Zeus has been tested positive for Crypto [Archive]

davina

11-04-2005, 02:55 PM

After submitting his last regurge of a hopper, the test results showed that he has crypto. I'm was very sad to hear the message on my answering machine last night, but then again we're finally relieved to know what caused the lump/regurges.

Zeus is still very active and will strike at a hopper w/o hesitation. He still loves being held and does't seem weak when I handle him. Since he's not holding down food he only weighs in at 97 grams (35" long). Only the lump, which changes size (sometimes almost not recognizable), is the only visual indication of his illness.

Our options now are either to euthanize him, or start him on medication (Tri? something... I can't remember the name of it). My vet is giving us either option, but I'm considering trying out the medication. If I see improvements within a few weeks, i.e. no regurges and weight gain, then I'll continue. If not, then we'll have to put him down. There is a chance that he may recover, but still carry the crypto parasite.

Anyone know of any cases where a corn has survived after being treated for crypto?

--Ryan

coyote

11-04-2005, 03:50 PM

Trimethsulfa? I think it is the sulfas that have been the treatment of choice for crypto.
I don't believe that it is a very expensive drug.

Everything I have read says that, to date, there have been no cures in snakes.

I don't know what your mind set is. My first choice is always to at least give treatment a try. Perhaps with that and other supportive care he can do well for a long time.

Since this is a possibility for any of us that keep reptiles, I am grateful to you for sharing. Please keep us informed of your decision and how the situation progresses. Also, have you been doing any further research on this disease for treatment ideas?

PtDnsr

11-04-2005, 03:59 PM

Out of curiosity do you know how he got crypto? I'm just curious because I've never had a run-in with it and don't know that much about it. I hope that everything works out for you.

~Katie

CAV

11-04-2005, 04:00 PM

I hate to be the one that screams "the sky is falling" but Crypto is probably the #1 fear of experienced hobbyists. Crypto is highly contagious and very hard to kill off in reptiles. It can, and often does, make its way through entire collections in a very short time frame. There have been more than a few occurrences in which large scale breeders and hobbyists have had to put down every animal they own because of it.

I'm only speaking for myself here but an infected animal wouldn't still be in my house by the time the sun went down tonight. Next, I would toss out (not clean or sanitize, thrown away) any container, instrument, bowl or cage accessory that came anywhere near that animal as quickly as possible.

A couple of suggestions:

1) If you desire to keep the animal I would get a second opinion and make sure that there wasn't a misdiagnosis.

2) Do you have any other reptiles? They are highly at risk for infection as well. DO NOT handle the other animals or use any husbandry equipment that might have been used on the sick animal.

3) Was this animal a recent acquisition? If so, you might want to immediately notify the person you got the animal from of the vet's prognosis. If it is recently arrived, there is a high probability that it came infected from the seller. *THIS IS WHY IT IS IMPORTANT TO QUARANTINE!*

I know this is a pet and you have already developed a bond but this little nasty bug is no joke. I'd highly suggest putting it down ASAP. :(

Serpwidgets

11-04-2005, 04:37 PM

Crypto is probably the #1 fear of experienced hobbyists.Yeah, a couple years ago I had a female with a liver growth. I was freaked out at the thought of crypto, because she had matched those symptoms before I took her into the vet.

Is there anyone doing any kind of research on crypto? If so, perhaps he could be sent to them. It might help him, and possibly lots of other reptiles.

Also, what CAV said: if you got him from someone, especially recently, definitely let them know of his test results.

Let us know what happens with him.

Gintha

11-04-2005, 05:07 PM

Is using an acohol based hand sanitizer good enough? I mean, holding one snake, then sanitizing, then holding another? Or could the parasite live through that and possibly infect the other snake?

CAV

11-04-2005, 05:49 PM

The microscopic Cryptosporidium parasite is protected by an outer shell that allows it to survive outside a host for long periods of time. This shell is what makes it so resistant to disinfectants.

Blue Apple Herps

11-04-2005, 07:01 PM

How is it contracted and what are the symptoms?

davina

11-04-2005, 08:32 PM

Trimethsulfa? I think it is the sulfas that have been the treatment of choice for crypto.
I don't believe that it is a very expensive drug.

yes, that sounds familiar. the vet did mention the drug was not too expensive. all they had available were oral meds. i requested for injectable ones.

i will most likely give the drug treatment a chance. the vet did mention a daily 2 week plan then slowly decreasing the doses. she did mention zeus may be on the meds possibily up to 6 months (assuming we see improvements).

we'll just have to pray and keep our fingers crossed.

--ryan

Gintha

11-04-2005, 08:41 PM

So how do you protect your snakes from getting it if the hand sanitizers don't work? ~,~ Stuff like this scares me ~,~

Shep151

11-05-2005, 01:10 AM

Hand washing. It removes germs, viruses and bacteria, rather than just attempting to kill them.
Good, soapy, warm handwashing, just like mom said;)
--But that's in addition to the quarantine, of course.

