stupid breeders why cant you just leave things be

Gerards said:

SnakeAround said:

I really don't have a problem with them. The problem is what happens to the stuff I like to work with because of people that don't care and aren't smart enough to understand the affects their actions have on others. I'm sorry if you think your one of them. I didn't single anyone out, Ryan and I are on good terms. If he makes it to Daytona we can go bass fishing if he likes. You understand to make the hybrids you need those imported snakes you say don't matter. If I need to tell you why they are important, I don't care what your IQ is, you are not smart in this situation.

Where did I have a foul mouth? I didn't say one bad word.........just my opinions, you know, the same stuff you said.

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Glad you seem to be able to word stuff more friendly and clear now, good! I still do wonder what you would say about people you do have problems with... calling people lazy, greedy may not be the exact meaning of faul but it sure is insulting.

I feel like finally we can have a solid, civil discussion now. I do understand that you feel bad about the stuff you like being threatened, of course. But that does not give you the right to tell people who like other stuff that they are wrong, greedy, lazy and such. That is not gonna get you anywhere either, trying to educate people. I think you are very passionate, which makes you forget sometimes that not everybody shares your passion, and that does not mean they have low standards, just different.

I think fishing for fun is cruelty. Do I jump at you telling you you have low standards? I cannot understand the joy of it to be honest, but I've learned that people who like to fish are not bad people per se because they don't do it because they like to inflict harm to the fish. Well, breeders of hybrids do not intend to inflict pain on the animals or purist breeders, for that matter. Please try to respect them as long as they care for their animals correctly. I do respect breeders whom want to maintain certain species, it is just not my cup of tea. Of course I felt addressed, I told I breed hybrids, you talked breeders of hybrids down. However, I am not someone to get mad or develop bad feelings about someone easily, so as far as I'm concerned we are still on good terms, if that even applies to a strictly virtual relation

Well, if certain imported species cease to excist in captivity in a country I can get them from, I'll have to find other snakes I like to breed... but, the argument about needing them for making hybrids actually made sense to me. A good reason for breeders of hybrids to respect your efforts and maybe even do their own part of it!

You did say that the fact that I don't get the importance of what you are trying to tell us says a lot (or enough ro such) about my intelligence, so do not chance that into something else, naughty boy

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Ryan Beatty said:

Doug, "freezer fodder"? So you would throw a perfectly healthy snake into the freezer to freeze to death? Man I wouldn't want to be a snake in your collection.

Gerards, I really like the looks of those brooks. I'd be interested in a pair if you intend to breed them. (I won't make hybrids out of them, I promise.)

More pics for the pro-hybrid crowds viewing pleasure:

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starsevol said:

Doug didn't coin the freezer fodder phrase, I did! And just to clear things up, just because I refer to hybrids as "freezer fodder" does not mean that I would harm a perfectly healthy snake IN ANY WAY.
I have a 16 year old female that I suspect of being a rootbeer and also an ultra cinder. Still not sure whether or not I will be breeding the cinder, maybe if I could do a loan with a golddust male (she is possibly het for caramel).

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starsevol said:

Doug didn't coin the freezer fodder phrase, I did! And just to clear things up, just because I refer to hybrids as "freezer fodder" does not mean that I would harm a perfectly healthy snake IN ANY WAY.
I have a 16 year old female that I suspect of being a rootbeer and also an ultra cinder. Still not sure whether or not I will be breeding the cinder, maybe if I could do a loan with a golddust male (she is possibly het for caramel).

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SnakeAround said:

How do you do that if you get physically ill seeing hybrids?

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cmalchow said:

I maybe interesting in doing something like that Beth. I have a Golddust Mot.

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SnakeAround said:

@starsevol: Ok, so it is only the obvious hybrids from two different species which have that effect on you?

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SnakeAround said:

Gerards said:

Glad you seem to be able to word stuff more friendly and clear now, good! I still do wonder what you would say about people you do have problems with... calling people lazy, greedy may not be the exact meaning of faul but it sure is insulting.

I feel like finally we can have a solid, civil discussion now. I do understand that you feel bad about the stuff you like being threatened, of course. But that does not give you the right to tell people who like other stuff that they are wrong, greedy, lazy and such. That is not gonna get you anywhere either, trying to educate people. I think you are very passionate, which makes you forget sometimes that not everybody shares your passion, and that does not mean they have low standards, just different.

I think fishing for fun is cruelty. Do I jump at you telling you you have low standards? I cannot understand the joy of it to be honest, but I've learned that people who like to fish are not bad people per se because they don't do it because they like to inflict harm to the fish. Well, breeders of hybrids do not intend to inflict pain on the animals or purist breeders, for that matter. Please try to respect them as long as they care for their animals correctly. I do respect breeders whom want to maintain certain species, it is just not my cup of tea. Of course I felt addressed, I told I breed hybrids, you talked breeders of hybrids down. However, I am not someone to get mad or develop bad feelings about someone easily, so as far as I'm concerned we are still on good terms, if that even applies to a strictly virtual relation

Well, if certain imported species cease to excist in captivity in a country I can get them from, I'll have to find other snakes I like to breed... but, the argument about needing them for making hybrids actually made sense to me. A good reason for breeders of hybrids to respect your efforts and maybe even do their own part of it!

You did say that the fact that I don't get the importance of what you are trying to tell us says a lot (or enough ro such) about my intelligence, so do not chance that into something else, naughty boy

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I do think it is lazy and stupid and when those people's actions affect what I and most people in this hobby(not this forum) likes to do, I have the right to say it. If your not someone that does that then my comments should not affect you at all. Your attitude towards the importance of having these species available to the future herpers is why we don't get along. Comparing fishing, something that doesn't affect what you do and breeding animals that affect what I want and love is a poor example. Not intending to do harm with your snakes doesn't mean you are not doing it. You say it's your right to breed what ever you want but it doesn't matter if you remove something I want to do. This is my problem, it's all about you and not about us. There is a way that we can both get our ways. Ryan says, if he produces something that looks like the natural phenotype, he keeps it. Only the completely unique animals end up with people, the "normal" type don't end up being wholesaled out to end up affecting me. Trying to make people not do something is unlikely, people doing their best to be professional and think about the whole picture is my goal. I don't know you, if your not the person I was talking bad about, don't take offense to it. If your are a professional and not in it for yourself, you should agree with me, it serves you too.

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Ryan Beatty said:

Doug, "freezer fodder"? So you would throw a perfectly healthy snake into the freezer to freeze to death? Man I wouldn't want to be a snake in your collection.

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DMong said:

That's just it Ryan, I don't have anything here in my collection that is worthy of being "freezer fodder".

BTW, your photos and your kind abomination offers don't irritate me in the least, so thanks, but I will happily pass on those. It only makes my earlier point that much more reinforced when I said that any good valid points brought up for not dispersing crosses/hybrids into the hobby mainstream would be totally ignored by you and some of the others in the first place.

Incidentally, here are just a few snakes here in my collection that you WON'T ever be owning to ruin. I am quite certain that you don't even know what kind half of these even are, but that is probably just as well. I also included a nice little wild-collected corn in there for some of the other corn folks viewing pleasure.

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