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The Cultivars (morphs)/Genetics Issues Discussions about genetics issues and/or the various cultivars for cornsnakes commercially available.

View Poll Results: Peach hypo what do you think it should be called
peach hypo 11 22.00%
peach corn 4 8.00%
peach phase 4 8.00%
peach 31 62.00%
Voters: 50. You may not vote on this poll

peach hypo what do you think it should be called
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Old 09-05-2006, 10:12 PM   #81
Vinman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Serpwidgets
Ok, so putting this "in order," the first generation of the project was a lavender/diffused het charcoal/hypo crossed to a hypo/caramel het amel.

(The male wasn't a hypo since normals were produced, could be a mis-ID, could be it was homo charcoal and it has a mild effect. Anyway, it's not important because the second generation is the same hypo-wise either way.)

Rich Hume took normals from this cross which would be normals het for caramel, lavender, hypo, diffused, and possibly het charcoal, and bred them to each other. This resulted in his "peach" example.

Vinny took hypos het for caramel, lavender, diffused, and possibly het charcoal, and bred them to each other. This resulted in his "peach" examples.

The other thing to consider, IMO, is "was that first male actually a lavender pewter?" (How would anyone know by looking at it.) This would make the F1s all definite carriers of all 5 genes. Even if it was only het, there's still a reasonable chance they all picked up the charcoal gene.

So, at this point the most obvious guesses would be (hypo) Caramel Lavender, and (hypo) Caramel Charcoal. I don't see anything that has eliminated Charcoal from the possibilities yet.
no the male was a hypo lavender bloodrerd it is Rich Z main breeder male also The male could have been both hypo lavender bloodred and hypo petwer I asked him to prove it out but he didn't
 
Old 09-05-2006, 10:38 PM   #82
Billybobob
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
talked to rich humes wife on the phone he was not home . ball is in his court .rich z is a mod I'm sure if he wanted to he would have put his input . It would be nice. also I have no problem answering questions the only thing that I have is some of you think you can tell me what I can and can not do as far as the name.
Richard Hume was viewing this thread earlier today. I was hoping that he would clear up some of the questions that have been asked. But no luck, guess he did not want to be associated with the negativity you give off.
 
Old 09-05-2006, 10:41 PM   #83
Vinman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Billybobob
Richard Hume was viewing this thread earlier today. I was hoping that he would clear up some of the questions that have been asked. But no luck, guess he did not want to be associated with the negativity you give off.
I would take your own advice
 
Old 09-05-2006, 10:47 PM   #84
CornCrazy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
I asked him to prove it out but he didn't
And we are asking you to show us the results of YOU proving yours out. How can you be certain that charcoal is not in the mix, when you stated the following???
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
3 YEARS AGO I BRED A MALE HYPO LAVENDER BLOORRED HET FOR CHARCOAL GOST. TO A FEMALE AMBER HET FOR BUTTER
Obviously, the babies were possible het charcoal. Have you proven that your breeders aren't carrying the charcoal gene? Have you bred any of them to a charcoal.

And I know this has been said many times, but I had to post that I agree...this is a forum. It is a place for discussion. If you don't want to discuss, then you are in the wrong place. This world is made up of many different types of people. Those people have many different ideas. A smart person builds on the ideas of other people. If you would quit being so rude and hateful, then you might actually be able to see that we are all trying to help...NOT tell you what to do. It takes LOTS of input to make a well-informed decision...that goes for pretty much every aspect of life.

You sound like a little child...I don't care what you say! I'm gonna do it my way...SO THERE!
 
Old 09-05-2006, 10:58 PM   #85
Vinman
Quote:
Originally Posted by CornCrazy
And we are asking you to show us the results of YOU proving yours out. How can you be certain that charcoal is not in the mix, when you stated the following???
Obviously, the babies were possible het charcoal. Have you proven that your breeders aren't carrying the charcoal gene? Have you bred any of them to a charcoal.

