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The Cultivars (morphs)/Genetics Issues Discussions about genetics issues and/or the various cultivars for cornsnakes commercially available. |
Ultra Mystery...
07-28-2004, 11:40 PM
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#21
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Ultra Ambers Het Motley 2004 Hatchlings
Here are a couple of the Ultra Ambers that I produced from the Group of Adults that I got from Mike Shivers and now I sold them to my pal Mike Panichi. I WANT THEM BACK!!! LOL!!!
Ken Siffert
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07-29-2004, 01:05 AM
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#22
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Ultra breeding results
Here are some of my results from breeding the Ultra Hypos. These babies are from a Butter Motley that was hatched by Mike Shiver from an Ultra to Ultra pairing, so I believe it is homo Ultra Hypo as well. As far as I can tell from what I have read in these posts is that people are considering that the Ultra Hypo gene is dominant to the standard hypo gene (I am very tired, but I want to contribute). I hope I am understanding this correctly. This male was bred to a ghost motley and all of the babies are just normal motleys. I hope others can make sense of what I am posting, because it is late and I have been overwhelmed with work and of course.....Corn snakes. The male was bred to a few others, that I will try and post the results of soon.
Take care,
Jason
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07-29-2004, 01:21 AM
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#23
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butter X ultra motley
I have three or four clutches to show here, but will only have time tonight to show one of them. The others will have to wait a day or two. 'Tis the season to be busy.
I bred a butter female I got back in 1996 to an ultra motley. I confess that I've never bred the butter to anything other than butters since I've had her so I don't know what else it might be het. for (if anything).
Here is the adult pair. Then, some of the babies. I got eight albinos, eight light hypos (presumably ultras) and five dark hypos. I'll get better comparison shots when I get a chance.
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07-29-2004, 01:50 AM
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#24
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Sheesh! And I thought what I already suspected about Hypomelanism was enough to drive us crazy. This is going to get insane......
I can't wait to try to explain to people that if you breed a GoldDust to an Amber you will just get Caramels, but breed it to a Butter and you will get Ambers.
And when they ask what those Ambers are het for, my head will burst into flames.
Does breeding GoldDust to GoldDust give you Siamese cats?
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07-29-2004, 11:47 AM
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#25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SODERBERGD
Here is the adult pair. Then, some of the babies. I got eight albinos, eight light hypos (presumably ultras) and five dark hypos. I'll get better comparison shots when I get a chance.
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This is the breeding I saw in the emails that really got me thinking that the Ultra is a possible allele with Amel. Are there other possibilities?
If the Ultra in this case was het for Amel and Hypo, which is extremely possible, and the Butter was het for Hypo, which is also possible, we may get results similar to this result. Homos for Amel Hypos, would most likely look different than the Hypos and Amels from the same clutch.
If the Butter was also het for Ultra, which seems unlikely, we could get very similar results as well. Amels, Ultras, Hypos, Amel Hypos, Amel Ultras, and Hypo Ultras would all be possible. Some may look the same, but some combos may look a little different as well.
Since the Standard Hypo has been introduced into the Ultra mix, by breeding them to Ambers, it would be possible to produce Ultras, Hypos and Hypo Ultras in the same clutch. It is very possible that they will all be a different phenotype. Now, with Caramel added to the mix, it is very possible to get three different phenotypes of an “Amber” looking Corn. Are some of the “Gold Dust” (Ultra Caramel) Corns actually Homo for Ultra, Hypo and Caramel? Will a Homo Ultra Caramel look the same or different than a Homo Hypo, Ultra, Caramel Corn? To complicate things further, the amel gene can be and will be added to some of the mixes.
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07-29-2004, 01:03 PM
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#26
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I'm with Joe and Rich. Insufficient data to make a decision, so far. IMHO, it would simplify the problem by going back to stock that have fewer mutations to confuse the issue.
FWIW, albino in the laboratory mouse is the equivalent of amelanistic in the corn snake. There are half a dozen alleles of albino in the lab mouse that reduce but do not eliminate black pigment. So I think the possibility that ultrahypo is an allele of amelanistic is definitely worth testing. But don't get your hopes up too much. Brutal facts slay beautiful theories with great regularity.
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07-29-2004, 01:53 PM
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#27
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ultra motley X blood
Here is the result of breeding the ultra motley male to one of my regular bloods. This female is not het. for amelanistic. I haven't counted these yet, but as you can see, they are all non hypos.
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07-29-2004, 02:37 PM
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#28
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Opal male to Ultra Hypo female
The ones Don hatched from the ultra motley male sure do resemble the ones from my clutch of Butter motley to Ghost motley.
These just started hatching yesterday. To say the least, I was quite surprised. The male is from Rich which I purchased in 02. All of the babies look the same as this one. It almost appears to be Ultra Hypo, but they don't look quite the same as the ones Mike Shiver produced. I saw every single clutch that he produced from the Ultra Hypos, and while these are similar they are not quite the same. They look somewhere between standard and ultra hypo.
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07-29-2004, 02:49 PM
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#29
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Quick Question
I'm seeing that the different hypo's has everyone pulling their hair out and i'm trying to keep up the best i can, but i gotta ask one thing just to be sure.
I'm aware that there is the "hypo" form and the "ultra" form but when i see people typing "ultra hypo", are they talking about the "ultra form of the hypo gene" or a combination of the 2?
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07-29-2004, 04:04 PM
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#30
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Ultra Hypo = Genotype Ultra
Usually, when you see Ultra Hypo it is referring to the single genotype Ultra Hypo. Just to recap, we have Standard Hypo Type A, Sunkissed Hypo Type B, Lava Hypo Type C and Ultra Hypo Type D so far. We could come up with a long list of Common Named Hypos.
When I refer to a corn that is double Homo for Hypo and Ultra, I always list them as Homo for both by adding the and or putting an apostrophe between them. I would like to list the Hypo first, to eliminate most of the confusion but I don‘t always do that. In this thread, it seems that when everybody refers to an Ultra Hypo it is the Single genotype of Ultra. They may also be Homo for Hypo but it is not known. It is also very possible for somebody to have a hypo out of Shivers Ultra project that they think is an Ultra, but is actually a Standard Hypo. Standard hypos can vary a great deal.
It seems as if we are being fairly consistent with the way each of us are referring to each genotype and phenotype when we talk about the Hypo group. Hypos have been discussed perhaps more than any other morph recently and we are starting to get our “Corn Jargon” down fairly well
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