bull snake!

No, it isn't mine.

So, I finally got to my friends house to take photos of his bull snake (estimated 7 years old). I've been wanting to do this for a year, it was sad echo wasn't co-operating by being in blue but I couldn't let that stop me as it will probably be another year before I get out there again.

My friend got echo the same time I got my spotted python, a friend of ours was going to college and wanted to re-home her snakes. I already had two snakes at the time, she was trying to convince me to take both but I didn't have the room (and my roommate would not have been thrilled). So I convinced my other friend snakes are awesome, he took in her bull, and they all lived happily ever after. Except the bull has a really pronounced spine, I kind of want peoples opinion on that because he isn't skinny either, but I've never seen a bull look like that. He feeds echo a weaner rat once a week. Oh, and it also looks like he rubbed the scales off his nose, the story is before my friend (the one who went to college) got the bull, he was living in an enclosure that was too small for him and just not looked after properly. He's just always looked like that
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spine pictures:




his home.






he was very relaxed when I was over, he just curled up and sat there for half an hour.

He really should bump of the feeding on that thing AND check the stools for parasites. For only being 7 years old, that bullsnake appears very thin.....past the point of being unhealthy. He should start by giving it the same sized meal every 4-5 days to see if it begins to put weight back on. If not, GET IT TO A VET for a parasite check. Let it put on a little weight BEFORE increasing the SIZE of each and every meal.
KJ

agreed. I was talking to the local snake geeks today, they said the exact same thing. He had a vet trip planned anyway (dave didn't think his eyecap shed last time, he tried all he could but it still wasn't coming off. If he didn't shed it off for sure this time, he was going to take him to a vet)

I'll tell him to increase the frequency of feeding before making any dramatic size increases.

I'd be very surprised if a seven year old didn't have a load of parasites. He needs some home cooking!

I'll keep everyone updated too, this was the snake that got me wanting my own. If it wasn't for echo, I wouldn't be here today!

He is totally going to the vet to get a fecal done.

He looks horrible, I hope he is going to be ok. I can't wait for an update and to see if he's going to be ok.

Wow.. that snake is in some sad shape, I agree with KJ, boost up the feeding, this snake should be THICK at this age and around 6 plus feet long. Bulls are very big snakes and this guy just doesn't look like he is that big. I have younger snakes that are bigger than this guy.

Oh my poor bull. A snake with a spine that visible is very thin, no matter what. I got a ratsnake that shape that had been liek that for eyars, and laying eggs every year while eating 3 mice a week. The previous owner said she was healthy but at my place she got sick and only after curing a respiratory infection and later a stomach infection she doubled her weight on 1-2 mice a week!

he has a vet appointment this saturday. I'll update as soon as I know what's going on with him.

I know every one else has said it, but, it needs feeding....I rat weaner isn't enough for a bull. We feed a full grown rat once a fortnight..That seems to keep the weight on ours..And the stool check is paramount....

UPDATE!

The snake went to the vet today, Dr.Anderson said to feed him every day. Which I thought was a bit much, but we'll see. He didn't want to do a fecal at all, maybe he was just hoping being underfed is the only problem, and once he puts on weight all will be well.

Echo also shed about 3 or 4 layers of retained eyecaps the other day too, my friend didn't know a bad shed when he saw one. He now knows snakes should ideally shed in one piece. He did notice the eyecaps didn't shed time before last, which was why he started asking me about his snake in the first place. I advised him to place the water on the warm side and make a humid hide, it was done resulted in a perfect shed.

Now that he is on the right track, hopefully I'll have some pictures in a few months of echo as the fat hissy drama-queen we all know bull snakes to be.
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Trust me on this one when it comes to Pituophis, that snake will NOT live if he feeds it every day unless he feeds it tiny, tiny meals.

errr, I thought so too, I mean, I've never heard of any one doing that much, not even the power feeders. But he's a highly recommended reptile vet - the local reptile rescue uses him. DANG IT I want to believe the guy who's studied and treats reptiles, but your experience and my common sense point the other way. Even the guy at the reptile store where we bought the feeders thought it was too much! (off topic, they started talking and it turns out my friend knew the guys grandparents from White Horse. Small world).

How would you treat the skinny bull? Do you have any experience with skinny snakes? I'm sure one regurge won't kill him, if it comes to that, right? Why does this have to be so complicated ;_;

I'm asking my local reptile rescue lady for a second opinion too, I know she's re-habbed her fair share of mistreated snakes. She has an absolutely pathetic red footed tortoise right now that was found in an alley, the poor thing is so deformed.

You need someone with experience with Pituophis specifically. Some snakes (like cornsnakes) you can push. Some can't take it, and Pituophis are USUALLY not one of them.

Me? I'd feed him whatever he HAS been feeding it, but I would do it every 3 days for a while. Once the snake puts on some girth, bump of the meal size a little. Wait a while, and then go to twice a week with a decent sized meal. Once the snake looks almost normal, bump it up to properly sized rats every 5-7 days and adjust the meals afterwards to control mass and avoid obesity. Replacing weight, like losing it, needs to be a slow process. There is no "quick fix." I wish there were.

If the vet did not run a fecal, you can BET he isn't as good of a vet as people say he is! A fecal is cheap, can't HURT anything, and may find out something that can help. It is also likely that the vet recommended a fecal, and your friend opted to NOT get the fecal ran to save a little money.
KJ

I understand some people are like that with animals, but Dave isn't at all. He does feel really bad that the snake is in this condition, yes he probably could have been doing more research on an animal he owned. I won't make excuses for him there. But he is doing everything in his power to get this guy back to health, he didn't mind paying for a vet at all, and I *know* he wouldn't have minded paying for a fecal (especially if it is cheap like you said). He didn't even care he had to pay twice as much for mice at the pet store than he would have if he bought from a local feeder-breeder (we just couldn't find any short notice). Just had to stand up for him there, I hope you understand.

As for the Dr....if he advised feeding every day maybe he just isn't a good exotics vet. I was also surprised he didn't want a fecal done, especially since we don't even know if the snake is from a breeder or wild caught. My friend wouldn't have thought to mention it, but if the doctor had asked at all he would have found out. And the reptile rescue lady is saying pretty much the same thing you are, feed him every 3 days. I think I'll advise my friend to do that.