And I know this has been said many times, but I had to post that I agree...this is a forum. It is a place for discussion. If you don't want to discuss, then you are in the wrong place. This world is made up of many different types of people. Those people have many different ideas. A smart person builds on the ideas of other people. If you would quit being so rude and hateful, then you might actually be able to see that we are all trying to help...NOT tell you what to do. It takes LOTS of input to make a well-informed decision...that goes for pretty much every aspect of life.

You sound like a little child...I don't care what you say! I'm gonna do it my way...SO THERE!
You just quoted me and I said that the hypo lavender can be a petwer at the same time what are you talking about That is part proving things out to prove the grandfather out first. that is why I asked rich to breed it to a charcoal.
the other thing Is I didnot wanted to be a thread but a poll I do have that choice so if I could have closed the thread from the start and kept the poll going I would have . Take about being child like take a look at you own post.
 
Old 09-05-2006, 11:16 PM   #86
CornCrazy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
You just quoted me and I said that the hypo lavender can be a petwer at the same time what are you talking about That is part proving things out to prove the grandfather out first. that is why I asked rich to breed it to a charcoal.
the other thing Is I didnot wanted to be a thread but a poll I do have that choice so if I could have closed the thread from the start and kept the poll going I would have . Takl about being child like take alookat you own post.
Rich is not the one saying what this snake is. It is not HIS responsibility to prove out his snake(s) in order to help you. It is YOUR responsibility to prove out your own. Breed your snakes to charcoals and prove them out. If you are not willing to PROVE what you have, then you will not get any respect here. No one wants to pay that much for an animal when he/she could be getting something totally different from what is expected.

As for my cute little emoticon...I simply used it to emphasize my point (and to try to lighten the mood). That point being that you sound like a child who insists on doing things his way regardless of the consequences. Believe me, most often the child ends up learning he was wrong and that he should have listened to the opinions of others.

Oh...and one more thing...regardless of your wants...this is a forum. ALL items posted here are up for discussion. That, once again, is the purpose of a forum.

You didn't get what you wanted. So what? Be a man and deal with it! Quit throwing a temper tantrum.

Ooooo...let me be childish again! Can I? Can I? Can I?

I thought it might be fun to throw a tantrum, too!
 
Old 09-05-2006, 11:20 PM   #87
Vinman
To all this my concern all questions are welcome all questions on what morphs my be in or not in the peach hypo are welcomed. My only problem is people telling me what I can or cant name the morph it is rich humes and my choice and thats that if you think it is rude that is your oppion This thred was not started to discuss the morph there is already a thread for that I started this for the poll only. I wanted to get feed back on the name that is all . there is 4 choices to choose from cast a vote. thank you
 
Old 09-05-2006, 11:27 PM   #88
CornCrazy
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
To all this my concern all questions are welcome all questions on what morphs my be in or not in the peach hypo are welcomed. My only problem is people telling me what I can or cant name the morph it is rich humes and my choice and thats that if you think it is rude that is your oppion This thred was not started to discuss the morph there is already a thread for that I started this for the poll only. I wanted to get feed back on the name that is all . there is 4 choices to choose from cast a vote. thank you
Vinny...you have read MUCH more into this discussion than there really is. NO ONE...NOT ONE SINGLE TIME...has said you guys can't choose the name you want. We are simply discussing and offering suggestions. Get over yourself.
 
Old 09-05-2006, 11:32 PM   #89
Richard Hume
My two cents

OK, here's the deal on these snakes, from my perspective. Three years ago, I acquired a trio of normal corns from Vin, het for multiple traits, as already discussed on this thread. Last year, I bred them and produced a multitude of different morphs, all of which I brought down to Daytona (where Chuck took that picture). Out of those two breedings in 2005, I produced:

Normals
Amels
Butters
Caramels
1.0 Caramel Blood
Blizzards
Bloodreds
Hypo Bloods
Lavenders
Hypo Lavenders
Pewters
The "What Is It?" snake (subject of this thread)

Chuck and I discussed what it might be in Daytona last year, and agreed that it might (emphasis on might) be an amber lavender, but whatever he was, it would have to be proven by test breedings.

