Regurging food!

[Isak]

Hi, My new hypo hatchling did eat good the first three times but every time regurging all the food two day's later! Now she does not eat good and still regurging the food. I have her in a small plastic box as I have all my other hatchlings. All the other hatchlings can manage to eat and melt down the food good and they all have exactly same temperature and circumstances. Why does not my hypo female manage to melt down the food?? Is it possible for special individuals to require more heat to manage melting food? All the other hatchlings are well but this one! I’m now trying to make it warmer and make the stress level as little as possible for her. Do any of you have any suggestions?

Please help!:(

[CAV]

What temps are you using? How many pinkies are you feeding and how often?

[Isak]

I don't know the exact temps but it's sure over 30 c at the warmer spot. I feed them exactly like I feed all the other hatchlings and they get one pinkie each time 2 times a week.
I was thinking of the possibility that she has paracites, but I hope not and I do not think so.

[bmm]

When your snake regurges you MUST not feed it again right away. It will cause another regurg and another.

After a regurg give the snake a good 10 days to recover. then try feeding again.

bmm

[CAV]

Good catch, bmm. Absolutely correct.

[Isak]

Yeah...but I think he regurgitated even the first time, and before that one there must have been a while since he was fed.

[bmm]

It doesnt' matter if its been awhile since he has fed. Cornsnakes, even babies can go a long time without food. Stop worrying about that.

Starting today give this snake at least 10 days with NO feeding attempts, NO handling what so ever. And then try a VERY small pinky.

bmm

[Isak]

I'll try with the temp difference first....but I wont feed him under that time..I fed him today though...but he has not eaten his pinkie...shall i remove it?

Hope it works!

[bmm]

You really need to stop trying "other" things. The ONLY way for a cornsnake to recoup after a regurg is NO feeding attempts for 10 days or more, NO handling what so ever for ten days or more, then after ten days you offer a small pinky and no handling!

The temp sounds right in the first place. 30C or 85 degrees is fine.

bmm

[CAV]

Bmm is absolutely correct in the advice she is giving you.

[Isak]

She did not eat that pinkie anyway so that does not matter now. I do not handle the hatchlings at all ecept for when i clean the boxes of course, so it's not beacuse she is handled that she's regurging. But she wont get food until 2 weeks from now...if that does not work I'll try move her to a bigger enclosure so she can move around more and feel more secure.

Thanks!

[bmm]

*shaking head*

Move her to a BIGGER enclosure?!?! Dude no offense, really, but do you know much about these snakes?

If anything she will need a SMALLER enclosure if after two weeks she does not eat. Not a bigger one. That will RUIN your chances of getting this snake to live.

Read: The Cornsnake Manual by Kathy Love

Also handling can MOST CERTAINLY be a cause of regurg and it doesn't matter when it was. You are refusing advice which is going to hurt your snake in the long run. I am glad you won't be feeding it for two weeks, and it doesn't matter if it doesnt have food for two weeks, it can handle it. You have already pushed this snake too far with more than one regurg and then offering food. You need to be VERY careful at this point.

bmm

[Isak]

I think u misunderstand me. I've had corn snakes for more than 7 years, and under that time I've learned a lot, so don't underestimate my skills please. I meant move the snake to bigger enclosure so it has more hide's, more hot and more cold parts som she can chose temp. In those small plastic boxes it's almost no difference betwen the warm spot and the warm air. The problem is not that she does not eat! The problem is that she is regurging the food, it can be stress it can be anything else. So do not misunderstand, if the snake has more possibilities to chose what it need it will be much less stress and chance of that regurging happens. You said: Also handling can MOST CERTAINLY be a cause of regurg and it doesn't matter when it was. The snake is not beeing handled and it's certainly not beacuse of handling she is regurging. I think the problem maybe that she eats more than she can handle if I give her 2 times a week, but I will give her at least one week betwen food so she can melt down the food completely.

[rachel132002]

Okay I'm new to the game but have to put some input in EVERY prob I've had people like BMM etc have always put some help in and even if I couldn't see logic I tried it so why don't you? and Secondly corns are AGORAPHOBIC or in laymens terms chlostra-friggin-love-it they HATE open spaces because they feel suseptable to attack and the same goes w/ feeding so um bigger enclosure and feeding together *buzzz* nope you need to go smaller - try deli cups for feeding or whatever hte smallest hting they'll fit in is. Leave it the 2weeks and then try scenting, warm pinks or tease feeding is all I can think.

Give these guys some credit at least and read the corn snake manual you can read it 10times over and still learn new things so you have nada to lose.

Good Luck w/ trying to get it to feed

Rachel

[bmm]

I am sorry but you are wrong. No offense, but you are.

