my hatchlings will not eat

[batman361]

i recently got two bloodred hatchlings and a charcoal het for blood. yay!!!!! it is the type fo corn i have wanted for a really long time, the only problem is they have not eaten. it has been about a month and a half already and i am starting to freak. i have been raising cornsnakes for like eight years and this has never happen. i dont know how much time they have since they will not eat. and i have tried all the tricks i know. the closest i got was them taking it down only to all regurge the following day. any suggestions.

[SquamishSerpents]

what are your temps like? do they have enough hiding places? if not, they could be too stressed out. when snakes don't have hides they feel insecure and exhibit it by not eating/maybe being aggressive, etc. maybe just take a look at your husbandry, and if everything checks out, try these other tips:

are they in a rack system?

this may seem like a very long shot, but last year, 4 of my hatchlings (ironically, all amels) wouldn't eat. they went about 3 months, and then somewhere (don't remember where) i got a suggestion to maybe change up their position in the racks.

so i did, i shuffled some from the inside to the outside, up and down, vice versa, AND IT WORKED! it may have just been a freak occurance, but it *seemed* to have worked for me.

have you tried any other methods like braining, or scenting the pinks with chicken broth? i've had a bit of success with the chicken broth, too.

i hope they eat for you!

[batman361]

yeah i have tried assist,scenting(chicken broth,tuna,and lizard),braining,cupping,brown bagging. I just dont know what to do. And no i have them separated but they are in a quarantine room with all the other new ones and they are all doing fine. The only ones giving me trouble are these. And i hope i can get them to eat soon.

[Cat_Eyed_Lady]

How are they being heated?

How hot are the pinkies when you try to feed?

[Pal-O-Mine]

I have no idea how others thaw out their mice but this is how I do it. I have little tuperware tubs, ( 'bout the size of 1 pudding serving ) put the mousickle in there, pour boiling hot water over it and cover it for about 10 minutes. Then I take the now thawed mouse out and lay it on a paper towel to cool for a good long while. ( so the innards aren't all bubbly hot! ) Then give it to my snakes in their feeding tubs. I've been told you don't want to make the room smell like thawed mouse for your own protection moving them! I have never had a problem getting my corns to eat using this method and one is no longer a hatchling but he also isn't that big either. I have noticed that whenever the thawed mouse's belly breaks open and the guts spill out ( ewww! Gross and stinky! ) (and no, the insides aren't cooked they're still bloody) the snakes act like I've given them wine and caviar!

Anything wrong with this method? I have a friend that has some trouble getting her babies to eat and I think its because the pinkie isn't warm enough inside.

Devon

[Cat_Eyed_Lady]

Its the boiling water that can sometimes lead to the mouse popping open. Gross! lol

its better to use really hot water, wait for that to cool, then replace the water with hot tap water and then feed :) less messy... I dont Mind a mess but its easier if I dont have to. :) Its ok to feed mice when they are about 97 to 100 degrees... warm when you hold it between your fingers.

[Pal-O-Mine]

I know, I know, its gross. But the boys really dig a sloppy mouse. They LOVE it when the juice runs off their chin!

Devon

[Asbit]

I copied this from another thread I had posted this onto, hopefully it will help you out, it covers a bit of husbandry that can cause lack of feeding and then things to try to get them to feed. Hope you find something in it useful.

As for heating and housing, keep them in the separate tubs where you can provide the proper temps, because if your temps are off, they will refuse to eat. Only move them into the little deli cups for feeding. As well, if you are keeping them in one larger tank together, that can stress them out enough to make them refuse to eat.

Some of the main factors you want to consider are;
1. Keep them separated.
2. Make sure the husbandry is right, corns are forgiving but babies are the least forgiving ones and the easiest to stress out.
3. Improper husbandry causes stress, over handling stress, trying to often to feed causes stress, co-habbing causes stress and stress often causes refusal of feeds.
4. Trying to often to feed, will cause refusal of feeds.

Some things you DO WANT TO DO:
1. house separately
2. provide a temperature gradient, 83-85 on the warm side and 70-75 on the cool side
3. provide plenty if places to hide
4. provide clean water at all times
5. do not handle between attempted feeds
6. feed at dusk or early evening, simulating when they would eat in the wild
7. feed in a very small closed container, such as a deli cup with air holes
8. warm pinkie(in a ziploc baggie) with the hottest tap water you have and brain(slit head open so that some brain matter comes out)
9. place only pinkie and snake in deli cup and cover with a tea towel and do not peak for at least an hour.
10. if the pinkie has not been eaten on an hour place pinkie in ziploc bag and reheat in hot tap water for 1-2 min, place back in deli cup with snake.
11. place deli cup with snake and pinkie in the housing container, not on the heat side and leave over night, check to see if pinkie is gone in am.
12. if pinkie is still there in the am, let snake out of deli cup, toss pinkie and try again in 5 days.

