Heat Mat Question

[ValeriesMom]

I can't be the only person this has happened to....

So I have Valerie in a 30 gallon glass tank (with a screen lid with locking clips.) I just cleaned out her cage, and I look the shaving out of the bottom and the glass on the bottom is cracked where the heat mat is! I have this one from Petsmart...

http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=16657566&lmdn=SHOP+FOR&f=PAD/psNotAvailInUS/No

It says it's a 100 degree mat, but between the shavings, it says it's 84 degrees on the mat side. Has anyone else had this happen? How do you prevent it? Would I be better off using a heat lamp instead in my new tank?

Thank you!

 

[Nanci]

Do you have a thermostat on the mat?

 

[ValeriesMom]

No, not on the mat. It sticks to the bottom of the tank, with little rubber feet on the bottom for air ventilation. I have shavings on the bottom of the tank that covers the mat.

 

[smigon]

First of all, I would get her into a new tank immediately, even if it is a plastic Rubber Maid container. You don't want her to cut herself.

Second, heat mats MUST be regulated! You have to have a thermometer directly over the glass above the heat mat, and the thermostat should be programmed to 85 degrees. Without a thermostat it can get up to 130 and can kill your snake.

I don't know if high heat may have helped break the glass, I have never heard of that happening personally, but you have to get her out of there and into a temperature regulated viv.

 

[ValeriesMom]

First of all, I would get her into a new tank immediately, even if it is a plastic Rubber Maid container. You don't want her to cut herself.

Second, heat mats MUST be regulated! You have to have a thermometer directly over the glass above the heat mat, and the thermostat should be programmed to 85 degrees. Without a thermostat it can get up to 130 and can kill your snake.

I don't know if high heat may have helped break the glass, I have never heard of that happening personally, but you have to get her out of there and into a temperature regulated viv.

Don't worry- She's in a Rubbermaid storage container right now! The glass is cracked on the bottom side of the tank, you can't feel it on the inside (like you can feel it on the bottom, not inside the tank).

I do have a temperature gauge (like a temp dial) 3" above the bottom of the tank, above where the shavings are. It said 84 degrees before I cleaned out the tank.

 

[NH93]

Temp gauge (thermometer) and thermoSTATS are NOT the same.
Here's a link to a decently inexpensive one, I use two of them and really like them.

http://www.amazon.ca/Jumpstart-Digi...92781412&sr=8-1&keywords=jumpstart+thermostat

Thermostats control the heat output of your UTH. It's like with a house... if there was nothing to control what temperature you wanted the heat, the house would catch fire because the heat would never turn off. That, or melt everyone inside. Basically.

 

[kc261]

You really need something that will regulate the heat. T-stats are best, rheostats (like a dimmer switch) will do especially if the room the snake is in is kept at a steady temperature.

Those dial temp gauges are notoriously inaccurate. Also, they do nothing to let you know if there was a spike or dip in temps. Most importantly, they do nothing to control the temp from spiking too high.

Another thing you are probably not aware of is that there can be a temperature difference of 20 degrees or possibly even more in those 3" between the heat pad and where you said you have the dial gauge. Those shavings are a surprisingly good insulator, so it can get quite hot beneath them even if it isn't on the surface.

Here is a link to an brief but interesting read about a little experiment someone did on that sort of thing:
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1630109&postcount=10

Here is a link to a relatively inexpensive t-stat that you can use:
http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-MTPRTC-Digital-Thermostat-Heat/dp/B000NZZG3S

Also you will most want to get a digital thermometer that records high & low temps so you can be sure if the temps are getting too high or too low. Here is one possibility that keeps track of temps at 2 locations (warm spot & cool side) as well as humidity:
http://www.amazon.com/Chaney-Instruments-Acu-Rite-Thermometer-Humidity/dp/B001BO8CUE

 

[ValeriesMom]

You really need something that will regulate the heat. T-stats are best, rheostats (like a dimmer switch) will do especially if the room the snake is in is kept at a steady temperature.

