easier raising the ambient temp. That was my thoughts on paper in her situation.

:cheers:
The only time they need the humidity is during the shed process if they are properly hydrated. I am well aware of the different areas that have different humidity, and have lived in a couple of them. If you are in an area that is drier, or during the winter depending on the kind of heat you use, if the snake has problems during the shed process, then yes, you would mist *during the shed process*, but it is not necessary to mist them on a regular basis when they are not in shed. That was my point.

The newspaper is not going to make that much of a difference in temps as opposed to aspen, unless you're using a thick stack of it.
Even with ambient temps, mine hide under the paper while digesting their food. That is when it is important for them to have the heat.

If the ambient temps are that cold, then possibly a second heat source (in addition, also on a t-stat) may be necessary.


Here he is looking very approachable when we first got him home.
He is a pretty little Jungle!

The first day we brought him home he dove into the water dish and didn't come out until the next day. I got a little panicky because I read exactly what you suggested which is that it could be mites. I inspected him carefully before we brought him home and he didn't appear to have any. I also read they are good at hiding so what I did was.....my husband thinks I'm crazy......I strained the water he was soaking in through a white paper towel and we looked at it through a magnifying glass. I figured he would have drowned a few after all that time. I didn't see any mites. He has not soaked like he did the first day. I think it was his way of hiding. A week later during our first attempt at feeding we tried him in a bin lined with paper towel. I also checked then to be sure. I was guessing he may leave a few behind if he had them. I saw nothing.
That was also in my first call to the breeder. I asked her if she was dealing with mites. She said no....

I don't know if my method means for sure that he doesn't have them. I have never actually seen mites on a snake but I still haven't seen any indication of parasites.

Carpets sometimes soak during a shed process, but it can be because of mites as well. I know my IJ's love water and I sometimes find them soaking just because. I'm not sure why, but I know other IJ keepers who say the same thing.
I wouldn't be concerned about it, unless it's excessive.
If you are concerned about possibly having mites, keep him on paper towels for a while, and if you have one, use a white ceramic bowl for a water dish. You will spot mites much easier if they're there.

The longer you have him, you will be able to tell when he is in shed. The opaque phase is the easiest to spot, of course, but as you get to know your snake, you will be able to notice the different phases of the shed process.

[ratsncorns]

My house's humidity is in the single digits to the teens without use of a humidifier. I use a fogger in my reptile room just to get it to 30 to 40%
In the Northwest and Southeast states, humidity is usually a non-issue. In New England where the humidity inside the house could be 0-15% then it is prudent to get it up to a minimum of 30-35% and if misting the tank or tub is the only way to do it then it is necessary.
My comment on misting was not to disagree with your expertize in carpet pythons, only to give a New Englanders point of view on the extremely low humidity issues we have here this time of year.

My concern with using newspaper was mainly that the ambient temp could not be raised enough. The UTH thermostat will be set to a safe temp for the snake to lay on it if he crawls under the paper but the paper will cause enough of a barrier to keep the tanks ambient temp from rising high enough. Heat escapes thru aspen much easier raising the ambient temp. That was my thoughts on paper in her situation.



:cheers:


I lived in Colorado for 7 years and it is a very arid state. The humidity was usually around 0-20% and not once did I mist my snakes cages. I never had any shedding issues with my snakes. I now live in the Mojave and Sonoran desert and still don't mist their cages. It's all personal preference, but I would agree with MysticExotics in that it's only necessary if they have noticeable shedding problems.

[ratsncorns]

Carpets sometimes soak during a shed process, but it can be because of mites as well. I know my IJ's love water and I sometimes find them soaking just because. I'm not sure why, but I know other IJ keepers who say the same thing.
I wouldn't be concerned about it, unless it's excessive.
If you are concerned about possibly having mites, keep him on paper towels for a while, and if you have one, use a white ceramic bowl for a water dish. You will spot mites much easier if they're there.

The longer you have him, you will be able to tell when he is in shed. The opaque phase is the easiest to spot, of course, but as you get to know your snake, you will be able to notice the different phases of the shed process.

I heard that about IJ's but not once have I seen mine in the bowl. I think it's cool to see though, my Bairdi ratsnake is always soaking in his bowl.