First let me say that these animals are obviously het for two different types of hypo, one probably the standard hypo A, the other unknown. How do we know that? If Vin bred a hypo lavender blood to an amber (forget what they were het for, it doesn't matter in this instance) the results should have been all hypos. It was not - my trio are all normals, so there are two (incompatible) hypo genes at work here.

For the record, besides for what I kept back (just the "what is it" and the caramel blood) several groups of the hatchlings ended up with Tim Smith, Deb Cash and Gideon Hodulick. All are doing well, I have been advised of their progress.

Zoom ahead to this year. I decided to test the combination lavender/caramel theory - my friend Gideon Hodulick has a normal female, het for both lavender and caramel. So we bred him to the male from the above trio, to see if we would get any combination lavender/caramel homozygous animals. We got normals, lavenders and caramels, nothing particularly unique. Doesn't necessarily disprove the amber lavender theory, just (in my opinion) casts a little more doubt on it.

As to what we got out of the trio this year, more of the same from year one plus what we believe to be a hypo charcoal blood and blizzard blood (Tim Smith again has these) plus two caramel bloods. No "what is it" snakes this year, and no lavender bloods (what I really wanted out of this year's group - 40 eggs).

The fact that there are two different hypo genes at work is actually problemmatic, because anything I produce that is a hypo (for example, I have a nice hypo blood this year) I don't know what type of hypo it is, so if I'm selling them I can't in fairness tell the buyer "breed this hypo blood to this hypo lavender" and produce all hypos het for .... because they may be two different hypo genes, and it is virtually impossible to discern the difference.

Now as to my opinion as to what the "what is it" snake is - I don't know. Is it an amber lavender? Is it a new (peach) type of hypo, because Vin produced two of them this year. Is it something unique caused by the smorgasbord of genes (including blood, which we know exerts sometimes exotic effects on het animals) in play here? In my opinion, as Chuck and I agreed last year, it has to be proven. My plan all along was to breed him back to his mom (in the hopes of creating more of whatever he is) plus I have a lavender female set aside for him next year, to see if I produce all lavenders. So I'm not ready to to declare it something new. At a minimum, I have to produce a female this male, breed them together, and see if that union creates all of the same animal.

I am attaching a few pics here - one of the snake as a hatchling, and two taken tonight. The problem is that he is deep in a shed, so visually this will be inconclusive to everyone. I will post a few more pics when he sheds. Finally, I also attach a pic of his brother, the caramel blood.

I will bring him to the White Plains show this Sunday, whether he has shed or not. I will also bring this year's hatchlings.

Rich Hume
 
Old 09-05-2006, 11:36 PM   #90
Vinman
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vinman
Jazz , let me start off with I have nothing agenst you. I said I could have locked up this thread but did not because i didnot want to mess up the poll. If I could done so I would have I only put this up for a poll. The fact your comment that the ball is not in my court is the point . Who are you to tell anybody what they should name any morph that they worked on. Take a step back and look at it from my point of veiw. How would you like it if it was said to you . I think that it was out of line. Sorry but no one has told anybody that you dont have the choice in what to name a morph they created. I still will defend what I said it was nice of me to start this poll. I started this poll just to get some feedback, thats all. I did not start this poll so someone can tell me what is should be called and it is not in my control. how dare anybody to have that gaul to do that. no one told or question bill love whet he coind the name ghost or eddie leach when he called his morph and a gene I made add a blodred or Joe e peirce went from transparent to lava and all the other morphs out there but for me it is diffrent Bull pucky
I'm reposting to make a point I'm not throwing hissy fit just stating the fact. I'm not having a fit I'm quite calm It is most amusing how all of you can get so upset over nothing. there is nothing wrong in what I said the choice is up to rich and me what to call it and have no problems with any questions on what genes are in the peach find one therad where I get upset about what is in the makeup of the peach hypo. you will not find any not one. the only problem is that I have is that all of you seem to be on a rampage . the fact that I state that it is rich" and mine to call it what ever we want .
 

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