Rorryy

11-05-2005, 01:57 AM

http://aem.asm.org/cgi/content/abstract/65/12/5345

Scary, I had never heard of this. This link is to an abstract of a report on a wild captured corn with Crypto that was euthanized. So if this is a parisite found in water, do you water your snakes from the tap? Should you be concerned about your own health and water supply?

Gintha

11-05-2005, 07:07 AM

Well.. am doing a 30 day quarantine, even tho I know hes from an awesome breeder, just in case he caught something at the airport or on the plane... not likely, but hey.. better safe than sorry.

What worries me is that I hold Hunter, wash my hands, then hold Treasure.. but I realized they both touch my clothes, and my hair, and my keyboard... so really is my careful hand washing helping anything? *bonks head on desk*

MegF.

11-05-2005, 11:35 AM

Time to get naked and wash the bod in between :) I think you can only do so much to protect your collection. I was hands and arms in between handling my snakes, and I don't mix feeding tongs and such with my new snake. Other than that, you could make yourself crazy worrying about it.

coyote

11-05-2005, 09:15 PM

I believe that part of the successful infectivity of cryptosporidis is due to fomite transmission. Fomites being your clothes, hair, storage containers, feeding instruments, towels, counter tops, trash can lids, shoes, ANY object that the snake, its waste or any regurgitated matter has made contact with. In many households that would be a lot of things.

Personally, I would be crazy with anxiety.

coyote

11-05-2005, 09:24 PM

Effective hand washing for hygiene requires at least 20 seconds to accomplish. And, it is impossible to remove all the matter that can cling to cuticles, under and around fingernails, and to jewelry. You need to scrub with a brush, not simply lather up and rinse off.

If you are handling snakes and they are wrapping around your arms, you have to scrub your arms too.

Surgeons scrub, with brushes, up to the elbows.

Gintha

11-07-2005, 12:08 PM

How long does it take for signs of Crypto to show up? Fairly sure that it would have shown up in the 9 months I've had Treasure... but if I got a hatchling, months? Years?

And yes, I am driving myself nuts trying to keep them safe! Lab coats are my friend!

davina

11-08-2005, 12:51 AM

Out of curiosity do you know how he got crypto? I'm just curious because I've never had a run-in with it and don't know that much about it. I hope that everything works out for you.

~Katie

i really don't know? a couple of months ago we began getting mice from a pet store down the street instead of our usual place. i wonder if it's possible to get it from feeder mice that had been exposed to it.

--ryan

davina

11-08-2005, 12:56 AM

zeus gets his first dose of medicine tonight. it's called Tribrissen (trimethoprim/sulfa).

i hope he shows some improvements over the next couple of weeks.

--ryan

davina

11-29-2005, 12:58 PM

Zeus completed his 2 week daily dose of Tribrissen. He still seemed strong when held, but his appearance definitely shows signs of weight loss. There is still a slight bump still present around his stomach area, but not as bad as before the meds. About 5 days ago, I fed him a fuzzie. No regurge, and he did poop a few days later after soaking him in warm water, so that's a good sign. Yesterday, I fed him another fuzzie (these guys are tiny!) and he ate it pretty quick. I'm hoping he holds this one down too. We're also continuing his meds, but now only twice a week. So far so good!

--Ryan

corny_gurl333

11-29-2005, 06:17 PM

Yay! Go Zeus! I'm so happy that things are finally turning around a little for you....dang...now I gotta go set up a quarantine area for my new snake!

snakemom47

11-30-2005, 06:19 PM

It's good to see you giving him a chance. I hope he gets better!

davina

12-28-2005, 02:39 PM

Just another Zeus update. He's regularly getting his twice a week dose of oral medicine. It is getting more difficult to administer his medicine since he now is stronger and more reluctant to open up his mouth. He appears to be gaining weight, and is looking healthier. Zeus is now up to 2 fuzzies every week. So far no regurge, and he seems to be pooping a few days after his meal. His "bulge" is getting less noticeable, but it could be because he is gaining weight and thickening. We're gonna try feeding him a small hopper this week. So far so good...

Happy Holidays! :santa:

LizardMom

12-30-2005, 03:10 AM

That's great to hear! The possible weight gain is a good thing, I think. At least he's no longer losing. Keep up the good work, and keep your chin up. Animals can surprise us with their ability to throw off things.

Keep up the updates!

Rosebear

12-31-2005, 10:48 PM

Congrats on some good hard work and tenacity! You go, and GO ZEUS!

