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executive order 3/16/2012

Carinata said:
This thread again! MUST.NOT.POST!!!
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Carinata said:
To jump back to the Trayvon Martin case, this article on CNN of all places, sheds a different light on what happened that night.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/26/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html?hpt=hp_t1
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Well that didn't last long. 33 minutes! That must be a personal best! :p

All joking aside:

"(Zimmerman) was standing over the body, basically straddling the body with his hand on Trayvon's back," said Cutcher, adding that they called three times to him before he finally asked them to call police. "It didn't seem to me that he was trying to help him in any way."
And Martin's girlfriend was on the phone with him prior to the shooting, according to a lawyer for the shooting victim's family. Benjamin Crump said last week that the girl "completely blows Zimmerman's absurd self-defense claim out of the water."
What is evident is that, minutes after that Zimmerman's first 911 call, police arrived at the scene. They found Martin "laying face down in the grass," according to a police report.
A short time later, Martin was pronounced dead.
As to Zimmerman, "his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass (and he) was also bleeding, from the nose and back of his head," according to the same report.
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I'm sorry, but an altercation such as this one doesn't need to end with deadly force. Zimmerman had absolutely no proof that Martin had a weapon on him.

"(Zimmerman) was standing over the body, basically straddling the body with his hand on Trayvon's back," ... They found Martin "laying face down in the grass," according to a police report.
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This alone tells me that he didn't need to use deadly force. He had already subdued the perpetrator, why did he need to shoot him? :shrugs: To me, this says more to prove the case against self-defense than it does to add to it's validity.


Bringing up the marijuana bag suspension really is Zimmerman's attorney's attempt to do nothing more than slander Martin's name with matters that have nothing to do with the case at hand. That being said, I don't like that they're portraying him as a child when he was almost an adult. If he were over 18, I doubt there'd be this much media hype, but "Hispanic man slays black child" gets more ratings and sells more papers than "Hispanic man shoots black man over a misunderstanding".
 
Personal best by 30 minutes!

I do agree that the use of deadly force was likely not needed. The number one rule of carrying concealed is have a knife or some pepper spray with you as well so you can incapacitate someone using non-lethal means. Zimmerman should have use pepper spray or a non-lethal defense to incapacitate Martin, if Martin was indeed the aggeressor.
 
Carinata said:
Personal best by 30 minutes!

I do agree that the use of deadly force was likely not needed. The number one rule of carrying concealed is have a knife or some pepper spray with you as well so you can incapacitate someone using non-lethal means. Zimmerman should have use pepper spray or a non-lethal defense to incapacitate Martin, if Martin was indeed the aggeressor.
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Sadly, I believe that. :grin01:

We are in agreement on that matter, then. If that small portion can be proved, that Martin was already subdued, I say arrest him and throw the book at him. This world has no place for over-zealous "authority" figures with inflated egos and a weapon.
 
One thing that hasn't been talked about is Martin's right to Stand Your Ground as well. If Zimmerman was attempting to detain him in any way, according to Stand Your Ground, Martin was entitled to use lethal force to defend himself as well. Zimmerman's wet back and alleged broken nose could be the results of Martin's attempt to defend himself.
 
You're correct. At the same time, why can we consider that, but when people mention maybe Zimmerman was defending himself the masses cry "racist!".
 
Carinata said:
You're correct. At the same time, why can we consider that, but when people mention maybe Zimmerman was defending himself the masses cry "racist!".
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This isn't some hypothetical situation where we take sides on the issue and then stretch it all the way until it fits comfortably around our opinion...The catalyst of this whole situation isn't racism and nobody is happy to label Trayvon Martin as a martyr for the benefit of civil rights in America...He's a boy, a young man, who was murdered for no reason whatsoever!. Marijuana residue is not a reason, a hoodie is not a reason, and being 6'3" and black is most certainly not a reason. Certain people just want to be some DA by placating Zimmerman's motives like he deserves an acquittal --- he doesn't. Don't put yourself in a policeman's shoes or in an attorney's shoes. Put yourself in Trayvon Martin's shoes, in his brother's shoes, in his mother's/father's/sister's/best-friend's shoes and then try and justify it. He was a real life with real thoughts and dreams that were robbed by a man with no conscience and no compassion...He should be alive and that is enough to put Zimmerman behind bars for a very long time.
 
States attorney says there isn't enough evidence to arrest Zimmerman. I have put myself in the shoes of his mother. My heart and prayers go out to his family. It was a horrific event. I am afraid for my son to go out in public at any given time. I am afraid that he could be kidnapped, or murdered. Every mother's worst fears. We weren't there, we don't know what happened. We have formed our opinions with what is being put out in the media. Last I checked we don't convict on public opinion but on evidence. Did the police screw up that investigation? Yes, they did. Where they both defending themselves? more than likely. But with that law on the books, conviction is going to be hard to obtain.

