Skin problem?

[Kiriapollo]

First off, I have an 8 year old Snow Corn snake. I've had him for 7 1/2 years. He's my baby. :grin01: I got him for Valentines Day from my husband. I need some help deciding on whether I need to take my snake to the Vet. :shrugs: I just brought him completely out of partial brumation 3 days ago. I started the process 2 weeks ago. I feed him 6 mouse fuzzies on Sat. Apr. 8. He had no problem gulping them all down. :cool: I will feed him again in three weeks. I picked him up today and I noticed that he had about 6 scales in random spots on his body that were unusual. Some are marred and red, some are marred red and yellowish, and the rest have little bumps on them. What could this be and should I be worried enough to take him to the Vet? :cry:

[ghosthousecorns]

Can you post a pic? Without a pic it's hard to say, could it be a burn?
I hope you take this as constructive advice - there is no reason to brumate a snake if you are not planning to breed. Also 6 fuzzies every 3 weeks is kind of an unusual feeding schedule, it's better to feed one larger food item than several small ones, and unless the male is severely overweight it would be better to feed him every 7-10 days.

[Kiriapollo]

No, I don't have anyway to send a pic, sorry. I don't feed him every three weeks. I feed him every 6 weeks. I just feed him small amounts over a shorter period time twice after his brumation. And I only partially brumate. The reason being is that I was told by a Herpatologist at a zoo that it is best to brumate. They live longer and have fewer health issues. And I only partially brumate, because if he was to get sick during this time I will know because he will still be moving around a little and eating. Unfortunately, I have to feed him small prey. He was attacked by a mouse when he was two and he refuses to eat anything with it's eyes completely open and running. I don't blame him, If I would have had the wounds inflicted on me that he had I wouldn't eat them either.

[dawnrenee2000]

I am not being combative in any way on this, but this all sounds wrong. Feeding every 6 weeks? Partial brumation? What do you mean by partial brumation? How long is your snake and what weight is it? Honestly, These conditions just all sound wrong for many reasons. I would reccomend that you get hold of a cornsnake manual by kathy love and switch all your conditions to those reccomended in that book . Those care sheets and info are in line with how the snakes are suppose to be taken care for its best stress free life and long term health. And most all keepers follow those guidelines because they have been proven to be what the animal truly needs.

To the point of your questions about the scales, This could be the beginning of scale rot which can simply be caused by laying in their own feces or on something wet for too long or it could be a bacterial infection. You can try switching substrate to paper towels for a little while to avoid substrate irritation and putting an antibiotic ointment on the area to see if that clears it up some over a few days, but if it is spreading at all you should take it to the vet because it may require some meds to help it resist this bacteria.

Best of luck to you and your snake.

[Kiriapollo]

I didn't mean to sound offended. I'm not. I am always up for a little critisim. He is 8 years old, little over five feet long. I have had him in a 39 gallon high tank with lizard litter that I sift everytime he evacuates. I consulted with a herpatologist, as I said, at a zoo. He told me that I needed to feed him, after he got over 3 feet long, every 6 weeks. This was to make sure that he did not get overweight. I actually cheat most of the time and feed him every 5 weeks. He eats anywhere from 9-10 pinkies/fuzzies at a time. I have been feeding him this way since I got him. It doesn't seem to be hurting him. He has always been very healthy, no problems until now. And what I mean by partial brumation is that I don't take him out of his tank and remove all heat sources. I just remove the day light and the under the tank heater. I cover his tank with a dark drape that I made for his tank with cloth and elastic. He still moves around, although very slow, and eats, not as often. I do not use a heat rock, I've already seen the reprucutions of that when I had my Iquana. I place approx. 2" of lizard litter in the tank to keep him from coming into contact with the heater, also it is under his water bowl. He has a plastic igloo for a hiding house.

[Kiriapollo]

I've also been told by several Vets and Herp experts that this feeding schedule was just fine. Believe me I don't want to hurt my Pete No Feet.

[dawnrenee2000]

well, go ahead and try that antibactial ointment on those areas ( something like Neosporin is fine) and give it a few days. If its not getting better it could be viral and need vet care.

