help getting hatchling off geckos

[Caryl]

I have a hatchling who is anti-mouse. Her name is Dazzler (Dazz), and she's my only homegrown hatchling to date. She was a non-feeder for just over a month, and I was trying the various tricks. Dazz had no interest whatsoever in plain f/t pinkies, brained pinkies, washed pinkies, pinkies scented with dirty bedding from 2 species, or pinkies soaked in tuna water. Pinkies rubbed with fried chicken, bacon grease, and frog left her unimpressed. Dazz's parents are the most laid-back, gentle creatures you can imagine, and tease feeding attempts were a dismal failure. After 30 frustrating minutes, I did get a strike. She let go immediately and seemed utterly repulsed by the whole affair. Two more strikes, same result. I was getting concerned.

We have an abundance of Mediterranean/house geckos around my house. Geckos have handy detachable tails, so my son and I went on a gecko hunt. When I put Dazzler into the deli cup with her first gecko tail she attentively checked it and ATE THE WHOLE THING IMMEDIATELY. She looked grateful that I'd finally offered her some actual food, instead of that mousy nonsense which was clearly (to her at least) inedible.

After three successive gecko tails, I tried a washed pinky that had been rubbed with the blood from the gecko's tail. The result was the same as with all the other mice. That night she also refused the tail, apparently because it smelled of mouse.

Three more feedings of gecko have been happily and promptly consumed.
She's now up to 2 tails per feeding, and I decided to try another trick. I washed a f/t pinky carefully, then made a hole in the body lengthwise. I obtained a tail from an obliging gecko and inserted the terminal end into the pinky's body. The two were sutured together with a strand of my hair, trimmed to fit of course. I put this odd combo meal into the same deli cup, and put Dazz in with it.

She went into feeding mode, as she always does now in her feeding cup. She investigated the mouse briefly and pulled away. She checked the protruding gecko tail thoroughly, but wouldn't eat. When she got mouse on her face, she actually wiped it on the side of the deli cup. Cute, BUT!!
After 2 hours had passed, I deconstructed my Frankenstein's snake food, removed the pinky and washed the gecko tail. Dazz still disdained to eat gecko that was contaminated with mouse.

Am I going to have to continue to be a plague on the local gecko population for the rest of this creature's life? Any suggestions for getting her switched to mice would be welcome.

[Zulu3]

Usually everyone here really, really discourages feeding things you catch outside. There is so much risk of disease.. bacteria.. If you MUST feed lizzard try buying a small anole from petco or another petstore. They are little lizzards that haven't been exposed to who knows what outdoors. They aren't TOO expensive, I think around $3.00?

Have you tried rubbing the mouse with lizzard? It sounds like you have a pretty smart little girl, but it's worth a try? Give it a good rub down with lizzard smell. (Yummm) =)
Also you didn't mention you tried braining? Sometimes that can make all the difference in the world.

Good luck!
Ali

[RobbiesCornField]

Catch a lizard, and freeze it (after putting it in the fridge for a few hours first). Once it's good and frozen, skin it, and wrap a section of the skin around the pink.

Or, you could always try a live pink. It might be the movement that's stimulating her appetite.

[Zulu3]

Ack, that was graphic Robbie lol =)

[RobbiesCornField]

Ack, that was graphic Robbie lol =)

If it works, it works! Sometimes, you gotta be graphic to get results! LOL.

Another method you could try is catching a few lizards, dry 'em out, and stick them in a coffee grinder or something similar. Wash the pink, and then roll them in powdered lizard until they're covered.

[Zulu3]

It's true. We become little slaves and do crazy stuff like stick raisin lizzards in a blender to get our babies to eat haha... =)

Gotta love em!

[vetusvates]

You know, Caryl, Baton Rouge, downtown and garden district, is heavy-laden with those same geckos. And I have seriously thought, off and on, about trying them out or stocking up on them myself.
I was just afraid that once the picky feeder got set in his ways on geckos, I would never get him/her onto mice.

[vetusvates]

It's true. We become little slaves and do crazy stuff like stick raisin lizzards in a blender to get our babies to eat haha... =)

Gotta love em!
I have considered the blender route, too. :laugh:

Luckily it hasn't come to that.

[foolishcactus]

I had a clutch that wouldn't eat for months. I finally cooled them down to 55degrees and left them there for two months. Slowly warmed them and they all ate...one died a few weeks later after only one meal. It's a shot. Could work.

