Feeding corns meat?Mouse substitutes?

[snakefreak99]

I read in some herping book that you can feed your corn like meat and stuff.I also read in another one that some herper house trained her corns and fed it beef or pork or something.It would definetly be alot cheaper and easier if thats true so if you kinow what type of meat and how its prepaired i would really like to know.Thanks in advance

Jordan

[bmm]

Would not fed beef or meat. The only things you can fed a snake that have been proven to give it a total diet are mice, rats and I have heard those snake sausages are o.k.??? I really don't know much about if the sausages are o.k. but I do know they are mice parts ground up into a sausage shape. But these aren't often fed as most people prefer mice. I believe they are the *best* choice for a snake and they are one of the only healthy choices.

Just feeding beef is not the same as the snake needs the bones and other specific parts for a balanced diet. Beef is just beef. And I haven't heard of any studies on that, or even any speculation. I would say any book you read that in is either outdated, or highly misinformed and making guesses.

Mice are very cheap when purchased online in lots of say 50.

I would only fed a snake mice or rats IMHO.

bmm

[Iris]

Hm...I would have to have a LOT of people tell me that in order to be convinced to switch to beef or pork.
My advice to you is to stick with the mice/rats. They are pretty cheap when you buy frozen ones in bulk and although I know frozen cows or pigs are more convenient, they probably don't have the right nutrition and things for corns.
In the Corn Snake Manual it said how T Rex Snake Steak Sausages are good if your snake will eat them, but they cost more than mice.
I would stick with the good ol' mice on ice

[snakefreak99]

I will be sticking with mice,but theres one problem,i dont want to buy 70 mice online and have my snakes move to fuzzies before eating them all so if you could tell me how long they will be eating pinkies that would be good.i have two snakes are about 13-14 inches and i feed them about every 4-5 days and they were born in october

thanks
jordan

ps:i am a newbie so i probably have asked a stupid question.if so let me know

[CornCrazy]

feeding the pinkies until they are gone (if you buy them in bulk), even if your snake is big enough to eat fuzzies. Simply give your snake enough pinkies to equal the size of a fuzzy. Probably two pinkies would be fine. Then you could buy fuzzies on-line and do the same thing. Feed the fuzzies until they are gone even if your snake is big enough to take hoppers.

I don't know exactly how long it takes for them to advance to fuzzies. I think it depends on the snakes. Some of my hatchlings are eating fuzzies and they are only 3 months old while others (that are the same age) are still eating pinkies.

[HaggasCheff]

Right on, Corn Crazy. That's the way to go. They’re pretty cheap in bulk too. But I'd advise buying a smaller amount if you can. Something you think you will go through in maybe 3 months. If you keep them packed well, they last pretty good in a freezer. I've got 4 hoppers left that where I split a bag with Kellum (another member), I think we got them 6+ months ago. They are not in as great a shape as when they were new. Not bad or anything, but next time I am going to try for a smaller quantity.

I had an Indigo Snake for eleven years when I was younger. I had gotten it to eat like ball park or whatever hot dogs, which it primarily ate for many years with no ill effects. I would let them warm up to room temp, but this is the kicker. I put vitamin and calcium tablets into the 'dogs. Alternated vitamin and calcium every other feeding. I also supplemented the diet with frogs and toads, which Indigo snakes are fond of. Very rarely a mouse. Today, I would recommend you stick to frozen rodents though. Although it would probably be good to throw in a few different items from time to time if you can, I think corns sometimes eat chicks, small birds, lizards when the snakes are young, birds probably eaten by older snakes in the wild. I also know they steal eggs from my friend's chicken coop. If you ever try eggs though, probably best to get fresh eggs, not store brand I think.

