CornSnakes.com Forums  
  Tired of those Google and InfoLinks ads? Register and log in!

Go Back   CornSnakes.com Forums > The CornSnake Forums > Natural History/Field Observation
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Notices

Natural History/Field Observation Field observations of corn snakes, field collecting, or just general topics about the natural environment they are found in.

Supersize corn
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-01-2005, 01:35 AM   #31
OCFinfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Susan
Hey...it says "PARENTS are wild-caught" NOT the snakes I own! "Norma" is the only wild-caught...the hatchling I found 10 years ago. "Blotchy Half Stripe" was bred and born in captivity. There are NO OTHER from even wild-caught parents on the first page...seems like you can't even count. The only other one I own from wild-caught PARENTS, but BRED AND BORN in CAPTIVITY is "Broken Stripe 8"...in Gallery #3.

Now I'm waiting...
No need to wait, I apologize.
 
Old 08-01-2005, 01:35 AM   #32
Serpwidgets
If 300 million people all jumped into the ocean at the same time, it would cause a tidal wave that could kill tens of thousands of people. Therefore, anyone who swims is a mass murderer.

Whatever. Keep reaching, dude.
 
Old 08-01-2005, 01:37 AM   #33
Susan
Accepted...
 
Old 08-01-2005, 01:51 AM   #34
OCFinfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serpwidgets
If 300 million people all jumped into the ocean at the same time, it would cause a tidal wave that could kill tens of thousands of people. Therefore, anyone who swims is a mass murderer.

Whatever. Keep reaching, dude.
I am stating my opinion on capturing wild snakes, and you have this as a reply?????? dude, keep sitting there thinking what a clever response that was and hope for everyones confirmation that "you da man!!!!"
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:00 AM   #35
Serpwidgets
No, you are not just stating your opinion on catching wild snakes. You are stating your opinion that everyone who has any kind of involvement with any snakes that are wild caught is evil. You are also stating your opinion that anyone who disagrees with you must be ignorant.

If field collecting is decimating the population, then why is it that corns are not on the endangered list? Why is it that corns are still plentiful? I guess the people who are currently decimating the population aren't doing a very good job of it.
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:09 AM   #36
OCFinfan
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serpwidgets
No, you are not just stating your opinion on catching wild snakes. You are stating your opinion that everyone who has any kind of involvement with any snakes that are wild caught is evil. You are also stating your opinion that anyone who disagrees with you must be ignorant.

If field collecting is decimating the population, then why is it that corns are not on the endangered list? Why is it that corns are still plentiful? I guess the people who are currently decimating the population aren't doing a very good job of it.
I never said anyone was evil. And I never said people that disagree with my opinion are ignorant. And FYI, EVERY animal that is either extinct or endangered was at one time plentiful. And just to reiterate what I have previously said, I think there is a HUGE difference in capturing a snake that obviously doesnt have a chance, like Susan;s wayward hatchling, compared to a gravid female. Now please dont put words in my mouth again
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:16 AM   #37
DdotSpot
Quote:
Originally Posted by OCFinfan
I never said anyone was evil. And I never said people that disagree with my opinion are ignorant. And FYI, EVERY animal that is either extinct or endangered was at one time plentiful. And just to reiterate what I have previously said, I think there is a HUGE difference in capturing a snake that obviously doesnt have a chance, like Susan;s wayward hatchling, compared to a gravid female. Now please dont put words in my mouth again
Wow, you've made QUITE a first impression with your first 11 posts...

That statement proved absolutely nothing except that all animals that have gone extinct, USED to be alive...uhh yeah...

So, just a question for you. Do you feel that the population of corn snakes has DECREASED since "we" started "catching" them? Or increased?
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:22 AM   #38
OCFinfan
Endangered or threatened snakes of FLA

1. Pituophis melanoleucus mugitus Florida pine snake
2. Nerodia fasciata taeniata Atlantic salt marsh snake
3. Stilosoma extenuatum Short-tailed snake
4. Storeria dekayi victa Florida brown snake
5. Tantilla oolitica Miami black-headed snake; rimrock
crowned snake
6. Thamnophis sauritus sackeni Florida ribbon snake

True, there are presently no corn snakes on the list, but I wonder how many of these might be caught and kept by people "herpin" for corns, or have their habitat destroyed by these same people, possibly without them realizing it. This is the point I am trying to make. There are many other reasons for not keeping wild snakes, for instance parasites, diseases that might be passed onto captive bred snakes, to name a few. I try and make my opinions and beliefs based on facts that I am willing to present. If anyone out there can make a valid argument for keeping a gravid snake I am willing to listen. You slam me but present nothing other than rhetoric.
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:28 AM   #39
jazzgeek
My Official Statement of Beliefs Regarding This Thread...

