Weigh in?

[kickflare]

I just weighed my two snakes.

I got them both in june. They were a couple of months old. I've had them almost a month now.

Ayesha is now 33g and I reckon she's just over 1 foot long.

Sterling is 30g and just over a foot long as well.

Would this be about right them?

For a side note: Sterling is only eating on assist feeding [i put the pinkie in his mouth and he does the rest] and Ayesha is going blue and has refused food completely.

[Dragonling]

For comparison, Tango was only about 10g at 2 months, 12g at 3 mo., and 30g at 6 mo. old. During the first 3 years of life, most corns seem to gain around 100g a year, yet Tango was nearly 140 by his first hatch-day, even though he was undersized previously. Sounds like your little ones are off to a fantastic start.

[Nanci]

I have a bunch of feeding tricks to try on your assist feeder, down in my personal forum. I don't know what you've tried already.

[kickflare]

I've tried all the tricks I can. But I live in the UK so there's no such as dawn or ivory dish washing liquid here. Also it'seems impossible to get live over here. I was told it's illegal to feed live mice here.

I've done your tease feeding which didn't go so well. He bit my hand that was holding him instead of the mouse I was teasing him with. I kept trying but he shows no interest.

I've tried different sources for mice with no success.kinds feel stuck with having to hand feed him. I don't like having to do it since he always struggles when I get hold of him. But once the mouse is in his mouth he stops fighting against me.

I'll Have to see if I can get hold of the other stuff mentioned. Good knows where I'd get guppys from. I've never heard of them until now

[axis1]

I've tried all the tricks I can. But I live in the UK so there's no such as dawn or ivory dish washing liquid here. Also it'seems impossible to get live over here. I was told it's illegal to feed live mice here.

I've done your tease feeding which didn't go so well. He bit my hand that was holding him instead of the mouse I was teasing him with. I kept trying but he shows no interest.

I've tried different sources for mice with no success.kinds feel stuck with having to hand feed him. I don't like having to do it since he always struggles when I get hold of him. But once the mouse is in his mouth he stops fighting against me.

I'll Have to see if I can get hold of the other stuff mentioned. Good knows where I'd get guppys from. I've never heard of them until now

Hiya kickflare! How ya been?

I would stay away from guppies or fish of any kind, only because of potential parasites. Also, tadpoles, frogs, and amphibians of any kind have a very high probability of parasites. In fact, I lost my black racer when he had a case of stomatitis (mouth rot) from rubbing his snout on the glass of the tank, from feeding him small frogs when he refused to eat mice for about 2 months! If I had only known then!! I was successfully treating his condition with a vitamin from a medicine dropper and if I had just waited long enough to get live hoppers he might have made it.

Unless someone knows something I don't, as long as he IS eating with assistance, the fact that he IS responding is a good thing. The nutrition he's receiving from what he IS eating will strengthen and maintain his immune system and hopefully he will begin to grab onto a mouse on his own if you just have patience. Assist feeding sucks in many ways, but it is better than force-feeding and many times even assist feeding is unsuccessful (I had a hatchling that just refused to swallow ANYTHING and it was a gut-wrenching thing to witness its slow decline into eventual starvation!).

BTW, if you can't get Dawn, I believe you can try any of a number of different dishwashing liquids as long as they have the same ingredients. Just google Dawn and do the same for the ones you have available that are concentrated and anti-bacterial and grab one that has most of the same ingredients and it MAY work!!

Just a couple of suggestions!

[Dragonling]

According to The Internet™, a good UK alternative is Fairy. I'd compare the ingredients to Persil as well.

