susang
New member
Because you have contained in quotes I'm hoping contained is in your jeans pocket and it bites you:sidestep: Break the rules and pay the price, so you ??? swells up like the Hindenburg. What do we know about shows or snakes.
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How to prep a snake for "walking" in a reptile show?
- Thread starter nfafan
- Start date
Because you have contained in quotes I'm hoping contained is in your jeans pocket and it bites you:sidestep: Break the rules and pay the price, so you ??? swells up like the Hindenburg. What do we know about shows or snakes.
crackerhead
Hug Free Zone
The show I do each month originated as a Swap. It is far from it's beginnings but still allows patrons to bring animals in to sell without purchasing a table (limited to one free and then a $5 per charge for any additional). All previous posters are correct in their thoughts on how vendors feel about the "walkers"
(not to be confused with the Walking Dead kind). Forgetting the comfort of the animal (not something I say lightly), the liability is a BIG concern (and it is as much your's as it is the event planner's). I've witnessed little kids get bitten on the face from animals people were blithely carrying around. Keep in mind these are not domesticated animals and are therefore far more unpredictable. The buyer will most likely want to handled his new purchase. So even if you intend on keeping it contained that goes out the window when a buyer arrives.
Plus Susang brings up a very important point. What responsible owner would purchase an animal from a person they don't know and will most likely never see again? Let alone a venomous one at that! There are much better ways of finding a new home for an animal and walking around a show isn't at the top of the list.
Terri
(not to be confused with the Walking Dead kind). Forgetting the comfort of the animal (not something I say lightly), the liability is a BIG concern (and it is as much your's as it is the event planner's). I've witnessed little kids get bitten on the face from animals people were blithely carrying around. Keep in mind these are not domesticated animals and are therefore far more unpredictable. The buyer will most likely want to handled his new purchase. So even if you intend on keeping it contained that goes out the window when a buyer arrives. Plus Susang brings up a very important point. What responsible owner would purchase an animal from a person they don't know and will most likely never see again? Let alone a venomous one at that! There are much better ways of finding a new home for an animal and walking around a show isn't at the top of the list.
Terri
Heck, when Connie and I would do shows, we never felt safe at shows that had hots. So we stopped doing them. Over the years we have found quite a few escapees from other vendors and certainly every show had one or more announcement about a vendor asking others to be on the lookout for something that got away from them. That would be ALL we would need to be packing up at the end of the show and find a mamba underneath our tables.
Sorry, I just did not trust the competence of other people, from what I had seen of the manner their hots were packaged, to keep them secure, and I just refused to expose myself nor my wife to their possible negligence.
All it would take is one child being bitten by a hot at a show, and reptile shows would be over with, legislated out of existence.
Oh yeah, just to elaborate, those were never HOTS that we found escaped. But obviously if nonvenomous would escape from vendors with relative frequency, it doesn't take a big stretch of the imagination to presume that hots could also get away from some vendor sooner or later.
THANK YOU! You were the only one to answer my question - how to keep my snake - any stay-at-home snake - from feeling insane at a reptile show.
Everyone else just lambasted me, as if I were taking a meal from their mouth by bringing a snake that may/may not even sell.
diamondlil
Mice! They taste so nice!
I haven't got a dog in this race, for a start I'm in a different country and for another I don't sell at shows. So this is nothing personal. Best you check with the show organisers if they will allow you to 'walk' your snake there. Why not just avoid the possible complicatons already mentioned and put it up for sale through local ads or online?
beautifullywild77
Go Penguins!!!
I think more had issue with it being venomous rear fangs and you wanting to walk around a show with it, trying to sell it!
But I could be wrong...
But I could be wrong...
chris68
Arundel Reptiles
No, everybody gave you advice which you'll probably ignore, possibly to your own detriment. Why is it when people hear what they don't want to hear they are being "lambasted"?
What you do as a member of the reptile community affects us all, so by all means ignore the good advice given to you and possibly make it that much harder for the rest of us
Pitbullgirl16
New member
I'm new and it isn't like I'm a breeder and sell at shows, but it's common sense. I don't see at all how you were lambasted. I see a lot of people who have very much experience in this business and are trying to bring to light for you that this would be a very irresponsible move on your behalf to walk the snake, especially a venomous one in to a show like that knowing there are risks such as the ones that were brought up in this discussion. Why risk something that could go wrong very quickly, when there are better alternatives? To go about it anyway, knowing there are dangers to doing such would be extremely irresponsible and selfish.
Not to mention that if he does ignore the advice, and that snake bites someone at the show, it can now be proven that he knowingly and willingly exposed the victim to the danger of envenomation from a venomous reptile.
You aren't being "lambasted", bub. We're just trying to give you advice to try to keep you from doing something ill advised.
http://www.reptileforums.co.uk/forums/snakes/350851-false-water-cobra-bite-30-a.html
No a bite likely won't kill someone. Unless they have an allergic reaction. But your name WILL show up in the newspapers as a result. They might even name the law in your honor that bans venomous snakes from Pennsylvania completely. Think of all the people who will thank you for that....
