Controversial Topic #3: Replies to "Newbs"

Originally Posted by Serpwidgets

Sure, there are groups formed. I think it would be crazy to try to say there aren't. But I also would have to say it's a good thing that members of a community like each other.

Yep! Otherwise, I'd have been SBLOUNSKCHED from the gang a long time ago.

However, what makes this board different from every other forum I've been a member of (a lot of forums, on a lot of different topics) is that when there is a disagreement about any issue here, there is no "everyone must agree with the group" mentality. The "senior" members will post an entire spectrum of of opinions that contradict many of the other people who are supposedly of the "same group" as themselves.

Well, yes and no. I will, on occasion (and far more often in chat than on the boards), see elements of 'groupthink' regarding a particular issue or person. I recently opined this about a particular (I'll be civil and refer to it here in public as a "Coterie-Onanism") situation in chat a couple of days ago , and I'd say the response I received was lukewarm. It was as if I showed my dog a card trick. Don't get me wrong, though. I knew I'd be able to opine without being chastised.

With the exception of being referred to as an "enabler", that is.

regards,
jazz

Originally Posted by zwyatt

If they appear to stick together, it's probably because they've been learning about this hobby together and from one another for the last several years.

I've been to a dinner at Tinley, I have formed friendships here, and in turn, learned from and taught others. But that does not correlate to willingness of the individuals in said group to help out noobs, which seemed to be kimbyra's point. And that was what I was addressing.

I think the important difference here is to discern that there are 'groups' formed, but not cliques (at least by my estimation).

There are going to be inside jokes that not everyone is going to understand (and may even be the butt of).

No doubt! Zach, if I said "Oooooooop!" to you, would you know the appropriate response?

And yet, "inside jokes" are a defining characteristic of a clique. Please, expand on your response before you're ousted from the inner circle.

regards,
jazz

Originally Posted by jazzgeek

I've been to a dinner at Tinley, I have formed friendships here, and in turn, learned from and taught others.

regards,
jazz

Yep dinner in the lounge! Does that make us a Clique or a Gang? I too have made some friendships here and some I have met personally, I think I am a better person for it. So YES there are some here I feel a bit tighter with. Doesnt stop me from trying to answer newbie questions. And the tone, grammar, and general willingness of the person to listen all effect how and if I will respond. The l33t sp33k and other nonsense dribble some of the younger members of this board use is not the proper way to be taken seriously. Just more of my opinions so. Please Carry on.

Josh

Originally Posted by jazzgeek

No doubt! Zach, if I said "Oooooooop!" to you, would you know the appropriate response?

Well...uhhh... I feel so unwanted here...

Originally Posted by jazzgeek

Please, expand on your response before you're ousted from the inner circle.

Well, this line was fitting. After I read you're response to my quote:

If they appear to stick together, it's probably because they've been learning about this hobby together and from one another for the last several years.

I realized I didn't really finish my thought. I meant to say that having learned together for the last several years, they have learned what works and what doesn't. As such, the advice they give may seem to just be an echo of what their "buddies" have said and appear cliquish, but it's just that they've learned the same lessons over the years and have many of the same experiences (so their advice/etc is going to sound the same. Any better?

Much better. You may remain in the Gang Zach. You are hearby reinstated to grand Poop on...or is that Poobah? The one thing that I can say about this group is that it doesn't really seem to matter if you've been in it for a while or not. If there's a get together, all are welcome. No one cares if you just got on the forum or been her a hundred years. Lets keep that wonderful thought in mind! I find it's true of most reptile people.

Originally Posted by Serpwidgets

....to read posts that are written as if the person was typing while wearing boxing gloves.

Originally Posted by jazzgeek

How can you do that?

regards,
jazz

Dang, beat me to it.

Originally Posted by zwyatt

As such, the advice they give may seem to just be an echo of what their "buddies" have said and appear cliquish, but it's just that they've learned the same lessons over the years and have many of the same experiences (so their advice/etc is going to sound the same. Any better?

A little bit. Again, I was referring to the willingness of a 'veteran' to answer a noob's question - which, imo, has nothing to do with whether or not they've befriended a stadium full of people here on the boards. It's more a matter of tolerance of the factors I cited above.

Another thing to bear in mind is that (praise be to the deity of your choice) corns are a very forgiving species in terms of husbandry compared to other snakes. This allows a lot of latitude with certain husbandry practices (one man's sports section is another man's aspen) - but I cringe and want to spay/neuter the offender of certain other husbandry practices (cohabitation of juvies which result in "unplanned" clutches, causing prolapsed organs by squeezing a snake like a tube of toothpaste, etc....).

Is that a function of "shared experience"? Nope, it's a function of experienced, passionate individual keepers seeing those who shouldn't be allowed to breed within our species keeping and sometimes breeding their "pets". But I think that creates a massive base, guttoral reaction (among those who are devoted to this hobby) of outrage...which thereby creates a more cohesive core group.

In the rabbinical tradition, here's the "on the other hand".....the razor's edge of this is when that group ends up "hating the sinner and not the sin". I've seen that all too often here, and am guilty of it sometimes myself.

Then I remember that I was a noob once.....and heeded the advice of my research. And therein lies the difference. If a noobie is simply looking for confirmation of what s/he wants to hear, there's gonna be trouble in Cornsnake City.

Sorry about the soapbox mode. I was just riffin'.


regards,
jazz

To defend myself a little, even though its probably not really needed, what I was responding to was the term "groups" that was insinuating a clique that excluded and trivialized others, not a group of buddies and fellow herpers.

Also, I was talking about a 10 year old in my post, not a 13 year old (someone else said 13 I think), and that really makes a big difference. I have seen someone post that even claimed to be 8. Ya can't expect an 8 year old to post like a 25+ year old.

All I'm trying to say is we can't expect everyone to be able to post well, and "search", and research, etc., because everyone is coming from a different place, and a different level of interacting on the net/in forums.

We should be able to expect, however, average adults to post well and use their noggins on the forum. The lazy/rude/obnoxious/attention seeking ones are the ones that get my goat. Surely no one has to have patience for them, but then I'm slipping over to the other topic... oops.

Originally Posted by MohrSnakes

A+ there! Hijacking the threads to unrelated topics sometimes seems like a new members duty. I love it ( ) when my for sale ads are hijacked with statements like:

I saw you are selling an albino. Man, I wish we had albino corns in Mongolia. One time I saw one in a pet store. They are cool.

And then someone else takes it from there and my for sale ad has turned into a talk about albino corns!

Oh my god..... That has happened to me nearly everytime I place an ad ....I eventually end up deleting it. I enjoy meeting new people on this forum, but I wish more people would utilize the Private Message function. Really no complaits here.....I mean, as someone else put it.....it just snakes.

Chris

Originally Posted by jazzgeek

A little bit. Again, I was referring to the willingness of a 'veteran' to answer a noob's question - which, imo, has nothing to do with whether or not they've befriended a stadium full of people here on the boards. It's more a matter of tolerance of the factors I cited above.

I guess I've got a little more air clearing to do

IIRC, none of my comments from two posts back were spefically addressing what you had said about willingness to help (unless I quoted you, did I?). I can't remember now who I was addressing. And my last post was just trying to clarify what my previous post meant. Confused yet??

Anyways, I agree about willingness having nothing to do with how many friends you've got. Each individual can only take so much drivel before they plug their ears/eyes to it.