[Kiriapollo]

Thank you for your help. I hope I didn't offend you from my comments.

[dawnrenee2000]

No not at all. We all have the same goal here and that is to have healthy and happy animals :) I can tell you love your guy!

[Kiriapollo]

Very much so. :grin01: If anything happened to him I would just die. I have taken him to schools to try and educate kids and get them not to be afraid of snakes. Pete has helped several people in my neighborhood get over their fear. I like to take him for walks when it's warm. You should see the looks when I come walking with my dog on a leash and Pete around my neck. Although I have to watch out for retails and buzzards in my area. LOVE HIM LOVE HIM LOVE HIM.

[dawnrenee2000]

I totally get that . I have 30 of them that I love dearly and more on the way to add to the love nest :)

[Kiriapollo]

Your opinion please. I have been told that they can live 14 years. I also have been told that they can live 20 years. What do you say? I want him around as long as I can.

[Kiriapollo]

And by the way, 30 WOW!!!! That would be great.

[PtDnsr]

Just out of curiosity do you feed live? If so have you tried frozen/thawed? This would get rid of the "eyes open and running around" part and also give your snake better nutrition (the bigger the prey, the better the nutrition). You would want to start slowly working you way up if you decide to. Giving a few hoppers for a few weeks and then moving up to small mice then adult mice. I'd second getting Kathy's book as well - it's the best book out there on corn care IMO.

~Katie

[Lennycorn]

I to am confused with the feeding schedule and feeding size. Did the herpetologist know or tell you to feed your corn 9-10 pinky's?? From my understanding , punky and fuzzy are less nutrishes as say and adult mouse. i know it sounds like you can't get f/t mice but how about fresh kill adult mouse?? I also don't have a seven year old snake but from what I read here, an adult is feed every ten to fourteen days. Six week is pushing it.

[Kiriapollo]

Yeah, the herpatologist said that after he gets over 3 and 1/2 feet to feed him every 6 weeks. Like I said most of the time I cheat. As far as frozen, I've tried. He completely hates frozen. Refuses to eat it. The adult mice, I usually, about every three to four feeds, feed him an adult mouse. I bash it to stun it, up against the glass. Every once in a while he won't eat that. I know he should. But, I spoil him too much sometimes and let him have his way. I can't stand to see him look at it and then go hide in his house. He won't come back out until I have removed it and replaced it with pinkies or fuzzies. He is a very strong willed snake. With the frozen, I have even tried that intice spray to make it more appealing. It didn't work. I've even tried leaving out it over night to make sure it was completely thawed. Nope, he refused. He's my baby. I always give in. He's been eating this way for a number of years. I hope it hasn't hurt him. You guys have made me wonder. But, I work for a Vet and they have checked him by fecal sample and blood tests. He is very healthy. Extremely active. He loves to be held and his favorite activity is watching the ceiling fans go in circles. He'll stretch his body out and then start swaying in circles with it. He also likes to do dishes with me.

[Lennycorn]

Well the vet said he healthy. Who's to argue. That all you need to hear. But feeding 9-10 pinky's every 6 weeks not what most of the folks here do.

[Kiriapollo]

Sorry it took me so long to get back. We had a Tornado Warning. Had to get things ready. I might try to feed him more adult mice every 4 weeks instead. I really don't want anything happening to him. I'd rather have him around for a long time. Thank you all for your help. I still need an answer to my one question. 14 or 20 years max. ?

[Lennycorn]

Tornado Warning !!! Don.t worry about replying back. Get what you need done. What state are you in???
Anyway, in a nonchalant way, ask your herpetologist what kind of experience he has with corn snakes. Just to feel him out a bit. Because I don't want you to feel that I push you into this feed change. They have more experience than me. And if the snake develops a problem I would feel awful. I's just that the feeding schedule is strange to me.
And yes corns can have a long life span, 14-20 and someone stated here that one is 24 years old that lives in a zoo. WOW.

[Kitty]

...He is 8 years old, little over five feet long. ... He eats anywhere from 9-10 pinkies/fuzzies at a time. ...

But shouldn't he be eating smaller numbers of larger prey? I was under the impression that pinks really don't have lots of nutritional value and are used mainly until babies can safely handle larger mice.

