Palmetto Corn Snake

Originally Posted by Mr Oni

I noticed SMR is starting to sell females only for $2,000.
I have tried searching but i dont think im throwing in the right keywords.

Why would females be less?
Wouldnt they pass on the same gene as a male?
Im just getting to reading about breeding and genetics so i please forgive, i did try to search.

I believe you may of misread. The HET females are 2000 dollars.

Originally Posted by Mr Oni

Why would females be less?

As pointed out, the females are het.

But sometimes, in new morphs, males will be more expensive because they can sire multiple clutches, while the females are limited to, at best, two clutches per season.

Okay, how did i not see that bold red lettering. Thank you guys for pointing that out. Nanci, that really makes sense. I guess the thought process isn't working today.

2000$ for a female het. The first clutch will give you some het palmetto and some normals. If your lucky and pick the right male to breed back to mom, you just might get some palmetto phenotype offspring.

Originally Posted by Carpe Serpentis

2000$ for a female het. The first clutch will give you some het palmetto and some normals. If your lucky and pick the right male to breed back to mom, you just might get some palmetto phenotype offspring.

Um, sort of.

The first clutch will give you classics, 50% possible het for palmetto.
If you hold back all of them, and breed all the males back to the mother, and sib X sib, then one stands a greater chance of hitting the target. In the second year breed the het female to a wholly unrelated male, to get a second group, 50% related to the mother. Keep the 2 groups separate. The basic formula is outlined in the 'vanishing pattern' thread, so that when one's breeding program reaches the F3, one does not have to out-cross and start all over again.

By het, I mean heterozygous. As a heterozygous palmetto bred to a normal or non-palmetto carrying genotype will give offspring that carry the palmetto gene (heterozygous)/ carriers as well as normal or non-palmetto carrying normal corn snakes.
Each male born of palmetto (het) x normal is going to be either palmetto heterozygous or normal non-palmetto carrying genotype corn. Its still guesswork determining which male to breed back to mom unless there are some markers to look for.

You corn is either are a carrier or it is not. If you say your corn is possibly a carrier as one of your corns parents was a carrier then what your really saying is you have not been done a test cross yet to prove that your corn snake is a carrier or is not a carrier as the case may be.

Originally Posted by Carpe Serpentis

By het, I mean heterozygous. As a heterozygous palmetto bred to a normal or non-palmetto carrying genotype will give offspring that carry the palmetto gene (heterozygous)/ carriers as well as normal or non-palmetto carrying normal corn snakes.
Each male born of palmetto (het) x normal is going to be either palmetto heterozygous or normal non-palmetto carrying genotype corn. Its still guesswork determining which male to breed back to mom unless there are some markers to look for.

A 100% het palmetto bred to a non palmetto/non-het palmetto will produce snakes which are 50% POSSIBLE het palmetto. NO PALMETTO will be produced in the F1.

About half of these F1 babies, when grown to adulthood will prove out to be either het palmetto, or not het palmetto.

Keep the female babies numbered, named, identifiable.

Breed multiple males back to the mother,
and breed multiple males back to their sibling sisters.

Keep records.

Just because a female F1 does not produce any palmettos does not mean she is not het palmetto; it may simply show that the males she was bred to were not het palmetto, or vice versa.

And even within any pair of siblings, known to be 100% het for anything at all, sometimes hitting the target does not happen in the F2.

The corncalc shows us possibilities based on mathematical principles.

What nature actually produces is often different.

I have a 4.7 group of adults het for amel, caramel, and a pattern.
The females have been paired to 2 sib males for 4 years running.
They have produced caramels, amels, pattern, classics, amel wild-type, caramel wild-type, butter wild-type, caramel pattern, but so far, no butter+pattern, no amel+pattern. It's in there. But where? So I have to hold back the amels, which are 66% POSSIBLE het caramel & pattern.

There are no guarantees.

Eric, how many clutches of F2 snake eggs produced through your own breeding programs (not stock brought in from elsewhere) have you hatched out?

I agree 100% with you. Its the same odds as flipping a coin. Heads is Palmetto recessive and tales is Non-palmetto. The other coin representing your male however simply has two tales. Each flip of both coins gives your your f1 potential baby of which all with either be heterozygous for palmetto or completely devoid of the palmetto gene altogether. Its the F2 where you cross hopeful males back to the mom that you may or may not get lucky. Of course crossing sibling to each other will speed up the process of hopefuls as mom can only get lucky with a limited number of males each year. Its all a numbers game.