A larger enclosure, more hides or not, will NOT make the snake feel more secure! This is like a simple husbandry area and it's well known that SMALLER enclosures reduce stress, not the other way around.

bmm

[Isak]

I will leave it 2 week of course! I have the corn snake manual and I read it every time I'm not sure of something. So you mean you should have the snake in small plastic boxes all their lifes?? Those things you said about they do not like open spaces BLA BLA BLA....That's what human scientists THINK when they have done some studies and the snakes look terrified..- Oh it's affraid of open spaces. No one knows what the snake feels right? And second, snakes live at fields, in forests, at sea, in mountains THAT are open spaces and of course they may feel thretened by predators and other things but don't all animlas do, even humans do? Is it right to put a bear (or a human) in a small cage cause you think that it will feel thretened otherwise? At least I do not think so, I hope you don't think so aswel. It is wrong to place a snake in a small plastic box they hardly fit in just beacuse "we" think that they like that, the snakes can't talk - if they could they maybe would say something like: let me out....do you understand me? I keep all my snakes in big enclosures so they can move and chose what to do all the time, I do not know any "big" breeder that gives the snake space to move in, they all have them in as small boxes as possible so they can fit as much snakes as possible at one place. You have got to think about the snake to you know. I want to know just for fun how big cages do you use to full adult snakes, and how may fit in that space?
I do not want do argue with you but those things you've tried with snakes, what did work, what did not...that may not always work for everyone, you all get your own experiences of things. When I've tried letting all male snakes together and then let them back to their females and by that make them breed the moment after, that may not work at all for you. So if the snake starts to melt down food after 2 weeks thats great! But if not it did not work for me and I'll try something else, It may work to put him in a bigger enclosure for me, who knows? I'll update you when it works.
PUHhh..

One last thing, would you feel less stress if they put you in a small cage with no light or windows:confused:

[EtherRex]

Isak, you are being given good advice here. Please try it before you put this animal in a larger tank. Yes, space is good for a secure WELL FEEDING yearling and older but hatchlings really do need enclosed spaces and solitude. BMM knows what she is talking about.

[bmm]

By your last post I can see where you are screwing up. Sorry but you are.

Your logic is faulty, your husbandry is based on human emotions, and you are not listening to simple advice. I hope someone else will have the patience to help you out further because I certainly do not.

Good luck.

bmm

[Darin Chappell]

Without getting into a spitting match . . .if you see a snake in the open, I submit to you that it is looking for one or more of the following:

food
water
a mate
sun (temp)
a hide

Otherwise, if all of their basic needs are met, they simply lie in one spot, satisfied with their comfortably cramped space.

Provide the captivity equivalent of those five things for your corn, and I promise that you will have a happy animal on your hands (as much as they are capable of "happy," at any rate :D)!

[mattsnake]

I can say right now, with very limited experience that snakes do not like wide open space; they feel vulnerable. Yes you might find them in a huge open field, but where in the field? under rocks, logs, and and in other tight and secure hiding spaces. I think that is also why most snakes are crepsucular or nocturnal. They feel safer in the darkness.

And of the dozens of snakes I have found ( racers, waters, garters, milks) only a very small amount were out in the open.

Just my thoughts.

[rachel132002]

FIELDS <<- that's the operative word. What's the definition of a field? A big ol' place with a heck of a lot of grass, maybe it's England but I don't really see lawn mower people trpasin across every little bit of it so theres long grass for cover, not to metnion numerous holes and burrows etc etc, also if thye LIKED open spaces then there'd be no need for hides would there? they'd just lay in the open all day. Oh well at the end of the day all we can do is give advice whether you take it or not is your choice but think of who's interests your htinking of yours or the snakes?


Rachel

[CornCrazy]

Maybe it's time to offer some more advice...

I was given a tip the other day. I have not tried it personally, but think it is worth a shot. I know someone who uses this method for a snake she has that used to regurgitate after every meal.

SO here goes...try taking out your snakes water just before you feed it (please wait the full 10 days after its regurge, though). After your snake eats, leave the water out for a day or two. Have you ever noticed that many snakes will gulp water down after eating? Apparently, this can make some snakes regurgitate.

As I said...I have NOT tried this before. I know some people won't agree with taking out the water, but if it helps the snake to not regurgitate, then that's what is most important. I also had this same concern, but it was pointed out to me that it is much worse for the snake to lose body fluids by regurgitating than it is for the snake to go without water for a day or two. That just makes sense to me...

[Isak]

You're advise sounds good. And to the other one that said: You are refusing advise etc. I am not refusing anything! Read the text in my posts! There you can read: Of course I will let it rest for more than 10 days, - that means I will take the advise..not that I'm refusing, read before speak is a good thing. And of course I think about the snakes best! Why would you otherwise have snakes?! I wrote about how people have their corns about how small they keep them, Is that how to think about the snakes best?! I still want to know how you people keep your corns, adult, sub-adults, hatchlings what ever, how big enclosures do they have?
To rachel132002: Did I say that they LIKE open spaces?? No I did not as far is I know, I said snakes move over wide spaces, they can lay in the middle of cliff basking without feeling thretened, They do not have to feel thretended. If the snake knows or feels (If it sees a predator or feels vibrations) that: THIS COULD BE DANGEORUS It would not lay down in the middle of a cliff, It would lay it self on the side of the cliff near some hide. So yeah basikly you could say: Maybe they like open spaces but why would they take the risk of beeing a meal for someone? The safer they feel the further away from a hide can they move.
To: bmm: Yes I did take your advise, but you did not seam to read that in all my posts...sorry. And advises is advises, there can be many solutions to one thing.

Thanks to CornCrazy's advise!