BloodyBaroness
Captain Titsworth
True, you only say you got "lambasted" because you are not hearing what you want to hear.
You asked for opinions and got them from people trying to help you make good choices and not doing something that can put people or the animal in a bad situation.
You asked for opinions and got them from people trying to help you make good choices and not doing something that can put people or the animal in a bad situation.
MegF.
That's for sale???
Reticon in Columbia routinely has people selling snakes by walking around. As far as FWC's, they are not on any venomous list despite their being rear fanged. They are not considered medically important and even Florida does not list them on venomous lists. If I'm going to a show it's local so I feed mine 4 days before so they are fed but have digested. FWC's are rapid metabolizers so there should be no issue of them not having digested after 4 days. My 7 footers want to eat 2 days after eating. If you're traveling I would refrain from selling although I have to say, a ravenous FWC is nothing to be trifled with! Mine are pretty voracious although only the male shows aggressive tendencies when feeding time comes around. Probably due to the fact he has full vision and my female is partially blind. He is pure nuts when he's hungry though.
DragonsDenSerpents
Murphy's Guinea Pig
Not even taking into account the type of snake or the fact that most vendors (myself included) don't care for "walkers," I'd be worried about possible transmission of disease. What if someone had just handled a snake or lizard with mites or something contagious and your snake gets it? I very rarely take snakes out at expos for that reason and have a huge bottle of sanitizer at the ready. I know the sanitizer won't do much against, say, crypto, but it gives me mental comfort.
susang
New member
For me lambasting you it is more of an ethical thing, vendors pay for the right to sell, you are a free loader, just because others do it doesn't make it OK. As far as the venomous issue, that would also be ethically wrong, again what if you can't contain it and it bites someone. I would not want that guilt on my back, that is if you even would feel guilt about it. Yup I will admit I lambasted you, you want the rules changed to suit you, but who are you and why. People like you have the potential to give snake keepers a bad name.
MegF.
That's for sale???
Geez folks...I sell at the shows and I don't care if someone wants to walk around and try to trade or sell their snake. The risk is their's as far as getting mites but my stock has the same risk. I do allow people to handle the snakes they may want to purchase but I do require they sanitize first. Never had a problem in 7 years. As far as the FWC's being venomous...they are but they aren't all that....they are on no venomous lists and I did extensive studies including contacting Dr. Frye and a German physician who studies toxicity of venoms before getting my first one. There have been no known fatalities or even serious evenomations by FWC's. There has been a person who suffered a vaso-vagal response and passed out and one person with an allergy who needed to go to the doctor but although the venom appears to be potent, they have a poor delivery system. Frankly a hog nose poses as much threat as a FWC if allowed to chew. A bite would just be a bite. Painful if the animal is large or catches you in a sensitive spot but nothing more. A large specimen would certainly deliver a painful bite. Some time ago on the venomous forums I came across a video put out by Nigel Marvin being chewed on by a FWC he caught in Brazil. I e-mailed him to find out just what the result of that long chewing did. He responded and told me that he had bleeding and swelling (although the chewing and mangling of his knuckle would have gotten swelling anyway) but it went away in 24 hours and he never stopped filming. Here is a picture of his hand he sent me. The FWC is not the horribly dangerous snakes you make them out to be. Might as well be terrified of your hoggy...The bite Nigel sustained probably went on for at least 5 minutes...certainly long enough to envenomate him thoroughly...she definitely made mincemeat out of his knuckle...I can attest that the full sized adults have a strong bite! Smaller animals would pose no more threat than any other snake at a show.
gelshark
 
So you openly support the people that go out of the way to break the rules of the shows they go to?
Do you also support the people that shipped out snakes without following the proper regulations that made it so that UPS stopped allowing people to ship snakes through them?
What other actions will you support that will make it more difficult for people that enjoy this hobby to be allowed to practice this hobby?
BloodyBaroness
Captain Titsworth
Okay, you spend a good deal of time and money to pay for tables, transport animals, set up show worthy displays and tell me it does not bother you that someone can "walk" around and sell animals in the aisles for the mere price of $12.
Bull crap.
I don't care if you don't care. Show policy is show policy. I will never advocate someone skirting rules, none of the vendors I work with do either.
We don't even let walkers near our table. At the last Columbia show there was a guy walking around with a boa that was dripping mites off it.
There is a line between ethics and stupidity.
Telling someone it's no big deal to walk around with a FWC is highly stupid. I've seen plenty of bite accidents at reptile shows from non-venomous animals that were very bad, imagine if it was a FWC inflicting those bites. Lethal or not, those are painful bites and what if someone has an allergic reaction? Do you really want that on your head?
Why not just do the safe and ethical thing from the start?
To shrug this off is the most irresponsible thing I have ever heard.
You should be advocating responsible husbandry and ethical behavior, not telling people it would pose no more of a thread than any other snake at the show while telling them it's okay to skirt the rules.
Ridiculous.
I can't wait to see how you back peddle over this one.
Ethics and responsibility should be every keepers #1 goal. If not, one highly publicized incident can be turned into knee jerk legislation.