Virago

01-24-2006, 05:38 PM

Its been almost a month, How's Zeus, Did the hopper work for him? Hope he's doing well. :)

AnnieChris

01-24-2006, 05:55 PM

I hope this isn't a really stupid question, but can crypto be passed from a snake to a cat?

Thanks.

zwyatt

01-24-2006, 06:45 PM

I hope this isn't a really stupid question

I will not tolerate your insolence!

I'm not 100% sure about spreading crypto. I have done some reading about it and it sounds like it might be rare to transmit the way you were wondering. This link might give you some info.

Crypto Transmission (http://biology.kenyon.edu/slonc/bio38/hannahs/crypto.htm#trans)
:)

davina

01-24-2006, 08:47 PM

Its been almost a month, How's Zeus, Did the hopper work for him? Hope he's doing well. :)

zeus is doing surprisingly well. we continue to give him his twice a week dose of meds. he has been eating a hopper once a week now for a few weeks with no regurges. i think he's ready for adult mice since he gobbles up the hopper pretty quick (and acts like he wants more). i'll start him off with a small adult mouse tomorrow. also, he seems to be digesting his food and pooping normally. the bulge is hard to distinguish now (it's almost gone).

i'll keep you guys updated!

Lennycorn

01-24-2006, 08:53 PM

Thank you for keeping us updated Davina.
It nice to hear that you Zeus is doing well.

AnnieChris

01-25-2006, 06:38 AM

I will not tolerate your insolence!

You're funny! :)

(And thanks for the link.)

Christine

bradhart

01-25-2006, 03:37 PM

marty.warwick

01-25-2006, 03:41 PM

What an ingenious solution .. if its possible :p

davina

02-13-2006, 03:46 PM

I'm not sure if you're still giving zeus meds (great to hear he's doing so well) but if you're finding it difficult to give him his meds because he's getting stronger, is it possible to inject it into his food and feed him it that way?

we feed him live mice, so not possible. i try to handle him on days when we don't give him his meds so he doesn't think everytime he comes out he gets a shot of meds down his throat.

on another note, he ate a good size adult mouse last week after his shed (yeah!!!). i was worried at first because it was a big, but he digested it w/o any problems.

--ry

SnowflakeMadeira05

02-14-2006, 10:27 PM

I'm so glad he has gottin better than he was in the beggining. Do you know about how long he will stay on his meds?

davina

02-15-2006, 08:07 PM

I'm so glad he has gottin better than he was in the beggining. Do you know about how long he will stay on his meds?

6 months, then he'll get retested again for crypto. since he no longer regurges, i'll probably bring in a poop sample for testing when the time comes.

unfortuntaely, although he may seem to be getting better, he could still be carrying the disease :(

xXMetalsAngelXx

06-02-2006, 06:47 PM

I thought I would bring this tread up cause I've read a lot about snakes reguring multiple times and I thought it would be benifical to bring this tread up so people can read it. It's very sad cause the outcome always ends up bad.

I recently had a scare with my female Kitana. Thank God she was negitive otherwise all my snakes would more then likely have it. I'm going to do more research and make a thread with general information on it's effects in general and on other animals.

At my work we did a case study on crypto and how it works. The case study was on a cat named Gracie, she's still hanging in there but she looks like shes very old when she's only two.

I just thought this would be good to bring up again because it is a devastating thing =( Poor Zeus

snakers2486

06-02-2006, 07:46 PM

zwyatt

06-02-2006, 08:23 PM

At my work we did a case study on crypto and how it works. The case study was on a cat named Gracie, she's still hanging in there but she looks like shes very old when she's only two.

Sounds like a good idea as long as you make the distinction between the various species of Crypto and what animals certain species will and won't infect.

davina

06-15-2006, 02:23 PM

Just curious.. seeing as how its now june and this thread was started the end of last year and no new posts have been done on how zeus is fairing? I hope he is doing well, but does anyone know for sure?

zeus is still alive! we stopped his meds back in late april, but he hasn't been retested again. his lump is still present, but there was one day when i was handling him and his lump looked even larger. i don't know if the meds help to suppress the lump. we were sad that day, and even thought about putting him down. he's been shedding, but he doesn't seem to be getting any thicker (i could still kinda see his spine). checked him out last week and didn't notice the large lump. it seems to come and go, or he must be able to hide it :shrugs:

zeus is eating, and i know he gets hungry because he comes out of hiding and starts hunting around for food. when i take him out to eat, he strikes the mouse fairing quickly. he did regurge once (5 days after feeding) when i fed him a good size adult mouse. i believe his digestive tract can no longer digest food at a normal rate, so it's smaller portions more often.

anyone know a source for frozen mice? frequent visits to the pet store to get mice is time consuming. i did give him a frozen hopper last week, and he ate it up immdiately, but they don't sell packages of frozen mice.

--ry