Those dial temp gauges are notoriously inaccurate. Also, they do nothing to let you know if there was a spike or dip in temps. Most importantly, they do nothing to control the temp from spiking too high.

Another thing you are probably not aware of is that there can be a temperature difference of 20 degrees or possibly even more in those 3" between the heat pad and where you said you have the dial gauge. Those shavings are a surprisingly good insulator, so it can get quite hot beneath them even if it isn't on the surface.

Here is a link to an brief but interesting read about a little experiment someone did on that sort of thing:
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1630109&postcount=10

Here is a link to a relatively inexpensive t-stat that you can use:
http://www.amazon.com/Hydrofarm-MTPRTC-Digital-Thermostat-Heat/dp/B000NZZG3S

Also you will most want to get a digital thermometer that records high & low temps so you can be sure if the temps are getting too high or too low. Here is one possibility that keeps track of temps at 2 locations (warm spot & cool side) as well as humidity:
http://www.amazon.com/Chaney-Instruments-Acu-Rite-Thermometer-Humidity/dp/B001BO8CUE

Thank you!

 

[smigon]

Would I be better off using a heat lamp instead in my new tank?

In answer to that, NO! Heat lamps are good for reptiles and snakes that like to bask in the sun, corns are not one of them.

Also, I would replace the aquarium even though you can't feel the crack. I was reading the description of the heat mat you have and it says "DO NOT place on tanks with cracked or broken surfaces."

I agree with the above advice, the dial thermometers are only for how warm the air is in the tank itself, but it is the temp of the bottom of the tank below the substrate that needs to be regulated.

 

[brindle]

In answer to that, NO! Heat lamps are good for reptiles and snakes that like to bask in the sun, corns are not one of them.

Also, I would replace the aquarium even though you can't feel the crack. I was reading the description of the heat mat you have and it says "DO NOT place on tanks with cracked or broken surfaces."

I agree with the above advice, the dial thermometers are only for how warm the air is in the tank itself, but it is the temp of the bottom of the tank below the substrate that needs to be regulated.

^^ this confuses me. Here's why: I have heard of so many situations where heat mats crack tanks, burn snakes, etc. yet heat lamps do none of these things.
I realize that corn snakes do not bask in the sun like other species do, but the heat from the lamp also heats the bottom of the tank...
The only negative that I can say about heat lamps is that they do tend to dry things out a tad. I just give my girl a bath every once in a while or spray with a water bottle. When shedding time comes, I use moist moss or paper towel in her cave.
Lamps have worked for me for years without issue. They are the only thing that safely keeps my snake warm in this old house (in the middle of Canada).
I think ambient temperature is more important then whether or not a snake basks or gleans heat from belly warmth... that's just me however.

 

[NH93]

^^ this confuses me. Here's why: I have heard of so many situations where heat mats crack tanks, burn snakes, etc. yet heat lamps do none of these things.
I realize that corn snakes do not bask in the sun like other species do, but the heat from the lamp also heats the bottom of the tank...
The only negative that I can say about heat lamps is that they do tend to dry things out a tad. I just give my girl a bath every once in a while or spray with a water bottle. When shedding time comes, I use moist moss or paper towel in her cave.
Lamps have worked for me for years without issue. They are the only thing that safely keeps my snake warm in this old house (in the middle of Canada).
I think ambient temperature is more important then whether or not a snake basks or gleans heat from belly warmth... that's just me however.

It's because those heat mats that crack, burn, etc. are not regulated by a thermostat. Simple as that.

I also live in Canada, so I understand your concern. I have used lamps before, and I do not find they work as well as UTHs. Especially in a small and/or glass vive, they also heat up the air, not just the floor, which lessens the heat gradient. It sounds like it would make sense to use a lamp (mimicking the sun), but it just doesn't have the same effect in a space that small.

 

[brindle]

It's because those heat mats that crack, burn, etc. are not regulated by a thermostat. Simple as that.

