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Won't eat from feedbowl/plate, perhaps...? Pls reply asap!

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 08:40 PM
Okay, so I'm extremely new to this - only had snake (Fang) one week. She arrived last Wednesday and wasn't fed until Thursday, as we had to defrost a mouse overnight after she arrived. She was actually due to have been fed on the Tuesday, but the previous owner hadn't done so as she knew she would have to handle the snake the next day to deliver her to us. Sooo, her dinner in effect was two days late, and when we fed her she didn't hang about!

At the time, I didn't know about feed bowls, so just placed the mouse on the substrate for her (not sure how the previous owner fed her). Having lurked around here since then though, I saw people mentioning feed bowls and it made sense, so I thought we should try it. I put the mouse in a large old (clean) ashtray (!), and put it in the vivarium but Fang didn't seem interested. My daughter suggested perhaps she didn't want to retrieve the mouse out of the *bowl*, so I then placed the mouse on a flat plate instead, but still no interest...

So, with my inexperience, what I'm wondering is this - could it be she simply isn't hungry again yet, dinner being a day earlier than last week? Or, is it possible she doesn't want to retrieve the mouse off a foreign object? Or something else?

Also - REALLY IMPORTANT, PLEASE! - the mouse has been out of the freezer for about 20 or so hours now - I'll leave it in the viv overnight, but how long can one safely leave a mouse from coming from the freezer, to having to discard it? I obviously don't want Fang to eat something that will make her sick, or will she reject it anyway if it isn't fresh enough?

Quick replies much appreciated, many thanks!

danielle
03-18-2009, 08:46 PM
Most people defrost the mouse in very hot water. I first get the pinky out of the freezer, put slits in it while frozen because they digest it better and it releases mousey scent, and get my tap water as hot as i can. Then I put the pinky in this really hot water for 20 minutes and put the snake in a tupperware container big enough for the snake, but not huge. Put the now defrosted warm pinky in the tupperware container with the snake and leave them alone for a little while- it will be gone. They need their food warm so just letting it thaw out on its own probably won't work as well. I would throw out the pinky thats been out and try again tomorrow with another one.

EmJagsz
03-18-2009, 08:47 PM
Was she fed on the Thursday after she arrived on Wednesday?

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 08:58 PM
The snake is not a baby, she'll be two in July, so is eating fully grown mice - she actually arrived with a supply of six I think, very handy! I'm sure the previous owner just defrosted them at room temp for 24 hours and then fed them like that, which is what I've done both times. However, first time mouse is wolfed down and this time no interest so far. I figure she might just not be hungry enough yet?

And yes, she was fed on the Thursday after arriving Wednesday, last week.

Gee I just don't want to get it wrong at all - thanks for replying so quickly you guys, hope for more ideas soon!

danielle
03-18-2009, 09:02 PM
You can still warm and slit an adult mouse if she doen't eat in a week or so, The sense the warmth of the prey and tend to literally lunge right at it. If you don't want to do it this way just defrot in the fridge so it doesn't spoil.

EmJagsz
03-18-2009, 09:05 PM
Feeding her on the Thursday after she arrived was probably a not-so-smart idea... Generally, people here like to give new additions at least a week to let the new ones settle in after all the stress that being shipped and moving into a new home brings. But if she ate for you already and since she's almost two, I'm pretty sure she will start eating for you soon (granted there is nothing seriously wrong internally).

Regarding the mice, it's not a bad idea to put the mouse out the night before feeding day to let it thaw out to room temp. This is what I do with my fuzzies if I have the time but the trick I use is that, just before I'm ready to feed them, I place the room temp thawed mice into some hot water for a couple of minutes to warm the mousie up. You could try that idea :)

If she doesn't eat for you when you try again, don't worry too much about it. Just keep offering her food on her scheduled feeding days, offering her food everyday could stress her out and even put her off of her food much more. I also agree with the idea that you should try feeding her in a seperate "feeding bin", which could be anything from a shoe box to a bought plastic bin- just make sure that whatever you use isn't TOO big.

But like I said, she will probably eat for you when she is ready to eat. Good luck with her! :)

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 09:06 PM
Ooops I had forgotten to mention that Fang isn't a hatchling, in my post here, as I'd already done so in my intro thread - apologies for that! :awcrap:

Thanks again for your help :spinner:

danielle
03-18-2009, 09:13 PM
Are you sure about letting a mouse thaw out in a room for several hours. Once meat defrosts if left out it begins to grow bacterias and even an adult mouse should thaw at average room temps within 2 hours so overnight may be pushing it. I would thaw it in the fridge overnight and then warm in some hot water, but exposing defrosted meat for that long sounds iffy.

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 09:14 PM
Thanks so much both of you, you've been most helpful - I'll take all that on board.

So do you suggest that if she doesn't eat this mouse overnight, that I leave it until next week to feed her? Or a few days or so? Sorry to be pernickity, but I'm such a novice, I'm erring on the side of caution!

EmJagsz
03-18-2009, 09:16 PM
I wouldn't think taking a frozen mouse out the night before feeding day would be any different than leaving a mouse with a stubborn snake overnight...

If your snake doesn't eat the mouse when you offer it, I would suggest waiting until her next scheduled feeding day; so yes, in a week you could try again if she does not take your offering.