  1. I believe that you are, at base level, a troll. You use phrases like "unlike children", "ignorance must be bliss", "Then I just consider the source", et al, as the final lines of your (for lack of a better word) arguments in order to give them, or yourself, validity.
  2. I believe that you don't know the difference between a discussion and a "meta-discussion". I have every legitimate right to comment on faulty logic, conclusions based on emotion, and unsound reasoning without even mentioning the subject at hand. Most Philosophy departments at any reputable university will offer a course in this analytical process. It's known as "Logic".
  3. I believe that you're a master - no, make that a journeyman - of diversion in argumentation. I respond as to what you've implied instead of what was said, and your response is:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OCFinfan
    I would be happier if wild snakes remained that way...wild.
    Be that as it may, it did not address my point - that being, your assertion of:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OCFinfan
    Maybe you would have been happier with a gravid female rather than a hatchling
    ...being an implication instead of dealing with what Susan did say:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Susan
    I live in Florida and corns are plentiful, but just try to find one! I got lucky and found a wayward hatchling 10 years ago that would probably not had survived considering when and where she was found.
    This technique does not directly respond to the point(s) originally made. I concluded by posing a question to you:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzgeek
    Thus, it begs the question. Just whose hypocrisy are you referring to?
    That's diversion. As of this post, the question, albeit hypothetical, remains unanswered.
  4. I believe that you can't discern the difference between a simile and a veiled insult. To wit:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by OCFinfan
    Ignorance must be bliss
    would be the insult, not directly to the person, but certainly extraneous to the argumentative process. My response:
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by jazzgeek
    Then you must be happier than a crackhead in the Columbian hills.
    refers to the state of happiness ("bliss"). Thus you weren't being compared to a crackhead. A simile was drawn comparing your blissful ignorance to that of a crackhead in Columbia.
These statements of belief above have nothing to do with the issue at hand. However, they remain statements of belief. Now, onto the issue concerning w/c cornsnakes:
  1. Quote:
    Originally Posted by OCFinfan
    To say nothing of the fact of completely decimating a species from their habitat.
    You've got it "bass-ackwards". The primary, and most comprehensive threat to the wild corn population (and the population of ANY species, imho) is not one of "increase of harvest" but rather, LOSS OF HABITAT. Rich Z recently started a thread of how other field herpers he has seen can devistate an area by simply not "putting it back the way you found it". Adding to that, a huge amount of habitat of Florida corns has been paved over for decades; yet the species continues to thrive. Look at it this way - here in Wisconsin, the "collection" of whitetail deer during hunting season has "decimated" the population to such a degree that a) you've been able to shoot a doe for decades now (with a antlerless permit, of course - and the number of those permits issued increases yearly); b)the length of some hunting seasons has been extended because of the numbers of available deer has continued to increase; and c) the whitetail population continues to not just survive, but thrive. The state DNR estimates the population to be at record levels. This is all because of the relative stability of habitat here.
What it boils down to is this: loss of habitat is a greater threat, by an exponential degree, to the corn snake population than field collection EVER will be.

Now, PAY CLOSE ATTENTION. This post is about to end without any type of passive/aggressive inflammatory comment.

regards,
jazz
 
Old 08-01-2005, 02:29 AM   #40
Serpwidgets
Quote:
Originally Posted by OCFinfan
If anyone out there can make a valid argument for keeping a gravid snake I am willing to listen. You slam me but present nothing other than rhetoric.
Why? Because I might want to.

There is no need to present a valid argument, because you have the burden of proof here. It is YOU who is going around telling people that the way they enjoy their hobby is wrong. It is YOU who is running around telling everyone else how to live their lives, as if it is any of your business. It is YOUR responsibility to first establish that it in fact IS harmful in some way. You have not presented anything other than fallacious reasoning and personal attacks.
 

Join now to reply to this thread or open new ones for your questions & comments! Cornsnakes.com is the largest online community dedicated to cornsnakes . Registration is open to everyone and FREE. Click Here to Register!

Google
 
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Corn Snake Care/ general information Sheet CowBoyWay Husbandry and Basic Care 8 01-24-2008 02:05 PM
Transparent Hypo? Blue Ice? Kat The Cultivars (morphs)/Genetics Issues 152 09-04-2006 03:19 PM
Corn Snake general information and Care links.... CowBoyWay Husbandry and Basic Care 2 11-17-2003 01:26 PM
Corn Snakes, a general overview...F.Y.I. CowBoyWay Husbandry and Basic Care 1 08-27-2003 12:54 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:28 AM.





Fauna Top Sites
 

Powered by vBulletin® Version
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Page generated in 0.06531906 seconds with 11 queries
Copyright Rich Zuchowski/SerpenCo