Regurging...Need Advice...

[DragonBoy]

About a month ago I purchased a 2008 Phantom female. She is in excellent form but both times I fed her she regurged. I am not sure what the previous owner was feeding her but I offered her rat babies in the 7-10 day peach fuzzy size which she had no problem eating, the second one being smaller than the first. After the waiting period should I try a small mouse as opposed to a rat?
I have heard some snakes cannot handle the higher fat content of rats.
Opinions would be appreciated.
thanks

[Nanci]

How much does she weigh? What is the diameter of the rat pinks compared to the diameter of the widest part of the snake?

Are you positive your temps in the viv are correct and she isn't getting too hot or cold?

[diamondlil]

Personally I'd be very cautious and offer a mouse pink after 10 days. And stick with that for a couple of feeds before working up the sizes.

[DragonBoy]

How much does she weigh?
Are you positive your temps in the viv are correct and she isn't getting too hot or cold?

She is about 200g and 26'' long. Her air temps are about 77 and the hot spot is about 90. She is in a mixed rack with kings, balls and corns, which is why the hot spot is 90 as opposed to 85. The rats did not even leave a buldge in her so they were about the same diameter. I waited 10 days the last time too. I will try something smaller like a pink and see what happens.
thanks

[jlindp]

From what I've read and been told, 90 degrees is pretty hot for corns. I think ideal is usually 82-85.

I know when my MBK was regurging, I had to finally feed him just a head, because even just half a pink was too much. Also, I bought some NutriBAC from Kathy Love and that has helped immensely! It helps promote good bacteria growth that snakes loose when they regurge. :}

[Nanci]

I think you need to get some Nutribac into her, too. I can't see any reason why she should be regurging. It might not hurt to get a fecal done and see if she has parasites.

[Asbit]

Here's Kathy Love's regurge FAQ's as well


FAQ from Kathy Love on Regurgitation Treatment

THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT - once a snake has regurged, especially twice or more, it is more likely to keep on regurging until it dies, unless something is changed about its care and feeding. It is very important NOT to let this continue. PLEASE FOLLOW THE INSTRUCTIONS BELOW VERY CAREFULLY. This is from my FAQ on regurges:

I suspect your problem is probably not bad mice, but about handling too soon, feeding too soon or too large of a meal, a stomach "bug", or improper temps. If you make these mistakes once, or even twice, it is not usually a problem if you FOLLOW MY INSTRUCTIONS EXACTLY. But remember, each time it regurges, the stomach acids are depleted, and the whole electrolyte balance is thrown off more and more each time, and it makes it MORE likely that it will continue to throw up until it dies. (those consequences are just my opinions - I do not know if science backs up my conclusions, but my experience certainly does!) That is why it is so important to NOT ALLOW another regurge.

The next month or two is crucial. DO NOT feed it for AT LEAST 8 days since the last regurge. NOT ANYTHING AT ALL! Then get a newborn frozen pinky and cut it in half (or cut off just the head) If she eats it, leave her alone for a whole week. (no handling). Repeat the partial pinkie feeding the following week. Then feed a whole newborn pinkie a week after that, if there has been no regurge. Leave alone for a whole week. If she regurges, wait a week and repeat 1/2 pinkie. If she keeps it down, wait a week and repeat whole pinkie. If she holds down a couple of meals, DO NOT rush back into larger meals and more handling. Treat this seriously. Go very slowly. After 3 successful meals, go to a newborn pink every 5 days. Go back to normal feedings only after 6 successful meals. Always wait to handle until after 3 or 4 days, but only AFTER 6 successful meals. No handling until then (causes stress, need to keep stress down). And NEVER feed again right after a regurge - ALWAYS wait AT LEAST 7 or 8 days, maybe even up to 10 days, and then only feed something that was about 1/2 the size (or less) of what she regurged..

Also, be sure that temps are not too warm or cool. Try to give an area of low to mid 80s on one side and 70s on the other. Too hot or cold will cause regurges.

Grapefruit seed extract can sometimes help if the snake has some sort of "stomach bug" (any microbial problem) as it is a natural remedy that is good against many kinds of pathogens, but not as strong as an antibiotic prescribed by a doctor. This product has been used in agriculture for many years and seems to be very safe, as long as you dilute it with enough water that the acidity does not burn the tissues. A vet has told me he feels that it may somewhat alter the pH of the animal and thus change the way medicines are absorbed. So if you use this product and then take the snake to a vet, mention the treatment so it can be taken into account if the vet decides to change the prescription because of it. It is best to mix it in a glass and taste it to make sure it is not so bitter that the snake refuses to drink it. I have used it on myself and so has my husband. I find it works better on stomach problems than for other symptoms (such as respiratory - I didn't have any luck treating colds or other respiratory problems).You can buy it at a local health food store or online. Please refer to the following website for more background info:
http://www.nutriteam.com/index2.html

I have also had success with a probiotic called Nutri Bac, a fine powder containing seven different microflora that should be inhabiting the gut of reptiles, but may be absent due to stress, disease, antibiotic treatments, etc. Using the powder as a supplement will sometimes allow the reptile to get back the natural balance of microbes in its digestive tract, and then its own immune system can take over. See my website for more details, or go here:
http://www.cornutopia.com/Corn%20Ut...information.htm

The number of days and amounts of food, etc, suggested above are not set in stone. Other people may have success with slightly different formulas, but this is what I found works for me and many of my customers. If this protocol does not work when carefully followed, it is likely that the snake has some severe problems. Your only hope is a QUALIFIED herp vet, who may or may not be able to save your pet.

Please follow my care sheet for the first month or so when starting with new acquisitions (posted on my website for the first month's care of new corns).. The first month is crucial in getting the baby established. It is worth a little extra "coddling" for the first month in order to have a trouble free pet for the next 10 or 15 years or more.

Good luck!
Kathy Love