I also live in Canada, so I understand your concern. I have used lamps before, and I do not find they work as well as UTHs. Especially in a small and/or glass vive, they also heat up the air, not just the floor, which lessens the heat gradient. It sounds like it would make sense to use a lamp (mimicking the sun), but it just doesn't have the same effect in a space that small.

Do these heat pads generally come with thermostats? I've never even heard of such a thing... can you walk into a local pet store and ask for a UTH with a thermostat? Until I find something regulated I will continue to heat with a lamp as UTH scare me. Any advice on where to get them..? A preferred brand?
Sorry OP for butting into your thread.

 

[Chip]

^^ this confuses me. Here's why: I have heard of so many situations where heat mats crack tanks, burn snakes, etc. yet heat lamps do none of these things.

That statement is a bit inaccurate. Heat mats don't burn snakes, not corns, anyway. If the air temps are cold enough, I have seen pictures of ball pythons that got burned rather than get off the heat, but I have yet to see a burned corn from a mat it could get away from.
And I have had at least 5 lamps catch fire. To be fair, I have had two UTH's and flexwatt catch fire too, but in sheer numbers, a much smaller sampling of lamps have burned than pads.
I said in another thread that I would put my favorite corn snake (my Palmetto) in a 20 gallon Critter Cage with an unregulated Ultratherm any day before I would use a lamp. Neither are ideal, but I would leave the house with far more confidence.

The only negative that I can say about heat lamps is that they do tend to dry things out a tad. I just give my girl a bath every once in a while or spray with a water bottle. When shedding time comes, I use moist moss or paper towel in her cave.

They dry things out a lot, really. I used to moisten hides before shedding, but I find with a nice big water bowl, I have nearly 100% full sheds in racks or glass.

Lamps have worked for me for years without issue. They are the only thing that safely keeps my snake warm in this old house (in the middle of Canada).

I promise they aren't the only thing that will safely keep your snake warm in a cold house. If lamps are working for you, knock yourself out, but an Ultratherm on a thermostat is much, much safer and will adequately heat you enclosure.

 

[Nanci]

In addition to the fire risk, another problem with bulbs is they burn out. All the time. ALL THE TIME. And if you don't have a spare- no heat. So you just fed your snake and the bulb burns out- guess what! Regurge! And bulbs aren't cheap.

 

[Chip]

Wondering too, if Canada is making the same push to do away with incandescents? Supposedly they will be a thing of the past here soon.

 

[Nanci]

I wonder how that will affect specialty bulbs, such as those for reptiles.

 

[NH93]

That statement is a bit inaccurate. Heat mats don't burn snakes, not corns, anyway. If the air temps are cold enough, I have seen pictures of ball pythons that got burned rather than get off the heat, but I have yet to see a burned corn from a mat it could get away from.

I KNEW my corn was smarter than my ball python!

On another forum I have seen 180-too many photos of burnt ball pythons... they do love the warmth.

But I am wondering if the OP's corn did get burnt due to an unregulated UTH, Chip. If so, I guess it would be a first for you.


As Nanci said, bulbs are also expensive. So the upfront cost of a UTH (~$25) plus a thermostat ($40 with shipping online) is still much better than bulbs at $15-$30 a piece twice a year, plus the domes at about $30-$50.
On top of that, they are much safer and EASIER for us to use! There are no night time dips - although not as much a concern for corns, unless they have just eaten - and you don't have to touch a thing once the temperature is set on the thermostat. No turning off or on lights, no red or blue glow, and no worries about the lamp falling and being a fire hazard either.

 

[daddio207]

Wondering too, if Canada is making the same push to do away with incandescents? Supposedly they will be a thing of the past here soon.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/1/5263826/the-incandescent-light-bulb-isnt-dead

 

[NH93]

Edit: Just realized, I meant the OP from another thread (in my last comment). Sorry for the confusion! http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135191

 

[brindle]

So you can't buy a heating pad WITH the thermostat? They are sold separately. I truly want to do the best for my snake! You can't buy thermostats at the pet store?