[MysticExotics]

How is he doing, Angela?

There's a book, "The Complete Carpet Python" written by Nick Mutton and Justin Julander, it's a very good book for learning more about them!

[Jenstet]

I did see that book on Amazon. They've been out of stock for a little while but I can get free shipping.

[MysticExotics]

You can contact Nick Mutton directly (InlandReptile.com) and tell him Heather sent you. (I went to highschool with him...years ago. LOL)
Nick has copies available.

[Nythain]

Chiming in with my own personal thanks for book recommendation. I eventually plan on getting a jungle carpet, and knowing the right literature really helps!

Also, is there any update on how this awesome little guy is doing? Guess it hasn't been long enough since last feeding attempt to really try again. Keep us updated!

[Jenstet]

Nothing exciting to report. I turned off the CHE yesterday so he is just on the UTH now. We are working on getting his 10 gallon ready. I had to order a smaller UTH which should arrive tomorrow and my husband is working on a cover for the tank. I'm hoping to have him in his new digs by Friday.
Interestingly, this evening he has hit the water dish again and has been soaking and swimming around for 2 hours now which is a little unusual for him. I wonder if a shed is coming. February 1st would be the next time I try to feed him giving him time to settle in his smaller viv.
We'll be hitting the expo this weekend to pick up some hoppers as Heather suggested.
I'll let you all know if anything new happens. No one else I know wants to hear our snake woes :)

[Nythain]

I love snake woes, especially when they turn from woes to whoas and wows!

[MysticExotics]

Nothing exciting to report. I turned off the CHE yesterday so he is just on the UTH now. We are working on getting his 10 gallon ready. I had to order a smaller UTH which should arrive tomorrow and my husband is working on a cover for the tank. I'm hoping to have him in his new digs by Friday.
Interestingly, this evening he has hit the water dish again and has been soaking and swimming around for 2 hours now which is a little unusual for him. I wonder if a shed is coming. February 1st would be the next time I try to feed him giving him time to settle in his smaller viv.
We'll be hitting the expo this weekend to pick up some hoppers as Heather suggested.
I'll let you all know if anything new happens. No one else I know wants to hear our snake woes :)
If you're not seeing any signs of mites, then there's a good possibility he might be going into shed.
Are you on iHerp.com? (Free online reptile tracking system). You can track all kinds of things: feeding, sheds, cleaning, breeding, lineage, photos, etc.

[Jenstet]

No, but I did find that site at one point.

I made spreadsheets for my son that hang on clipboards by the respective tanks. He fills them out every week keeping track of sheds, cleaning and the weights of the food he is giving. He weighs the corn snake once a month.

We wanted to change his water this morning because he had been soaking in it all night and I wanted to check again for mites. I didn't see any but there was this weird mucousy blob floating in the water. It looks a little like ureates except for the blobby stuff. It was smaller than a dime.

[insomniac101]

Kathy::-offtopic

12.10 Cornsnakes, 8.5 Ratsnakes, 5.7 Carpet pythons, 2.3.6 Chondros, 1.1 Ball pythons, 0.1 Hog Isle boa

Now I understand the "Insomniac" label! Holy Cow!

LOL - you know it!

I'm at work, and just skimmed over the responses. I apologize for any redundancy, but did anyone mention his being overheated as a cause for wanting to soak? They will soak to escape mites, to help a shed, and to cool off.

It sounds like you've taken steps to make him feel more secure. Hopefully, he will be really hungry when you try to feed him again.

Kathy

[Jenstet]

Thanks Kathy,
Yes Heather suggested (kindly) that I'm keeping him too hot so I've turned off the lamp....or rather the CHE :)

[Alicia P]

Looks like Poo/urates to me. In my experience it always gets funky looking after it's been soaking in the water dish overnight, blech.....

[MysticExotics]

Yeah, that looks like just defecation. It's usually pretty nasty in the water bowl.

[snakewispera snr]

Try battering the snake around the head with it's food to wind it up..
Hold the food by the tail and bump the left side of the snake (just behind the head) as it turns hit the right side (just behind the head, again) and keep doing this until it bites.. Then pull the tail to feign a fight....

