prolapsed hemipenes and then some D:

[Silvergrin]

We were feeding the adults today and, to my chagrin, discovered my boy Ra seems to have prolapsed during the week... at first we thought he had some dried fecal stuck to his cloaca somehow, but when I soaked him and cleaned him off realized it was tissue. If I'm looking at this right, it looks like he prolapsed his hemipenes as well as some extra. Unfortunately I can't find my camera link-up to post photos.

I called the emergency vet and was told if he seemed pretty stable it was probably best to wait until the exotic experts came in at 8am. Since Ra seems pretty chipper, I'm figuring this is my best course of action. Whatever's hanging out of him looks like it's gone, considering the dark black color :( I don't mind if he can't breed again, it's the "extra" that worries me. I wonder if he prolapsed passing a big poo? I saw a thread that said that happened to a boa, and we did find a shed skin with a pretty massive poo attached.

I have him resting on some damp paper towls in a bin right now. Anyone have any advice, or what to expect? Should I be taking him to the emergency clinic even though there's no snake experts there at the moment?

Thanks, any advice is appreciated

[TripleMoonsExotic]

If you do a search on prolapse, quite a few threads will come up. Here's (http://cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=46024) one I posted last year.

[Silvergrin]

Thanks. I've been doing some searches. Unfortuantely, Ra's prolapse looks a lot worse than your male's :(

[Rich in KY]

I wish you luck with your poor boy

[TripleMoonsExotic]

The photos of mine were taken after it had already dried up and died. It ended up falling out (into my hand no less!).

[Silvergrin]

Yikes Kat!!! D: Looks like we had the same thing after all. Out of curiosity, did you ever breed him again?

Well it took forever to get him to a vet... there's only two places that treat snakes I could find, and the earliest he could be seen was 2pm (then car troubles, yeah, what a day!)

The good news is, it IS "just" a prolapsed hemipene. Swollen up to like 10x the size and looking like an alien. I'll post photos once I figure out where my camera link is... anyway, I was sure it was more than a single hemipene because it was so huge and branched at the top. It does need to be amputated but I'm much relieved that it's something that, as far as prolapses go, shouldn't be that serious, and he ought to recover. He may even be able to breed later, as his other one is still securely inside him :P

I really like the vet too. Ra got a preventative shot of antibiotics and will be getting five more, one every three days. Normally I'm against preventative antibiotics, but not for surgery :P Unfortunately they couldn't schedule the surgery today; Ra's going in tomorrow at 9am. Wish him luck!!!

(estimated costs ~200, which is also a relief, as when I thought "surgery" I was visualizing a $400+ bill XP )

[Nanci]

What a relief...Let us know as soon as you hear he's out of surgery! Will they anesthetize him for that? Poor guy! Why would that happen in the first place??

[Silvergrin]

I should hope they will! ;) It was on the bill, so yep, I'm sure he's going under for it.

[crackerhead]

How did Ra do? I hope he is in recovery. Let us know how things progress.
Good Luck,
Terri

[Ohana]

Poor Ra! Good on you to catch and treat it early!

[Silvergrin]

Surgery went well :D
I dropped him off at 9am, and was able to pick him up after 4pm (he needed time to wake up). He seems pretty good, alert and crawling about. And doesn't have a big thing hanging off his cloaca. XP I can see a bit of dried blood at the vent, but that's it. Tried to take more photos, but still no time to find linkup and post :P
Ohana - thanks, but I really didn't catch it early :( If I had, there probably would have been no need to amputate. I did try to get him taken care of as soon as I noticed a problem, but it still seemed to take forever, since it sort of was more a "very urgent" problem rather than an "emergency". I was really kinda flipping out a bit XP

Total costs: $151. O-o That's for the pre-op exam, antibiotics, anesthesia, and surgery. A *lot* less than I was anticipating.

I put Ra in a 10 gal with lots of stacked cardboard hides and paper towels. His normal home's a 20L, but I don't have time to clean it all out right now, and he's to be in very clean, non-particulate bedding right now. I figure I'll give him a week to rest and destress (although I'll have to give him injections every 3 days), then move him back to his normal home. Hoping he makes a clean recovery; they said it was okay to feed him as normal, so Sunday I'll see if he wants a hopper.

