rat snakes venoumous???

This really makesme wonder tho...and maybe this is me reading into this too far...but, I just got doen watching a show where they were working with chicken DNA, and they found out how to turn on and off certian genes that have been "Physically" lost through eveolution...and results were. they could make a chicken have a longet tail..and make a chicken grow teeth...they just used some, amino acid..(I believe)...to turn the selected genes on and off...and ovbiousley these genes were passed down from their early..reptile-like ancestors....(kinda a kick to the teeth to people who dont believe in evolution...HA! HA!.."we told ya so!)
anyway...what I am wondering is...I bet all snakes..way, deep down in their genes carry the ability to produce venom.... its just a matter of it being the right time to have that ability turned on or off.a way of eveolution and maybe natural slection...Because your genome is kinda like'a timeline in a way that you will always carry a blue print of what was...and whats now...It does make you wonder tho....what we could create, with a little knowledge....My god this stuff just sucks me in....lol..sorry for the long reply!

Yeeer man I see it too.......

Sorry I mean yes I see what you mean....
No I mean I know what you mean but I'm too shallow to think too much about it..... But I believe you... And thats what counts in the grand scheme of things....LOL

Originally Posted by wade

Did I misunderstand you? If so, I'm sorry.

No problem, you're right though, I did say it.

I guess what I thought I was saying (over all if it didn't come through clearly) is that I'm quite sure he knows what he's talking about. If he says he found some amount of venom production in rat snakes, I believe him that he did. And that technically makes them 'venomous'.. My point was that nobody need worry about corn snake bites any more than they did before finding this out. I think the main significance (as I took it anyway, I may be wrong) of what he's saying, is what it tells us about their evolution. Maybe when he says that the concept of being 'venomous' is more or less more complicated than just "will it hurt people" if we are bitten by them, is something that worries me though. It does because though WE may understand that, it could be getting the wrong message out there. When we say, "Ok, rat snakes are now venomous" people that don't have the patience for all the information will get the wrong idea.
Can you imagine the hype that could be made by those who don't like reptiles as pets? PETA would sure love that headline.. "Corn Snakes found to produce Cobra Venom!!!"

lol..yeah, and there would be an international bann..ha...it would be ugly..we'd have to smuggle them into our homes inside VCR's...lol...I just dont know now'a'days..

Originally Posted by snakewispera snr

Yeeer man I see it too.......

Sorry I mean yes I see what you mean....
No I mean I know what you mean but I'm too shallow to think too much about it..... But I believe you... And thats what counts in the grand scheme of things....LOL

BTW..that whole speel was not herb induced..I haven't done that since Fr. year in high school..just me pickin' my own brain..lol

Originally Posted by tom e

people that don't have the patience for all the information will get the wrong idea.
Can you imagine the hype that could be made by those who don't like reptiles as pets? PETA would sure love that headline.. "Corn Snakes found to produce Cobra Venom!!!"

That could be Tom. But then, we have been selling venomous Hog Nose snakes for a long time without issue. Tarantulas are all venomous but not dangerous. Poison Dart frogs. There are lots of things that are venomous but are not dangerous. (I know poison darts are poisonous and not venomous, don't write me a letter).

Originally Posted by tom e

No problem, you're right though, I did say it.

I guess what I thought I was saying (over all if it didn't come through clearly) is that I'm quite sure he knows what he's talking about. If he says he found some amount of venom production in rat snakes, I believe him that he did. And that technically makes them 'venomous'.. My point was that nobody need worry about corn snake bites any more than they did before finding this out. I think the main significance (as I took it anyway, I may be wrong) of what he's saying, is what it tells us about their evolution. Maybe when he says that the concept of being 'venomous' is more or less more complicated than just "will it hurt people" if we are bitten by them, is something that worries me though. It does because though WE may understand that, it could be getting the wrong message out there. When we say, "Ok, rat snakes are now venomous" people that don't have the patience for all the information will get the wrong idea.
Can you imagine the hype that could be made by those who don't like reptiles as pets? PETA would sure love that headline.. "Corn Snakes found to produce Cobra Venom!!!"

Please no one let ANY of the shipping companies know this either. We have enough problems with them already. Rich should just bury this thread in his backyard and we should never mention cornsnakes and venom in the same sentence, much less think about the two...

Originally Posted by *salAMANDA88*

BTW..that whole speel was not herb induced..I haven't done that since Fr. year in high school..just me pickin' my own brain..lol

Sorry I was playing..... Though my shpeel was alcohol induced if it's any consolation...LOL

Originally Posted by ForkedTung

Please no one let ANY of the shipping companies know this either. We have enough problems with them already. Rich should just bury this thread in his backyard and we should never mention cornsnakes and venom in the same sentence, much less think about the two...

I think corns have advanced as far as to not producing any venom at all now....
It's Rats that still produce a very small quantity of the hard stuff....
And in reality the mechanism isn't there for envenomation... Or the quantities to make it dangerous... But it is linked to the 3FTx venom and their isn't any need to produce an anti venom serum... So out of the four things that determine how dangerous a snakes bite is the two main factors in envenomation are missing..... Though if it did get you, your stuffed due to the last one... No serum...LOL... Though as we all know that ain't ever going to happen...... Otherwise Hoggies would be on the list already....

Originally Posted by *salAMANDA88*

This really makesme wonder tho...and maybe this is me reading into this too far...but, I just got doen watching a show where they were working with chicken DNA, and they found out how to turn on and off certian genes that have been "Physically" lost through eveolution...and results were. they could make a chicken have a longet tail..and make a chicken grow teeth...they just used some, amino acid..(I believe)...to turn the selected genes on and off...and ovbiousley these genes were passed down from their early..reptile-like ancestors....(kinda a kick to the teeth to people who dont believe in evolution...HA! HA!.."we told ya so!)
anyway...what I am wondering is...I bet all snakes..way, deep down in their genes carry the ability to produce venom.... its just a matter of it being the right time to have that ability turned on or off.a way of eveolution and maybe natural slection...Because your genome is kinda like'a timeline in a way that you will always carry a blue print of what was...and whats now...It does make you wonder tho....what we could create, with a little knowledge....My god this stuff just sucks me in....lol..sorry for the long reply!

I'm inclined to disagree, I know I am the minority on this forum but I personally do not believe in macroevo.(the evolution from one species to another) I do believe in microevo.(the mutations and adaptations within a species) I would be hard pressed to find someone that can disprove micro evolution. Given my beliefs have their roots in my religion and I do not mean to start any kind of negative conversation but I think that in time the chickens that were mentioning simply did not have a need for certain attributes that were once needed in the past. Not eating meat any more, ok no teeth, no need for a tail, alright short tail, no need to fly because all the food they need they can get from the ground, muscles in their wings began over time to get weaker and weaker and they can no longer fly. This can also be applied to the venom in snakes, although I was under the impression that the species that use constriction as a way to kill were the inferior species and the more advanced were the venomous. So I am curious if this means that it is the other way around?? Very interesting results. Just my .02, feel free to start a Christian witch hunt

Originally Posted by onelifetolive45

I was under the impression that the species that use constriction as a way to kill were the inferior species and the more advanced were the venomous. So I am curious if this means that it is the other way around?? Very interesting results. Just my .02, feel free to start a Christian witch hunt

No witch hunt...... No one can prove you wrong in your theory.... So it's as valid as any other...IMO....
I added this as you sound like your interested..

http://venomdoc.com/

This is where the OP started this debate from....