[Jenstet]

I went to the expo today and spoke with the breeder. She was very nice and offered to help assist feed the little guy and also offered my son one of her ball pythons in exchange...again. She also told me that one of the same clutch she sent to California was having the same problem not eating.

I bought a live fuzzy and brought the snake out to exchange cages today. We had to move him all around and I figured it was worth a try. I cleaned his water dish again and noticed 4 of these guys in the picture below floating!!!
HE HAS MITES!!
I have been checking every water change but we haven't been handling him. Plus he is darker so I still can't see anything on him. I had to put the specks under a microscope to even confirm that they were insects.
He has been soaking for 4 days straight at this point but I thought okay maybe a shed.
I feel so stupid. All this stress on him and us back and forth trying this trying that. I also feel that he came to us this way. He started soaking right away. He's been suffering for weeks poor little guy.
Off to figure out how to handle this mess. I'm sure there is a sticky somewhere.
UPDATE on the UPDATE:
I spoke with the breeder and she is going to take him back and give my son his money back. She said she will give him the treatments he needs to get rid of the mites.This whole experience has been a bit much so we will be a one snake family for the time being. Especially because I need to make sure the Corn doesn't have any mites.
Thank you so much for all your suggestions and help.

[Joba]

I don't blame you for returning him. If you want to keep him though, try LLL Reptile's mite treatment. They have an instructional video on their site and two products to use simultaneously for the cage and the animal. It worked for me once.

[Nanci]

Wow. I don't blame you for returning him.

[Jenstet]

I found something at Petco for right now. It's just a spray but it's something. I did watch the videos on LLLReptile and I'm going to order that but it takes time. I'm not sure if I should go ahead and treat the corn snake like it has mites or wait to see what turns up. We looked him over this evening and didn't see anything but who knows at this point.

[Nanci]

How far apart were they?

[Joba]

Poor little guy.

[Jenstet]

6 feet. I feel like we were careful. My husband would get the carpet out and we would handle him for just a few minutes. He wasn't all over our bodies like the corn snake. We held him maybe 6 times total since we've had him and never on the same night as the corn.
Am I just trying to make myself feel better?

[Nanci]

It might be best to put the corn on newspaper for a while to observe him. Look especially around his jaw and eyes.

[insomniac101]

What Nanci said, or go ahead and treat the corn too. If you handled the corn after handling the carpet, you may have picked up hitchhikers and unknowingly transmitted them to the corn.

What product are you ordering from LLLReptile? I like Provent-A-Mite. Every new animal that comes into my house is kept in an enclosure with aspen bedding that has been sprayed with PAM. I also quarantine for 90 days. I had a mite problem many years ago, and I hate those little buggers!

Kathy

[Jenstet]

I ended up calling a bunch of stores and found one store not so close to me (1 hour away) and they have Provent-a-Mite on their shelves, they also said they had Reptile Relief and a couple other choices for spray.
LLLReptile sells Provent-a-Mite and Reptile Relief as a package and with shipping it would have cost $32 and I would have to wait more days than I would like. I'll spend more on gas getting the stuff from the store but I'm going to pick it up tomorrow after I drop off the snake.

I used the spray I got last night from Petco and wiped down all the surfaces around the 10 gallon. I took apart his snake supplies and wiped them down as well. I also sprayed the carpet (the floor carpet not the snake) and then vacuumed and steam cleaned it. I put everything from the 20 in a light bleach solution overnight and then put it on the porch...including the tank. It's 15 degrees out so I feel like it should kill stuff and when I'm ready to clean everything thoroughly I can. I'll do it all again tomorrow after he leaves and then wash all the bedding and curtains in his room. I'll also treat the Corn. I need to look at him more closely like Nanci said around his face and neck. I checked him by running his body through a damp paper towel and inspected him but didn't see anything. My plan was to treat like they suggested in the LLLReptile video....unless people have other recommendations.

We learned a big lesson here as far as quarantine. I'm not excited about putting a pesticide on our corn. LLL recommends treating once a week over 2-3 weeks.

My son didn't handle the snakes on the same day but they are in the same room.

[Joba]

My dum had mites when I brought him home from an expo in 2012. I ordered and followed the LLL video and it took care of the little buggers for me, and no recurrences since.