[daddio207]

Thier weight is right on track for their age :)
The good news is the assist feeding is keeping Sterling's growth on track. I've had snakes that I assist feed till one day it finally "clicks" and they start eating on their own. Usually between 30 and 60 grams. I have a beauty snake that all it took to click on that switch in her brain was to leave the pinky in her container for an extra day. The start of decay was her trigger apparently! I was assist feeding her til that day.
I find with snakes like a Champagne Corn I have (and possibly Sterling) is they perceive something that is causing stress, unfounded or not, and until their desire to eat becomes stronger than the perceived fear we need to start that feeding response by assist feeding. Soon as the mouse is in their mouth the desire to eat overcomes the stress factor.
My thoughts based on my many experiences anyways :)
Good luck and no worries.
Keep in mind that the more you stress over getting him to eat can cause him to stress and not eat. Some snakes are more "sensitive" ;)

[kickflare]

Sterling is auk assist feeding. I do offer the pinkie on the tweezers first. But now ayesha has decided she's not eating. Been about a week now. I left the pinkie over night with her in the tank and it was still there this morning. Both of them shed last night so I'm hoping ayesha will eat in a couple of days since its been a week.

Trying not to stress out since ayesha was the better feeder out of the two. Now it seems be sterling who's being the better feeder despite the assist feeding. I did try and leave the pinkie over night with him but he picked it up and moved it to the edge of his tank then lifted him self up and kept looking at me. I was swearing he was saying 'mom come on its food time. Feed me!'

[kickflare]

I think I'm gonna move ayesha back to the smaller pinkies since she's not eating. Will keep you all updated.

Also how does one scent a pinkie?

[axis1]

. . . I have a beauty snake that all it took to click on that switch in her brain was to leave the pinky in her container for an extra day. The start of decay was her trigger apparently! I was assist feeding her til that day. . . .


Hiya there Daddio! How ya been? :p

I really like what you say about stress & the sensitivity some snakes possess. However, just a question concerning leaving a pinky that long that it begins to decay: Doesn't decaying flesh, innards, & other matter (i.e., nerves, bone, & other gristly components of the tiny but now soon-to-be-pungent pinky) pose the threat of a regurge from the sensitive systems of a hatchling? I'm a little on the obsessive side (I'm sure I told you abut my attendance at OCD-Anonymous Meetings before, no?) so I even hesitate to leave a thawed pinky more than 3 or 4 hours at most. I read about folks leaving them overnight, but again, I believe that this is too long to leave a rodent which has already begun the process of decaying the moment it was snuffed. Have you ever had a regurge from a snake that ate a rotting pinky? :eek1:


Just curious as I don't want to get any of my newly hatched corns sick but I WOULD like to worry a little bit LESS about how long I can leave a thawed rodent out and there's not a whole lotta people I know whom I trust on the level that I might trust YOU or what you might recommend! Especially NOW when I need to begin feeding my flock of sneaky, squirmy, & stringy squiggles their first meals!!

Just sayin'. :crazy02:

[jet_set_willy]

Kickflare, this is my feeding chart which may give you an idea of growth rate

I also have a little noodle which I have to force feed otherwise she just won't eat and yes I have tried everything.

I'm hoping she will start feeding once she has gained a bit more weight.

http://imageshack.com/a/img922/3331/UEXVah.jpg

[daddio207]

Hiya there Daddio! How ya been? :p

I really like what you say about stress & the sensitivity some snakes possess. However, just a question concerning leaving a pinky that long that it begins to decay: Doesn't decaying flesh, innards, & other matter (i.e., nerves, bone, & other gristly components of the tiny but now soon-to-be-pungent pinky) pose the threat of a regurge from the sensitive systems of a hatchling? I'm a little on the obsessive side (I'm sure I told you abut my attendance at OCD-Anonymous Meetings before, no?) so I even hesitate to leave a thawed pinky more than 3 or 4 hours at most. I read about folks leaving them overnight, but again, I believe that this is too long to leave a rodent which has already begun the process of decaying the moment it was snuffed. Have you ever had a regurge from a snake that ate a rotting pinky? :eek1:


Just curious as I don't want to get any of my newly hatched corns sick but I WOULD like to worry a little bit LESS about how long I can leave a thawed rodent out and there's not a whole lotta people I know whom I trust on the level that I might trust YOU or what you might recommend! Especially NOW when I need to begin feeding my flock of sneaky, squirmy, & stringy squiggles their first meals!!