It might not of been about racism but that is what it has turned into. The Black Panther party put a BOUNTY on the head of an American citizen, who has yet to see his day in court. Terrorism within our own borders. Spike Lee has tweeted an address believing it was Zimmermans, it turned out not to be but the home of a women. She could of been the target of outrage and she would be an innocent bystander. These black leaders are promoting violence not justice. They played the race card. What about the tshirts that are now being passed out in Florida calling Zimmerman a "cracker"? He is hispanic. His race had nothing to do with it. It is a circus of ignorance surrounded the horrific death of a young man. It is a modern day lynch party.
 
Good point Robbie....again!!

And Ricky,
I haven't had time to update myself on this but...you're right!
Even if Trayvon was scoping out a home to hit. His life, any life is not worth the price of a flat screen TV.

beautifullywild77 I hope the black leader can again but themself above the rest.
 
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From what I read in my newspaper (finally after all this time), Martin was walking home, Zimmerman was watching him and Martin came at him. Martin hit Zimmerman first in the nose and Zimmerman went down. When he went down Martin was on top of him smashing his head into the pavement. There were witnesses that said this is what happened.

If, and this is a big if, but IF this is what happened, then I think Zimmerman was within his rights to shoot to kill. I know if someone jumped me and was smashing my head into concrete and I had a gun, I would be shooting.
 
starsevol said:
From what I read in my newspaper (finally after all this time), Martin was walking home, Zimmerman was watching him and Martin came at him. Martin hit Zimmerman first in the nose and Zimmerman went down. When he went down Martin was on top of him smashing his head into the pavement. There were witnesses that said this is what happened.

If, and this is a big if, but IF this is what happened, then I think Zimmerman was within his rights to shoot to kill. I know if someone jumped me and was smashing my head into concrete and I had a gun, I would be shooting.
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Exactly Beth! The reason we have had such an upheaval is because Martin was black. When I first saw the story on CNN, it was all about race, and that's what it's turned into. Also Zimmerman went to our rival high school. Just a fun fact :)
 
Why people mention racism, is exactly this reason... because 'some' people like to stick to a story that is completely UN-backed by any evidence at all, with LOADS of evidence that this was not self-defense, and there has been NO arrest.

Let's seriously not pretend that we're in a post-racist, post-sexist, post-hateful society. It's an insult to real people (like Trayvon and his family), that don't have the privilege of picking a side to this story that bolsters a political identity. To them (and as backed by tremendous evidence), their son was murdered. And it's beyond suspicious that 'some' people believe so strongly in these fairy tale, BS stories, to let this walking murderer (and strangely passive police force) get away with.

The Sanford Police have clearly made more of an effort to dig out excuses from Zimmerman, than they have to acknowledge proven fact. And there is NO (I repeat NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO, NO).... NO evidence that outweighs the phone call to dispatch, Trayvon's call with his girlfriend, witness accounts of a boy screaming help... and get this one... TRAYVON HAVING NO WEAPONS ON HIM AS HE WAS FLEEING!!!! You tell me ANY case where this has happened to a white 17yr old boy in a suburban neighborhood, and I'll go along with the "okey dokes" about racism not being as much of a factor.
 
starsevol said:
From what I read in my newspaper (finally after all this time), Martin was walking home, Zimmerman was watching him and Martin came at him. Martin hit Zimmerman first in the nose and Zimmerman went down. When he went down Martin was on top of him smashing his head into the pavement. There were witnesses that said this is what happened.

If, and this is a big if, but IF this is what happened, then I think Zimmerman was within his rights to shoot to kill. I know if someone jumped me and was smashing my head into concrete and I had a gun, I would be shooting.
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I don't know Beth ..seems like alot of Zimmerman said and that, wish we could hear from Trayvon

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/26/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html
 
Seriously? You read about this happening all over the United States. White on White, Latino on White, White on Latino, Black on white, White on back. What makes this about racism but the leaders that pulled out the card in the first place.

But just because Zimmerman was hispanic and Martin was black it is considered a hate crime? We have black leaders calling foul? Where is the evidence that Zimmerman was even racist? The 911 tape, I've heard it more than once and I can not for sure say he said a racial slur. Play telephone anytime lately? We hear what we want to hear.
Zimmerman is already convicted in public opinion but last time I checked that doesn't mean they are guilty?

Where is the outcry when others kill kids? Black on black violence or white on white violence?

It was a vigilante that followed a person who he believe looked suspicious. He was told by cops not to follow. Yes, do I believe Zimmerman is guilty, you bet your bottom I do. That is my personal opinion tho. I do not know ALL the facts of the investigation and no body does at this point except those that are investigating. The witness statements conflict with one another. We know what the media wants us to hear.
 
Why does everyone ignore witness statements and the fact that Zimmerman had a broken nose, and was bleeding from the back of his head. I you hit someone with a 9MM in the chest, they're not going to be doing a ton of fighting back. Sure a 9MM isn't a .45 ACP or a .357 Magnum, a 9MM still has sufficient knockdown power that a well placed shot will drop someone. I don't see how Zimmerman would have sustained the amount of injuries he did if he stalked Martin and shot him.

What's your opinion on the Black Panthers issuing a bounty on Zimmerman's head?

What happened to due process, and why can't we let it run it's course?
 

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Don't forget Spike Lee tweeting the wrong address thinking it was Zimmermans, when I fact it was a womans house who could be in danger from a mob looking for justices?
 
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