[Nanci]

I'd be willing to bet that any anoles in a petstore are more than likely WC...And I'd be happy to have a baby snake that eats, even if it _is_ geckos. I don't have any great suggestions, though. Maybe let her get really hungry, then catch a bunch of geckos and put a live pink in with them to let them really scent it up. Maybe wash the pink first. Maybe try gecko saliva? That's what they use to toad-scent for Eastern hoggies...

[Nanci]

Here are a few more suggestions from my hognose book: Put the pink in a small container with the gecko for one day, then remove the gecko and feed the pink in the gecko-scented container. Feed the pink in the hollowed-out body cavity of a gecko. Let the snake go into feeding mode with the gecko, then quickly remove the gecko and replace with a pink. Hold the pink in one hand and the gecko in the other. Offer the gecko and when the snake strikes, switch to the pink. Rub the entrails of the gecko on the pink.

[Zulu3]

Sorry what is WC?
Ali

[RobbiesCornField]

Sorry what is WC?
Ali

Wild Caught.

[Zulu3]

Okay. I just thought it was discouraged to catch things in the wild and feed them to your snake. I'm almost positive I've seen people post that. Anyway, if you guys think it's alright I trust you more than me.
Peace <3

[RobbiesCornField]

Okay. I just thought it was discouraged to catch things in the wild and feed them to your snake. I'm almost positive I've seen people post that. Anyway, if you guys think it's alright I trust you more than me.
Peace <3

It is, because of all the parasites, but if you have no other option, eating something is better than eating nothing, right?

[Zulu3]

Of course, of course. I just figured the ones from the pet store wouldn't be "wild caught" because they generally just order them. But I guess maybe originally wc. I dunno I just thought it would be less likely to be tainted :shrug: but ya do what you gotta do =) -hides- I mean no harm

[RobbiesCornField]

Of course, of course. I just figured the ones from the pet store wouldn't be "wild caught" because they generally just order them. But I guess maybe originally wc. I dunno I just thought it would be less likely to be tainted :shrug: but ya do what you gotta do =) -hides- I mean no harm

Really funny truth:
Most anoles in pet stores (especially true in the northern states) come from Florida suppliers. Same with Cuban tree frogs. The suppliers get paid about $150 per 100 anoles and CTF's.

[Zulu3]

Okay, didn't know. Thankfully I've never had a baby not eat on me yet
sorry... =/

[RobbiesCornField]

Okay, didn't know. Thankfully I've never had a baby not eat on me yet
sorry... =/

It's all good. If you ever are in that ugly predicament, if you freeze the anoles for about 72 hours, it rids them of the parasites.

[Caryl]

Wow, thanks so much, everyone, for the great response and helpful suggestions!

Yes, I'm delighted that Dazz is eating SOMETHING. I don't advocate feeding WC animals; this was a last-ditch effort to get a non-feeder going. The geckos are abundant and easy to catch. They're even an invasive species here, so I don't feel too badly about harvesting them. Still, it would be more convenient to have her on mice - and there's zero possibility that I'd consider selling her until she's on mice. (I'm only considering it because a colleague's corn was injured and she wants purchase another with stripe background.)

I don't have easy access to live pinks, so I can't leave a pinky in with geckos long-term. I haven't been washing the feeding container, since she doesn't make a mess and I figured that the scent left in there would help with her feeding response. I'll try keeping a gecko or two in there for a few days, and maybe that will get her excited enough to ignore the scent of mouse. She really does seem revolted by the mice. It's not just that she'd rather have lizard; she not only won't eat mice scented with lizard; she won't eat lizard that has mouse scent, either!

She doesn't usually strike when feeding. Thanks, but I don't think bait-and-switch will work. When teased with a pinky, she would strike eventually but always let go. I suppose I could get her to eat mice inside a gecko's body cavity, but that still leaves me prowling around my house at night with a flashlight catching geckos. I keep expecting some neighbor to call the police and report a prowler. ;) Maybe I could try gradually reducing the size of the gecko/skin relative to the mouse.

