CornSnakes.com Forums  
  Tired of those Google and InfoLinks ads? Register and log in!

Go Back   CornSnakes.com Forums > The CornSnake Forums > Health Issues/Feeding Problems
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Health Issues/Feeding Problems Anything related to general or specific health problems. Issues having to do with feeding problems or tips.

Oral Antibiotics: Myth or Truth?
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-14-2003, 12:15 PM   #1
13mur 6
Question Oral Antibiotics: Myth or Truth?

Okay,

My snake potentially has a bacterial infection in it's gut. My vet suggested giving my snake injectable Baytril solution orally. She said she has seen no problem with Baytril absorbtion through the GI tract.

My feeling is that antibiotics MUST be administered intravenously, otherwise the drug will not work properly. The Merck Veterinary Manual states that all intravenous drugs should be administered intravenously in snakes. So, it is my inclination to believe that my vet is trying to BS her way to another $100 bucks outa me to see if orally injected antibiotics works in snakes.

The problem is, my snake is so small, that intravenous injection is close to impossible without a skilled veni-puncturist. I mean I could hit the tail vein on a mouse any day with a light box, but a snake, you can't even see where the vein is with a light box (unless I'm mistaken).

So can someone clear this up for me? Would it be wise to give IV-batryl orally? Anyone try this with any results? How would batryl be given IV in small snakes?

I believe I got so fuming mad I felt smoke rising from my ears when I read that line in the vet manual.

-13mur 6
 
Old 02-14-2003, 11:23 PM   #2
13mur 6
So, does anyone else have a reliable source that says oral administration of baytril (and what type), is preferred over IV administration?

-13mur 6
 
Old 02-15-2003, 01:58 AM   #3
Alicia
"Concepts Of The Role Of Antibiotics And Other Antimicrobial Drugs In Reptiles" discusses what you are asking about. I don't know if it will clear anything up for you or not.

I have only seen Baytril administered by IM but it does seem that others have done this orally as well ( as stated in the article that CowBoyWay cited). It was interesting that this was done on a venomous snake, I would think that would be the last snake you would want to give oral meds to

Anyway, I hope you find the info you are looking for.
 
Old 02-15-2003, 11:16 AM   #4
13mur 6
Yep, I'm a paranoid one. Can't take any risks (if I don't have to).

The reason I do not trust my vet is because she only knows anatomy. Although I can understand you can deduce alot of the physiology through the anatomy of any organism, there are always quirks that are missed, or even blatantly obvious things that are missed. These cat/dog vets seem to continuously fail to understand that reptile medicine is not a comparable thing with mammalian medicine.

I know as much basic anatomy of a snake than she probably does, or more (she bloody had to look up a picture in a book to believe me that the snake's heart is 1/4 of the way down from the head, and only the stomach along with the liver and gall bladder and pancreatic organ are the only things that lie midway down the body). She did not know the proper procedure of administering oral drugs to begin with (she told me to let the snake sip the panacur. and what if it gets into the trachea? will you give me free antibiotics to treat her for the pneumonia she will get?). You get the idea? She set an initial bad representation of herself, and therefore will be watched carefully ("we're going to inject a nephrotoxic antibiotic in the lower half of the animal." Uh huh, and you're going to charge me to do a necropsy in a week because the drug killed her.)

oh, and I understand exactly what you mean when you say "it's the paralysis of analysis". I've encountered many problems where the results simply do not add up. At that point, I do two things, look at past results and ask if the the equipment I used is at fault (bloody Concorde MicroPET!!!! Always changing by factors of 2 every bloody week, what the blazes is wrong with those bloody workers changing the firmware every month?! Even the QC's all screwed up), or was there some point in the experiment when things were not controlled properly? If the problem makes its way past this checkpoint, I then start to wonder if it is in fact the faithful results generated by the experiment. And it is this point when I start to "go with the flow". You have no idea how much erratic and obviously wrong results slow experimentation.

Without enough analysis these days, people get into trouble. Maybe that's why I'm half engineer, and only half medical researcher (remember the first exploding space shuttle incident? poor engineering. remember all those buildings that spontaneously collapsed in Korea? poor engineering. Remember the bomb that went off in the World Trade Center? And the building pretty much didn't budge an inch? Now there's some quality engineering.)

Oh BTW, oral administration of Baytril does seem to be accepted as an effective FOLLOW-UP dose, after an initial 10mg/kg IM injection. Of course, this is only from one source. If 2 or more say the same or similar, then sure, it must be accepted.

And thank you Cowboyway and Alicia for those sources, they pointed me to a number of other sources that were much helpful.

-13mur 6
 
Old 02-16-2003, 08:31 PM   #5
Susan
According to Dr. Frye and Dr. Mader (the 2 leading herp vets anywhere), Baytril can be administered either orally or by IM injection. Baytril is available in injectable form and tablet form. However, in order to properly dose snakes, especially small ones, only the injectable form is feasible (ever try to break a tablet into 1/8ths or 1/16ths and then get a snake to swallow it?) And the only difference in starting a treatment plan by injection versus oral administration is several hours to obtain high blood levels. Is a few hours worth the possible injury of injecting a small snake? And then add the potential danger of kidney damage if the injection is given below the kidneys (Baytril can be nephrotoxic, but then, most of the good antibiotics are).
Trust your vet and give the injectable Baytril orally as prescribed.
 
Old 02-16-2003, 11:19 PM   #6
13mur 6
Thanks, that's just what I needed. A simple answer with a simple backup.

-13mur 6
 

Join now to reply to this thread or open new ones for your questions & comments! Cornsnakes.com is the largest online community dedicated to cornsnakes . Registration is open to everyone and FREE. Click Here to Register!

Google
 
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
antibiotics lynn Health Issues/Feeding Problems 4 05-13-2003 04:32 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:42 AM.





Fauna Top Sites
 

Powered by vBulletin® Version
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Page generated in 0.03901505 seconds with 12 queries
Copyright Rich Zuchowski/SerpenCo