Vermiculite grades?

[Vedica]

Hello everyone! I was wondering if anyone out there has noticed a drastic difference in hatch rates using fine grade vermiculite as opposed to coarse grade? I have my own opinion about fine grade, but wanted to hear what others had to say.
Thanks--Vedica:)

[Tim Madsen]

I've used fine and coarse grades, I've noticed no difference.

[Clint Boyer]

I don't know if using the fine stuff this year made any difference in hatch rates (they were worse then last year). I like the coarse stuff because it doesn't cling to the hatchlings as bad as the fine stuff. I think it has better ventilation around the eggs as well.

[Vedica]

Thanks for responding Clint. I have always used coarse grade as well. This year, for whatever reason, I used fine and the hatch rate has been lower than normal. Although their might be other factors at play, I do think the coarse grade allows a higher gas exchange, especially as the snake matures in the egg.
:(

[CornCrazy]

So where do you get coarse grade?

[Clint Boyer]

The first bag of vermic I bought from my local feed store was coarse The second one I bought, I didn't pay attention and got medium. I still have almost half a bag of med but I'm going to order a bag of the coarsest grade I can get.

[CornCrazy]

I never thought to check at our Co-Op. They will probably have it. I bought some vermiculite at Lowe's and it is very fine. I am concerned with the moisture issue. I mixed it 1:1 vermiculite to water by weight, and it seems fairly dry. This is my first year trying vermiculite so I'm not sure how moist it is supposed to feel.

Any help would be appreciated!

[Clint Boyer]

I've never used the 1:1 by wieght ratio. I'm more of a hands on -do it by feel kinda guy.

I start by filling the container with a bit less vermic then I need. The add water till it appears to be all moistened slightly. If you can pick up a handfull and it drips, it's too wet, add some vermic. If it doesn't drip and you need to squeeze pretty hard to get it to drip it's about right.

I mix it like it's a meatloaf, I use my hands to "feel" the right consistancy. You can always add a bit of water or leave the lid off if it needs to dry out some. I don't use many vent holes in my shoe box containers. If there is a slight bit of condensation on the inside of the lid and not on the eggs....it about right.

[CornCrazy]

Thanks! I'll try moistening mine a bit more. I think it was too dry. I couldn't squeeze any moisture out at all.

[CornCrazy]

Clint,

I did my vermiculite how you said, put my eggs in, but they arestill a little dry. A couple of my clutches of eggs have dimpled a little bit. I was wondering what is the best way to add water without harming the eggs. If I can't get it right soon, then I guess I'll just switch back to moss.

[Clint Boyer]

I usually just pour room temp water down along the side. You can also cover them with a moistend paper towel. That will normally bring them back. A little dimpling won't hurt, they usually recover once the humidity evens out.

[CornCrazy]

Thanks,

I'll give it a try. I put them in shoeboxes so I should have plenty of room to pur a little water along the side. I already have moist paper towels on top. I've been reading that some people put them there to gauge the humidity. My paper towels were drying out quite quickly.

I'm going to have more eggs than ever this year, so I definitely don't want anything to go wrong! I'll let you know how it goes! Thanks for your help.

[Clint Boyer]

Do you have vent holes in the shoe box? I've tried it with vented and no vents. I had to cover the vent holes on some because I was loosing humidity. I just covered the holes with tape.
Good luck!

[CornCrazy]

I did have them in containers with vent holes, but I moved them into ones without holes. I wasn't prepared for such big clutches from my first-timers, so I had to get some larger containers.

There is just a little bit of condensation on the sides of the containers today. I will check the eggs later tonight. I don't want to check on them too often, but I need to make sure they are rehydrating.

[Taceas]

I feel for you Terri, I thought 13 eggs was a lot for a first time layer and for a first time herper. If you want to send some eggs up here, I've got 3 Hovabators at my disposal. ;)

But when I first got ready for my eggs last year, I got vermiculite and moss just to see the difference first hand. And I was like Terri, I could never seem to get the moisture right with the vermiculite. It was either sopping wet or dry as a bone, I couldn't find the middle ground. I tried different containers, some with holes, some with no holes..and nothing worked. So thats when I tried the moss, and on the first time following the recommended methods for wetting and wringing I got the correct humidity and tempreture measurements. And those measurements stayed consistent up until I was ready for the eggs.

So based on that alone, I like the simplicity of moss. It seemed to me that the vermiculite wouldn't allow as much oxygen flow around the eggs, especially if they're laid in a clump rather than individual eggs. It just clung too much for my personal opinion. I find the moss easier to prepare, handle, and it envlopes the eggs in an airy yet moist environment. That and vermiculite makes a royal mess all over the place. I ended up with "glitters" all over the place. =/

Do people choose vermiculite based on it's cost over premium sphagnum moss? Cause I've found the moss is kind of expensive.

[Amanda E]

Well, I'm not sure if the moss I recently bought for my females egg laying box would be considered premium, but it was much cheaper than the vermiculite I also bought.

I think I'll probably like the moss better than the vermiculite, but I guess I'll find out in a few months.

[paulh]

Dry as a bone is right for Vermiculite that's about the size of coarse sand. Clint must have hands like a gorilla if he can squeeze water out. :) I can't. That's why I weigh the Vermiculite and measure the water.

The garden centers around my place started carrying Vermiculite before they had sphagnum moss. So I've never tried the moss. Before that I used damp paper towels, but Vermiculite is better.