Thank you all again for your help. You gotta love a community whose members are willing to make gecko-mouse burritos, lizard raisins and other such delicacies for our critters! :D

[amc0405]

I am having a very similair problem with my little hatchling. I tried everything that you tried plus braining, cutting the pinky in half and live. She cuddled the live pink.. :(

I went to Petco yesterday and bought an anole lizard to scent with. Put the lizard in with the pink and let it in there for a bit to scent it. I also rubbed the pink on the lizard before I put him away. Put her and the pink in a deli cup. 2 hours later...nothing. Not even remotely interested. So I decidede to try and force feed her. With my husband's help, we cut the head off of the pink. Coated it with egg white (for smooth sailing) and rubbed the nose of the pink on her mouth. She opened right up and with a little help it went right in. Once her mouth was closed we sat her down to see if she would push it down into her stomach and waallllaaa....she pushed in down. Got up this morning to check on her and she is under her hide so I didnt mess with her. I check the viv for regurge but didnt see anything. I am hoping she kept it down. I hope I dont have to do this everytime she needs to eat. It is heartbreaking to have to hold her down like that :(

[petpro553]

What Ive done for 'gecko-only-feeders' is to take gecko sheds, brain a pink, and stick the shed to the brain juice. Usually works-btw, we also stop offering geckos all together while trying to convert. That way they(the snakes) are good and hungry.

[Caryl]

I am having a very similair problem with my little hatchling. I tried everything that you tried plus braining, cutting the pinky in half and live. She cuddled the live pink.. :(

I went to Petco yesterday and bought an anole lizard to scent with. Put the lizard in with the pink and let it in there for a bit to scent it. I also rubbed the pink on the lizard before I put him away. Put her and the pink in a deli cup. 2 hours later...nothing. Not even remotely interested. So I decidede to try and force feed her. With my husband's help, we cut the head off of the pink. Coated it with egg white (for smooth sailing) and rubbed the nose of the pink on her mouth. She opened right up and with a little help it went right in. Once her mouth was closed we sat her down to see if she would push it down into her stomach and waallllaaa....she pushed in down. Got up this morning to check on her and she is under her hide so I didnt mess with her. I check the viv for regurge but didnt see anything. I am hoping she kept it down. I hope I dont have to do this everytime she needs to eat. It is heartbreaking to have to hold her down like that :(

I'm sorry you're having problems with your baby. Mine is feeding happily on gecko tails; no force-feeding for this one. And I did do the braining, slitting, halving, and offering only a head. She just doesn't belief mice are food, at least at this point in life. I hope yours decides food is a good thing.


What Ive done for 'gecko-only-feeders' is to take gecko sheds, brain a pink, and stick the shed to the brain juice. Usually works-btw, we also stop offering geckos all together while trying to convert. That way they(the snakes) are good and hungry.
Gecko sheds? Sounds interesting, but these particular geckos are just living around my house. Maybe I should capture and keep a couple of them until I get some shed skin. A question: at what point do you work on converting your "gecko-only-feeders?" This hatchling is 2 months old. She spent her first month not eating, and has been on gecko tails for about a month.

[amc0405]

An update on Hope...I checked on her tonight to see if she still had a bulge or if she was digesting the pinkie head we fed her last night. I didnt really see a bump. I didnt want to pick her up just yet. Giving her time after traumatizing her :( I reached my hand in to touch her and she was striking at me and rattling her little tail like she is intimidating...:) Now, how cute is that?? At least she is acting like a snake now!

[petpro553]

Where we live we don't have free roaming geckos but a rare western fence lizard here and there. I happen to breed crested geckos (calireptiles.com) and so we just use their sheds. If your little guy is only a couple months old you may want to stay on tails for a bit longer. We usually go be weight. Once they've built up enough fat reserves we begin trying to convert.
On another note, pinky heads usually aren't going to be really noticeable, not much of a bulge there. Maybe try feeding every 4-5 days to get that body weight up.

[Caryl]

Update: Last night Dazzler ate her first pinky since hatching almost four months ago! I tied two gecko tails to a very small pink (more of a "red," actually) using hair. The tails extended past the pinky's body. This time she started on a tail and just kept going. Previously she spit out anything that even smelled of mouse. I'm hoping this is the beginning of a new day! It's actually getting cold enough that it's getting tough to harvest those gecko tails.

[Zulu3]

hahaha.. well that is great for her! Good job, you are a truly devoted snake mommi =)
i couldn't help but giggle a little...

[Asbit]

Wow where I live in Saskatchewan..no geckos free roaming here..don't know how I would lizard scent if I had a none feeder. Hope she is on the path to conversion!

[Caryl]

hahaha.. well that is great for her! Good job, you are a truly devoted snake mommi =)
i couldn't help but giggle a little...

Thanks. It IS kind of funny, isn't it?

Wow where I live in Saskatchewan..no geckos free roaming here..don't know how I would lizard scent if I had a none feeder. Hope she is on the path to conversion!

ME TOO! Yes, the caps are intentional. :D