I'll post photos when I can! Thanks everybody :)

[Silvergrin]

And now, the Terrible Photos D:

First is a full body shot (after I'd cleaned Ra off), for a size comparison. Ra's about 350g and maybe 4 ft long?

Second is a closeup of the prolapse D:

Third is a photo of Ra's cloaca postop. Much better! Couldn't get a great photo... camera was refusing to focus properly and I didn't want to harass him too much.

[Nanci]

Oh, that poor guy!!! Why did it happen??? I'm so glad he made it through surgery ok, and that it didn't break the bank!

[crackerhead]

I'm glad to hear the surgery went well. He is such a beautiful snake. Did the vet give you any thoughts on his chances at breeding success next season? I know from experience that egg bond females should not be bred again after surgery. Does the same hold true for males that have a hemipene amputated? I hope it does not affect his breeding future; what a loss that would be! Luckily he is a well mannered, sweet animal as well. I have a female snow that had surgery for egg binding and now she is strictly a pet. The problem with that is, she is mean as piss, and always has been. lol I've tried everything to calm her down but I still take a bite everytime I open her enclosure. It is going to be a very long 20 year relationship. :smash: lol Keep us posted on his recovery.
Terri

[TWGarland]

Interesting pictues, glad to hear your fella is doing better :)

Can't blame you for thinking that both hemipenes had prolapsed, that thing is huge!!

[Silvergrin]

Nanci: I can only guess what caused it. Probably one of the two main causes I've seen suggested for such things :P Some people are probably going to get on my case for this, but I usually keep males and females together 1 week on/ 1 week off during breeding season. Last week Ra was with Ifrit, a cream stripe lady. Buuut, I've also read constipation can cause it, and we did find Ra's shed skin with a giant hairy poo stuck to it. Since December he and another male (who I've checked up on!! XP) were switched from the juvie feeding schedule to the adults. He's been upgraded to weanlings, but I suppose it's possible one of the jumbos for my really big adults got mixed in. :/ I'm including the prices I paid so if anyone else has this problem, they can get a ballpark estimate on what it'll cost, and hopefully won't hesitate to take them to the vet. Perhaps

Cackerhead: the vet seemed pretty confident that he might breed again... not my primary concern at the moment but it would certainly be nice. He's not going near any ladies again this year, no idea what that might do to his injury. I think I will try next year, or the year after that... I did save a cream stripe female in 07 from a different set of parents (ifrit x diablo) that I intended for him in 09 or so. I'm curious as much as anything else as to how he'll do.
... of course, any future breedings by him will be *strictly supervised* :P No more unchaperoned time for him!
Indeed, he's a really cool guy, and if any snake would make an awesome pet it's him, but it'd be nice to propagate his manners and looks. I'm still kind of amazed that the vet could poke and prod his prolapse and look in his mouth and what not and the most Ra would do is squirm a bit; no defensive posturing or snapping! The only thing he ever attacks is mice :P

TW: thanks. Yeah, the whole night before I was able to get to the vet I was miserable thinking he'd prolapsed some more vital parts XP

[Nanci]

Oh- so he was mating- that explains it. Probably. FWIW, not like I ever mated snakes, I see nothing wrong with keeping a pair together in MATING SEASON, as long as they are coexisting peacefully and the male isn't hounding the female. Maybe if you're lucky you'll hatch out a replacement this spring!

[Silvergrin]

They are pretty peaceful although I do imagine the female gets hounded a bit; that's why I give them a break every other week!

[Silvergrin]

Well Ra seems to have recovered fine, thankfully! He's eating fine and everything :)

I'm disappointed to report though that the lady I was trying to breed him with, Ifrit, laid her clutch today. 26 eggs but... most of them look like duds :( There might be seven good ones in the bunch.
... I guess 7 isn't SO bad, but I just hope they're Ra's. She was bred the last two years to Diablo and had 100% fertility... I guess I'll see when they hatch out (if they're 50% stripe or 25% stripe) but I wonder if this breeding was successful at all. :/