Just sayin'. :crazy02:

I'm doing ok considering :p

Normally I limit the time that a food item is left with a reptile is overnight. With newly hatched corn snakes I would remove the pinky in that time frame.
The beauty snake was being assist fed for months and was around 20g (hatched at 12g) when I left the pinky in her tub for over 2 days mainly out of frustration. I rarely give up on a life that is in my care and that I produced but at the time I needed to concentrate on my health, Pams health and a tragedy in the family so I threw the pinky in her tub and said eat or die! Terrible really but it paid off. I don't know if the decaying mouse was the trigger or she just needed a longer time to feel comfortable with it. The next few feedings went the same but now she will eat within hours of feeding.
Of course when digesting their prey they are also digesting whatever is in the prey's belly and intestinal track (yes feces :-puke01: lol ). At 20g and quite a few assist fed meals the beauty snake had a more advanced digestive track than a newborn. Again, with a hatchling I would limit its exposure to the pinky to overnight.
I talk a lot about stress and its effects on reptiles and amphibians. After so many years in herpetology I've learned that stress is the #1 factor with reptiles failing to thrive. This is especially true with wild caughts.
My simple and highly effective way to feed corn snake hatchlings for the first few times is this. Upon hatchling completely out of the egg I move them to a shoe box with moistened moss and do not disturb them other than checking their environment until they have absorbed their yoke and had their first shed. A few days after the shed in the evening I put them in a deli cup with holes and put a pinky that has been thawed in very hot faucet water into the container. I put the containers into their shoe boxes and back into the rack. I do not disturb them until the next morning when I remove them gently from their deli cups and return them back to their shoe boxes. I take away as much stress as possible!
I personally believe that most of the issues with hatchlings not eating is due to the keeper being stressed out trying to get it to eat in turn stressing the hatchling out!

[axis1]

I'm doing ok considering :p

Normally I limit the time that a food item is left with a reptile is overnight. With newly hatched corn snakes I would remove the pinky in that time frame.
The beauty snake was being assist fed for months and was around 20g (hatched at 12g) when I left the pinky in her tub for over 2 days mainly out of frustration. I rarely give up on a life that is in my care and that I produced but at the time I needed to concentrate on my health, Pams health and a tragedy in the family so I threw the pinky in her tub and said eat or die! Terrible really but it paid off. I don't know if the decaying mouse was the trigger or she just needed a longer time to feel comfortable with it. The next few feedings went the same but now she will eat within hours of feeding.
Of course when digesting their prey they are also digesting whatever is in the prey's belly and intestinal track (yes feces :-puke01: lol ). At 20g and quite a few assist fed meals the beauty snake had a more advanced digestive track than a newborn. Again, with a hatchling I would limit its exposure to the pinky to overnight.
I talk a lot about stress and its effects on reptiles and amphibians. After so many years in herpetology I've learned that stress is the #1 factor with reptiles failing to thrive. This is especially true with wild caughts.
My simple and highly effective way to feed corn snake hatchlings for the first few times is this. Upon hatchling completely out of the egg I move them to a shoe box with moistened moss and do not disturb them other than checking their environment until they have absorbed their yoke and had their first shed. A few days after the shed in the evening I put them in a deli cup with holes and put a pinky that has been thawed in very hot faucet water into the container. I put the containers into their shoe boxes and back into the rack. I do not disturb them until the next morning when I remove them gently from their deli cups and return them back to their shoe boxes. I take away as much stress as possible!
I personally believe that most of the issues with hatchlings not eating is due to the keeper being stressed out trying to get it to eat in turn stressing the hatchling out!

Hey there Daddio! Thanx a bunch for both the response and the amount of information you gave that can hopefully help someone else in addition to me! You are definitely a classy guy!! (Bet you put on a vest just to take a leak!! :p)

Duly noted, in terms of stress! Though it's extremely difficult to provide a totally stress-free environment in captivity, especially for new hatchlings, though I couldn't even begin to imagine how a wild caught snake would feel once in captivity after having been living free in the wilderness. Kinda puts a damper on me just thinking about that leaving me with a look on my face like someone pissed in my cornflakes!

But thanx again for your responsiveness. Been a while since we had an interaction, especially considering you were like the FIRST one to respond to my first post, along with Dollysmom, that is, whom I now consider a good friend. Seems like only yesterday you were informing me that cohabbing wasn't smart. (Never DID claim to be the sharpest knife in the dishwasher!!!I even once bought a solar powered flash light, but that was a while ago, I've since smartened up considerably!!)