No :flames: please!

[Lennycorn]

But shouldn't he be eating smaller numbers of larger prey? I was under the impression that pinks really don't have lots of nutritional value and are used mainly until babies can safely handle larger mice.

No :flames: please!

Yes, basically thats normal here.

[Kiriapollo]

Thanks for the worry about the Tornado. All clear for now. I live in Indiana. The Tornado State. I don't think it will hurt him to slowly try to feed him more often. I know that pinkies are not as nutritionally packed. But, he is just that way. I don't like to push him to try to eat what he is afraid of. Poor traumatized thing. If that mouse wouldn't have attacked him. I don't think he would have had a problem.

[PtDnsr]

He probably won't eat adult mice because he knows you'll give in and give him the fuzzies. I would try to offer larger meals (hoppers) every two weeks for a while and then move up to small mice, then large mice. If you feel that he'll still refuse the mice because of his past what about weanling rats? They have a completely different smell than mice and he might go for it. Also, have you tried various methods of f/t? Thawing at room temp, in hot water, feeding out of the cage as well as in? As weird as it sounds I have a baby burm that refuses to eat outside of his cage and I'm going to have to slowly wean him off of that, but he will eat. I would try offering bigger food and if he doesn't eat he doesn't eat. Don't give in because he's learned that he'll always get what he wants. A healthy adult corn should be able to go a few months if need be without food. One of my males went 4 months last spring without eating and only lost around 50g. Keep in mind that if the vet says he's healthy he probably is and you shouldn't have to change your feeding schedule - it's just not one that most people on here would recommend. I'd second Lenny on checking with the herpetologist on corn experience and whatnot. Whatever you end up doing, do it for the benefit of your snake, not because you feel pushed to do it the "right" way.

~Katie

[MegF.]

I find most of the time, when snakes won't eat f/t it's because it's not warm enough. Mammals have a normal body temp of 100-101 degrees F. Most of the time, if you heat in a plastic bag, the temp just gets barely lukewarm. I was noticing some of mine refusing f/t when I decided to get lazy and stop microwaving the water and just putting them in a plastic bag and heating them with hot tap water. They didn't get nearly as hot with the plastic basically insulating them. When I took them out of the bag and heated them up directly in hot water, they took them instantly. I even got a rescued burm who had never eaten anything but live to take f/t the first time I fed her. I feed my large adult corn every 2-3 weeks, although right now he's off food completely due to breeding season. I don't know of too many people who regularly brumate their non-breeding individuals and when they do, it's complete brumation for 2-3 months. They don't partially brumate....

[Kiriapollo]

He probably won't eat adult mice because he knows you'll give in and give him the fuzzies.

I know. But, he looks so scared when I put them in there. I can't help but give in. I do the same with my son. Those cute puppy dog eyes. Can't help myself. :sobstory:

[schilsound]

In line with what meg said about this I'd recommend cervical dislocation to enable you to safely and easily offer larger food items to your pal.

While it can initially be somewhat traumatizing for the pet owner to consider prekilling prey items I would honestly recommend you switch to a larger prey item freshly killed; if he's eating around 10 pinkies you should safely be able to switch to a single hopper.

My one main reason for this recommendation is also a dietary concern for aging humans- calcium depletion. Pinkies have little to no bone mass, therefore the diet your snake has been enjoying for its relative ease of consumption is also low in didgestable calcium.

There are varying schools of thought on this matter [just search the various discussions regarding herp vitamins, repto-cal and pinkie dusting to see some different opinions] but my personal opinion is that if a snake needs it then it should be provided in the diet naturally if possible, then supplimented if it is a concern or issue.

http://labanimals.stanford.edu/Guidelines/Cerv_Dis.html

Here is a simple, easy to understand and straightforward explaination of C.D.- it will eliminate a lot of the issues you and the snake have with live prey and will also allow you to offer some larger, more nutritious items to your snake worry-free with just a exhertion on your part.

Hope this helped. . .

[Kiriapollo]

His scales are doing much better. Thank you, everyone, for your help. I appreciate all the ideas and opinions that I have received.

Today, tomorrow and forever. Each day is full of lifes mysteries.