Here is a list of other things(you can do to the pinkie after you heat it) that will often get a non-feeder started.
1. dip in tuna juice.
2. rub against raw chicken(this is scenting).
3. rub against the grease under the skin of KFC(this is scenting).
4. scent with lizard(anole works good), dead or alive, there is also a commercial product called lizard maker.
5. scent with frog, dead or alive.
6. scent with other rodents, either by getting soiled bedding from a pet shop and placing the f/t pink in a bag of it for a while or rubbing the f/t pink on another type of rodent.
7. dip in chicken broth.
8. brain(use a sharp pairing knife to cut the head open through the skull until some brain matter squishes out) and then gently hold snake and rub some of brain goo on snake's nose, it will then lick it and taste and smell it(hopefully enticing an interest in it) then place both in the deli cup.
9. try using a tiny bit larger container, that you can fit a very small hide in, place the pinkie's head just in the entrance of the hide and close the container, cover with a tea towel so the snake feels very secure, it will be dark and it will only have to come to the edge of the hide to get food.
10. remove snake's water 24 hrs before the feed, thus snake will be thirsty and then when heating pinkie do not warm in a baggie, just drop the pinkie in to hot water and let it get water logged, offer to snake and this sometimes works because the snake smells the water and goes for the pinkie because it is wet.
11. cut the head of the pinkie off and offer just it(do this while it is frozen put body back in freezer for later), sometimes they feel threatened by the size of the pinkie.
12. try getting pinkies from a different source sometimes snakes will be picky and will refuse rodents from one source and take them from another source.
13. dehydrate a frog or lizard and then grind in a small coffee grinder and roll warmed pinkie in the frog or lizard powder.
14. freeze a frog or lizard and then only partially thaw and partially skin it and wrap the pinkie in the skin(make sure to warm the pinkie with the skin on it)
15. wash pinkie with dish soap and rinse really well.
16. scent with day old chicks
17. put snake in deli cup with air holes wrap with tea towel and place in a purse or gym bag and take them for a small car ride(if you live in a cold area make sure to place the snake in a small cooler with a water bottle filled with warm water so they do not get cold), apparently the motion has worked for others in stimulating the appetite.
18. cut a pinkie in half lengthwise(messy) and offer both pieces in the deli cup, covered with the tea towel and no peaking for at least an hour.
19. tease feed- instruction below
How to tease feed as per Kathy Love
To begin with, I like to do this at dusk when they are more likely to be out cruising around. I have the f/t pinky ready to go and this is what I do.
a) pick up the snake, allow it to move around in my hands for a bit until it calms down and realizes I am not a monster.
b) gently but firmly restrain the snake with my left hand (I'm right handed) and allow 1-2 inches of its head to stick out while holding it so it can't go forward or backward.
c) holding the pinkie in my right hand, I bump the snake's neck (not head!) with the pinky and try to induce a strike. Some babies are too shy and will be frightened, others will strike. Sometimes they will strike once and try to get away, when this happens I let them move around in my hands a little before repositioning them to try again. They may miss and strike your finger, but it doesn't hurt(if they do get you do not yank your finger back you can damage their fine teeth).
d) if they strike at the pinkie, I hold still and let them think about it for a bit. They will either spit it out or decide to 'keep' it.
e) if they begin to swallow the pinkie I keep still and wait until they have swallowed it and it is well down their body before moving. Any movement can frighten them into spitting it back up. I try to do this in a comfortable chair with the TV on since it can take a while.
f) if it doesn't work, I leave them alone for at least 3 days before trying again so I will not condition them to fear food.
g) if it does work, the next feeding I see if they will eat on their own before tease feeding again. Most of the time by the third feeding they know it's food and don't need to be tease fed any longer.
20. place the snake and the pinkie in a paper bag and put it in the tank sealed shut to so the snake can not leave the bag( the idea is focusing the snake on the pinkie and it's smell).
21. scent the pinkie with dirty mouse bedding.
22. live day old pinkie.
23. cut the head almost completely off of a live pinkie, the fresh blood scent is different than in f/t and some will respond to this, be sure to severe it almost clean off and quickly so it is a humane as possible for the pinkie.

The following are generally for when it is getting desperate and the baby snake has not eaten in over a month. When starting with prey other than mice it can sometimes be hard to convert them.
24. live lizard(anole) captive bred not wild caught as wild caught are full of parasites and possible diseases which will cause you and the snake other problems.
25. live frog, again captive bred for the same reasons above.
26. day old chick parts

These are as many of the suggestions as I have managed to put together from the members on this site, I have used a few myself. The best advice anyone can give though is to make sure your husbandry is correct and that you are not stressing the little ones out.

Good luck hope this helps.

Oh and just a precaution with using boiling water to warm the pinkies(mice in general), you can accidentally cook them and cause a regurge due to lack of ability to properly digest the cooked prey item. Using the hottest tap water you have will generally get the prey item hot enough, if not then dump the water and rewarm again until the mouse if very warm to the touch, as others have mentioned up to around 100 degrees(much like the body temp of a mouse when alive).

[Groenslang]

Get live day-old pinkies. (Evil, I know) I have a corn that is a chronic bad eater, but he never refuses when I put him in a smallish container overnight with smallest live pinkie that I can find.

[bitsy]

Live food tends to be more recommended as a last resort - that's why it's option 22 on Tisha's list above. Try other things first so that your Corn doesn't get into a potentially dangerous habit.

However, if it turns out that live is the only way to get it to eat, then so be it.