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 09:17 PM
Are you sure about letting a mouse thaw out in a room for several hours. Once meat defrosts if left out it begins to grow bacterias and even an adult mouse should thaw at average room temps within 2 hours so overnight may be pushing it. I would thaw it in the fridge overnight and then warm in some hot water, but exposing defrosted meat for that long sounds iffy.

Fair point - just doing what the previous owner said she did, but I see what you're saying and it makes perfect sense, so I'll try it your way next time, many thanks. Do you think I should bin this one now then that's been out since last night?

danielle
03-18-2009, 09:17 PM
I would wait a week shes old enough and may only want food every 10 days anyway. They can go month without eating so another week won't hurt anything.

danielle
03-18-2009, 09:24 PM
I would chuck it. Normally a snake left with food overnight in all liklihood takes it within an hour so thats where I see the difference. Bacteria grows rapidly and we never know when and what will make us sick. Since bacterial infections usually lead to us and our snakes vommiting to rid of the yuckies risking a regurge doesn't seem worth it when the fridge is right there and you can always warm it in water to take the chill off. I am not trying to argue with you EM i know others who do it this way and always wondered if they thought about the risks of bacterial growth since they are definitely there with any meat left out for that long. Chances are 9 out of 10 times all will go well, but the room for error can be avoided thats all:)

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 09:31 PM
Cool - I'll leave it overnight then and try again next week if it isn't gone by morning. Thanks again!

Old_School
03-18-2009, 09:34 PM
I thaw my mice, fuzzies, hamsters ect for approx 10-12 hrs at herp room temp. (82 degrees) I usually take them out of the freezer before leaving for work in the morning, and feed after i eat dinner, around 7pm.
I leave the food item in the enclosure all night. the next morning I check, those that did not eat I remove the food item and offer it to a more "greedy" eater. That would bring it to almost 24 hrs from being taken out of the freezer. I never had a problem of a mouse being spoiled in that time, small pinkies are another story, they are usually useless the next morning.

Ooopsy
03-18-2009, 09:53 PM
I thaw my mice, fuzzies, hamsters ect for approx 10-12 hrs at herp room temp. (82 degrees) I usually take them out of the freezer before leaving for work in the morning, and feed after i eat dinner, around 7pm.
I leave the food item in the enclosure all night. the next morning I check, those that did not eat I remove the food item and offer it to a more "greedy" eater. That would bring it to almost 24 hrs from being taken out of the freezer. I never had a problem of a mouse being spoiled in that time, small pinkies are another story, they are usually useless the next morning.

That seems like a good timeframe to me actually, thanks for your input.

I just offered the mouse to Fang once more, in her warm hide, and she definitely wasn't interested, so I've binned it, seeing it's been out of the freezer for more than a whole day now. Poor mousie, what a waste :( Might try again Sunday evening, as it'll be ten days then since she's eaten by then.

Boy this forum is awesome, so glad I found it! :)

Nanci
03-19-2009, 05:38 AM
I would treat snake food the same way I treat human food. You would (I hope) never take a steak out and leave it on the counter while you were at work. You'd at least put it in the fridge so it wouldn't get above 40F for bacteria to grow. I thaw mice in hot running water, it takes about five minutes for an adult mouse, and then the mouse is nice an hot and ready to eat. Many snakes just won't take a room temp mouse.

Ooopsy
03-19-2009, 07:39 AM
I would treat snake food the same way I treat human food. You would (I hope) never take a steak out and leave it on the counter while you were at work. You'd at least put it in the fridge so it wouldn't get above 40F for bacteria to grow. I thaw mice in hot running water, it takes about five minutes for an adult mouse, and then the mouse is nice an hot and ready to eat. Many snakes just won't take a room temp mouse.

Thanks Nanci. I'm pretty sure that the previous owner said she fed Fang the way I've described, and she did take the mouse last week quite happily. However I think I'll give them a ring just to check that anyway.

From now on I'll certainly defrost the mice in the fridge though, and then warm it in water just before offering it.

Cheers everyone. ;)

Ooopsy
04-03-2009, 05:19 AM
Just thought I'd pop back to this quickly while I was here. Well, Fang shed successfully night before last, so she had her long awaited next dinner last night, after three weeks of starvation!

I did as suggested - defrosted the mouse in the fridge overnight and then warmed it in water for a few minutes, in a bowl on the worktop, before offering it. While the mouse was warming up, my daughter and I had a bit of a cuddle with Fang as we hadn't handled her for a couple of weeks. Two of our cats were also in the kitchen - you should have seen Fang pointing at them, it was so funny! I'd swear she wanted them for dinner, lol. Then, she obviously picked up the scent of the mouse, changed direction and started desperately trying to get to the worktop - her little tongue was going crazy!

So I plopped her back in the viv and my daughter brought over mousey. She dangled mousey in the viv and OOPS mousey dropped onto the substrate. Daughter picked up mousey again with tongs, and I was just about to check mousey for loose bits of substrate when BAM - mousey was GONE - all tightly snuggled up in Fang's coils! CRIKEY that was fast, almost didn't see it - I'd say that was one hungry snake for sure! Brushed one bit of substrate off mousey and Fang obviously felt the vibration and thought mousey was struggling, so squeezed even tighter, very cute!

So, we have a full and happy Fang once more!