Hope to see you around!!

[kickflare]

Ayesha refused to eat again. so i needed up force feeding her as she was starting to get skin folds and looking trianglar. Which makes no sense, she stopped eating two weeks ago... but she has been pooping a lot...

I'm hoping she's not going to go the same way as Sterling. Since she's definitely a fighter when it comes to being fed.

[kickflare]

Thanks for all the responses folks!

Just letting you know that Ayesha has now had two meals with no problems. Her first meal, i first offered tongs [she turned her nose up at it] so i put it on a dish in her tank, check in a few hours later. Boom, two SMALL pinkies gone. Insert one happy sneaky face wiggling about to my metal music [i don't know why she does that but its cute]

So today i was adamant about feeding her on the tongs. Lightly nudge her with the pinkie, hold it up away from her body and give it a wiggle. Ayesha glares at the pinkie, give her body another light tap with the pinkie, hold it up again with another wiggle. Ayesha coils up xD BOOM she strikes out at it! [WIN!] Whist she's munching down that pinkie, I fish out a second pinkie from the luke warm water, wiggle it about. XD I can see the interest. nudge her with said pinkie, wiggle up, hold it up for her. Boom, another strike and the pinkie is down her gullet in seconds. Put her foliage and hide back in her viv, and watch a very happy lumpy snake disappear into her viv. xD

Just as I'm typing this message, little sneaky face Ayesha peeks out at me 'thx mom. gonna nap now. kthxbai.' xD Sterling, still hand feeding, i get his mouth open with the pinkie and he does the rest, insert a pinkie disappearing down his throat before he looks up at me. This is the snake who will stretch out to give me 'kisses' before moving himself in between my finger and thumb for feeding. [he's mad xD just like his human mom xD] so both are feeding well, hopefully i can keep Ayesha taking off the tongs and eventually move Sterling up to it as well. I've got a feeding dish that i'm going to start putting Sterling's meals into and hope it means he'll start eating from the dish since i don't want to hand feeding him forever.

[axis1]

Hey there crazy snake lady! How ya been?

Glad things are working out with your sneaky ones and their reluctant meals. I'm REALLY goin through the daily (nightly) grind with my brood of recently laid hatchlings (clutch hatched out beginning 7/11/16) and their feeding challenges. So far, out of 16 laid, only 4 have eaten. However, I just began feeding them this last week (7/22) because I followed an experienced breeder's advice and waited almost a full week after the first shed. That being said, I'm not getting any really WILLING eaters yet and had to try the boil-a-pink trick Nanci suggested twice already. Out of the 4 who ate, 3 have eaten twice already, 1 just ate tonight, and I have 3 boiled pinks now to be left overnight in individual deli cups with their reluctant feeders.

Oh well, I KNEW what I was getting into! And I have another clutch of 9 eggs due to hatch in early September! I must be a glutton for punishment! :headbang:

Must admit, the reward of a healthy, growing corn snake is WORTH THE HASSLE! (I THINK!! :eek1:)

[axis1]

QUICK UPDATE: 2 of 3 hatchlings left with boiled pinkies overnight actually ate theirs!!!!

(Thanx again Nanci!!!) :bowdown::bowdown::bowdown:

[kickflare]

Oh jesus Axis1! *offers hugs, cookies and hot chocolate*

I'm really glad you got some of your snakes eating, now comes the challenge to get them all to eat!

You thought about hand feeding some of the babies? Like I'm doing with Sterling. Anywayz good luck hun!

[DollysMom]

Congrats to all the eating snakes and their humans! Great news all around.

[kickflare]

Put two pinkies into sterling's tank last night. Checked on him 30 minutes later. XD both pinkies gone.

[axis1]

Put two pinkies into sterling's tank last night. Checked on him 30 minutes later. XD both pinkies gone.

FAR-OUT, HEAVY, & RIGHT-ON!! :dancer::dancer::dancer:

[DollysMom]

Put two pinkies into sterling's tank last night. Checked on him 30 minutes later. XD both pinkies gone.

That is totally awesome! Super happy to hear it.