Feeding your snake smaller items than it CAN eat will not be bad at all. More smaller meals is OK. Once you get up to hoppers, they pretty much have all the stuff a snake needs, I think (if I'm wrong let me know) but you still might look into vitamin supplements for trace minerals and nutrients. I think there is liquid vites you can paint on the mouse. I don't think much is known about the finer workings of snakes, how their electrolytes and hormones work and so forth. In the wild they would get extra nutrients from what their prey had eaten or was "gut loaded" with. Check out what your rodent supplier feeds their product on.

[snakemanone]

WHEN I SEE,


video evidence of a corn snake swallowing a pig or a cow THEN and only then will i feed my snakes pork or beef.



STEVE.............................

[kenalotia]

The main reason I would not feed my snakes meat, not even mouse/rat meat, is that it is just meat. When they eat their rodents, they not only eat the muscle (meat), but also bones, organs, and all the contents of the stomach. That's the way they get a balanced diet. Eating just the muscle would not be very nutritious for them, I think.

[Iris]

I don't really agree about feeding corns a variety of prey items.
If I decide to treat my snake to a delicious but expensive anole and he decides he likes the taste of lizards much more than the taste of mice and refuses to eat mice again, I will have a jolly time trying to make him eat mice again. Not to mention how much money I'll waste buying live anoles from the dirty dirty petshop.
If my snakes are doing well on mice, I will continue feeding them mice. IMO

[Hope H]

I agree with kenalotia. They need way more then just the meat. Also, the beef and pork in the supermarkets are full of chemicals, steriods, etc. Its not even good for us. Not trying to open a debate for all you meat and potato peeps. Just my personal opinion...

[HaggasCheff]

Ya'll are all right on about the beef and pork and it's true that you might have a mess if your snake decided it likes $5 anoles or whatever more than .89 mice.

As far as varying the diet a bit on occasion, would that help with trace nutrients at all or what? Does anyone use any type of supplements? Do gut contents of frozen rodents maintain in the freezer?

[bmm]

HaggasCheff...I wonder about those things myself from time to time.

I know that for pinkies, the ones with visible bellies of milk obviously contain more calcium than the ones you get that were taken from the mothers right away without much feeding and what not. I make sure to take my pinkies after at least a couple days so they have a chance to nurse a bit and have milk bellies.

As for adult mice and gut loading holding up in the freezer..I myself am not sure. Normally since I raise my own mice, I fed fresh killed just because its easier. And when feeding day is near I usually fed the mice in the "fod food tub" some egg, rice and any other leftovers I can just to make sure the have full stomachs when I kill them. Has this made a differance? Not one I can see...but I am sure an adult mouse with a full belly is more healthy than a adult mouse that hasn't eaten recently. :)

thats all i know on that subject though. maybe someone else has some data we all can read on those questions....

bmm

[dartguy]

can you elaborate on the items you feed your mice just prior to snake feeding time? I'm very curious....sounds interesting

[bmm]

Honestly I can't say it makes a differance at all.....I just do it for myself really. haha it makes *me* feel better...*L* But I feel like a full stomach would be that much more stuff the snake is getting....we (as in herp community) gut load our crickets and feeder insects so why not mice...and Rick uses a supplement so I figure this makes up for anything that the mouse lacks..

I definitly give hard boiled egg to females who have given birth or are about too. I read somewhere that the chance of cannabilism is less if there is a ready protien source available.

So anways the feeder bin mice get hard boiled eggs, left over croutons from salads, left over iguana salad (collard green, winter squashes etc) rice, pasta etc...all this food is leftovers each week from our food. I mix it into a bowl and feed it to them. Each mouse eats about 3-6 grams of food per day. They eat, I whack, then fed. haha :)

My staple food for mice is a mix of Mouse seed mix (normal one at pet store) small amounts of dry dog and cat food, squrriel mix, alfalfa hay and the leftovers.

bmm

[dartguy]

truly can we do any more than what we feel is right? so I understand what you mean when you say:

I can't say it makes a differance at all.....I just do it for myself really. haha it makes *me* feel better

anyhow, it sounds like a good 'theory' ...... and since snakes dont speak, thats the best you can do

:cool: