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Feeders Any and all issues about raising rats, mice, or anything else that you feed your cornsnakes.

The Great Reptilinks Experiment!
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Old 02-10-2016, 10:11 AM   #31
Haarstad
Wow.. I never attacked you with my original post... Read it with a calm voice in mind... Check it again.

Calling you a troll because you over reacted is totally a legitimate thing to do btw. It's kinda like stating the obvious but I kept it private..

I'm sorry, but with all those caps, it's hard to tell if I'm speaking to a child or an adult with mental instability.. You need to retract your head from places, and insert foot in mouth...

Did you just learn how to quote as well? I'm pretty sure people can figure out what you're talking about without having your post repeat everything..

This will be the last time I acknowledge your existence since you are obviously a child, you can have the last word...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Old 02-10-2016, 11:30 AM   #32
BeauBoi
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haarstad View Post
Wow.. I never attacked you with my original post... Read it with a calm voice in mind... Check it again.

Calling you a troll because you over reacted is totally a legitimate thing to do btw. It's kinda like stating the obvious but I kept it private..

I'm sorry, but with all those caps, it's hard to tell if I'm speaking to a child or an adult with mental instability.. You need to retract your head from places, and insert foot in mouth...

Did you just learn how to quote as well? I'm pretty sure people can figure out what you're talking about without having your post repeat everything..

This will be the last time I acknowledge your existence since you are obviously a child, you can have the last word...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yea, your STILL throwing around insults, really mature.

Look up the definition of Troll, it fits you way better than me.

You are the one who took offense to something I said that wasn't even addressed to you.

Then you made a post to me that was condescending and offensive (Hint: starting a post with "Some people..." is rarely taken well).

Then you chose to harass me with an insulting pm, the title of which was an act of name calling, with the additional arrogance added in of saying that everyone on this forum had "lost respect for me" because I disagreed with you.

Yes, you DO need to grow up and probably get reading lessons if your having trouble following along.

~Beau
 
Old 02-10-2016, 12:20 PM   #33
DuxorW
This argument really doesn't belong in the thread. This isn't the ball python forums...
 
Old 02-10-2016, 12:54 PM   #34
Dragonling
I'm not a moderator, so I'm not sure why you're both PMing me. I know as much as any how much it sucks when someone says something you strongly disagree with or that you find insulting or mean, but the world isn't sunshine and rainbows, and that's especially true on the internet. I am often vocal in my disagreements as well, so I feel like this is a good lesson for me, too. If you guys can't show a modicum of professionalism and apologize to each other, the least you can do is just drop it.
 
Old 02-11-2016, 09:47 AM   #35
Nanci
Okay- everyone calm down. Quit with the name calling.
 
Old 02-11-2016, 01:21 PM   #36
El Jefe
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeauBoi View Post
Sure, adult snakes sometimes eat small sized rabbits. Now, please post a picture of a hatchling eating a rabbit, since reptilinks make "pinkie-sized links for hatchlings.
~Beau
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeauBoi View Post
While you are at it, please post a corn snake of ANY size eating a deer in the wild.
~Beau
The ole "what they eat in the wild" is always an interesting debate as most everyone feeds newborn mice to freshly hatched corns. In the wild, the chief food of young corns will be lizards, not pinkie mice. How far off is rabbit or deer, no idea but if someone actually did the proper experimental design it would be a neat study.
 
Old 02-12-2016, 01:20 PM   #37
Kevin S.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeauBoi View Post
Sure, adult snakes sometimes eat small sized rabbits. Now, please post a picture of a hatchling eating a rabbit, since reptilinks make "pinkie-sized links for hatchlings.
~Beau
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeauBoi View Post
Mice are cheaper, and are a whole food source that the snake has evolved to eat (as opposed to rabbit or deer).
Which is it-rabbits are unnatural prey that they didn't evolve to eat or adult snakes sometimes eat small rabbits? If I'm being really particular, domestic mice aren't what they "evolved to eat" either. Hispid cotton rats, eastern moles, white-footed mice, anoles, skinks, and young birds are some of the prey items they consume in different portions of their range and at different life stages. Now there's certainly no debate that sausage links of ground meat of any type aren't part of the natural diet. That doesn't necessarily mean they're bad to feed though and they certainly may be superior in some ways.

I posted this before and it seems like it may have been overlooked, so I'll repeat it. The rabbit links don't have twice as many calories per their nutritional chart, but they do have about 5% more protein and once the casing is digested, would presumably break down and be assimilated much more completely since it's just ground meat with more surface area. Mice with incisions in the skin lead to faster growth rates in corns since they digest more easily/completely. For that reason, I wouldn't be surprised if the snakes eating links grow faster even if calories, protein, and all other relevant factors are the same between the groups.

Or more simply put, if you got a bag of 100 mice and pulled 50 of them out to grind into sausage links, I feel confident that the sausage links would lead to faster growth and superior nutrient retention since they would be more digestible and require less metabolic energy to break down when compared with the unaltered mice. Sure it's not the most naturalistic thing, but neither is thawing out a frozen rodent to feed to a snake on aspen bedding in a plastic box. If the desired outcome is superior growth/nutrition, it seems to me that the links would have to be a viable option if they are truly comprised of ground whole prey items. The sausage casings may be a confounding variable, but since they're supposed to be made entirely of beef protein and gelatin, that should just add to their nutritional profile.
 
Old 02-12-2016, 04:22 PM   #38
daddio207
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin S. View Post
Which is it-rabbits are unnatural prey that they didn't evolve to eat or adult snakes sometimes eat small rabbits? If I'm being really particular, domestic mice aren't what they "evolved to eat" either. Hispid cotton rats, eastern moles, white-footed mice, anoles, skinks, and young birds are some of the prey items they consume in different portions of their range and at different life stages. Now there's certainly no debate that sausage links of ground meat of any type aren't part of the natural diet. That doesn't necessarily mean they're bad to feed though and they certainly may be superior in some ways.

I posted this before and it seems like it may have been overlooked, so I'll repeat it. The rabbit links don't have twice as many calories per their nutritional chart, but they do have about 5% more protein and once the casing is digested, would presumably break down and be assimilated much more completely since it's just ground meat with more surface area. Mice with incisions in the skin lead to faster growth rates in corns since they digest more easily/completely. For that reason, I wouldn't be surprised if the snakes eating links grow faster even if calories, protein, and all other relevant factors are the same between the groups.

Or more simply put, if you got a bag of 100 mice and pulled 50 of them out to grind into sausage links, I feel confident that the sausage links would lead to faster growth and superior nutrient retention since they would be more digestible and require less metabolic energy to break down when compared with the unaltered mice. Sure it's not the most naturalistic thing, but neither is thawing out a frozen rodent to feed to a snake on aspen bedding in a plastic box. If the desired outcome is superior growth/nutrition, it seems to me that the links would have to be a viable option if they are truly comprised of ground whole prey items. The sausage casings may be a confounding variable, but since they're supposed to be made entirely of beef protein and gelatin, that should just add to their nutritional profile.
Well put ..................
 
Old 02-12-2016, 05:46 PM   #39
DuxorW
Well, the animals didn't grow any faster on the rabbit/chicken links. It's possible that if the experiment were done for longer that a modest increase in growth rate would have been observed, but I would expect it to be small if it is there at all. I had similar expectations that even if there aren't more calories in the links that they would be assimilated more easily, resulting in improved growth, but we don't always get the result we expect.
 

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