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boneal

New member
Well my corn snake is definatily dead. Thank you all for the advice... I tried to handle the snake more and all he did at first was kinda bobble his head and he had very sharp breaths. I'm planning on getting another one, I will DEFINATILY make sure I do not put cedar in my corn snakes cage. *nor in any mammals or reptiles that I have as pets* For those of you that do not know... just stay away from the cedar :cry: ... Thanks agian to all of you that gave me advice, I did all I could to possibly "save" my baby corn snake. If you have any helpfull tips on how to take awesome care of one, I plan on getting another one soon (after I am sure of everything to do). I have the proper enviroment. The glass case caused problems for my snake when I had the cedar because it lacked air flow even tho I had a screen top... So I plan to be a lot more carefull about those type of decions.
 
There are lots of care sheets and books out there to reference before you buy another snake. Please do the snake and yourself a favor and make sure you have a correct setup before you make your purchase. Good luck....
 
Good bye, we hardly knew ye...

My deepest as well. Heart goes out to you both.--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For others, this is from another post;

DO NOT USE CEDAR

Don’t ever use cedar or for that part most coniferous, fruit and nut trees do not make appropriate substrates.

We are having an ongoing discussion and research on substrates on another forum I attend…here is the over-view;




Pine and Cedar;
“Pine Shavings - Recently it has come to light that pine shavings can be toxic. They give off fumes that can be harmful. Not as bad as cedar but I won't use it. DO NOT EVER USE CEDAR BEDDING!!! Cedar bedding is very toxic to reptiles and will kill them! Actually it is toxic to the small mammals it is generally used for too.”
Another opinion on it…..
“AVOID cedar, redwood, or pine at all costs because they are toxic to reptiles. The fumes from cedar and redwood cause respiratory infections that will kill them. Pine is toxic when ingested..”
More…

“One opinion that is shared by most pet owners is that pine and cedar should not be used as substrate for your snake's enclosure, or as substrate for any feeder animals you may also keep. It has been suspected for a while now that there are toxic oils in these woods that may cause organ damage to animals kept on them. This is still under heavy debate, but since there are so many other options out there, why take a chance? “
even more………

Pine and Cedar shavings
Pros: *Smells good Cons: *The tar and scents are toxic to reptiles *May cause respiratory infections and even death”


Other Substrates;

“Soil/Sand: For the most natural-looking enclosure, you may want to consider using potting soil or sand as your substrate. They allow snakes to burrow freely, and are fairly easy and inexpensive to replace. Good pet stores usually carry a product called cal-sand, or something of that nature. Supposedly this is healthy for your animal, even when accidentally ingested, and may be worth a look. If you decide on soil for your substrate, please use only plain, store-bought potting soil, and keep it dry to prevent mold and fungus growth. Dirt obtained from your backyard may contain bugs, pesticides, fungi, or any number of things you don't want your snake exposed to. This is also a good choice if you prefer to use live plants in your enclosure. Don't be surprised if your snake digs them up, though.”

…and

“Shredded paper/bark: A very common substrate on the market, it also provides many options for appearance in your snake tank. In this classification, we include shredded orchid, fir, and aspen barks, ground corn cobs, rodent pellets, and manufactured products like Care-Fresh bedding. All of these are very absorbent and easy to care for you simply scoop out the soiled substrate and replace it. Some are specially made to maintain humidity in your enclosure, whereas some may be dangerously drying to the skin of your animal. With these types of substrate, you again have the problems of accidental ingestion and dust, as addressed above. This type of substrate also makes it much easier for various external parasites to live, but this can be minimized with proper attention and cleaning.”
Also…….

“ReptiBark (and Equivalents)
Pros: *Good substrate *Promotes borrowing *Helps with shedding *Stays relatively dry
Cons: *Very dark and hard to spot clean *Insects have been found in packages bought new from store *Expensive *Will mold when wet


On a side note, if you use the repti-bark materials, ensure it soen't completely dry out as dust and mites can occur.
 
ayasha said:
Other Substrates;

“Soil/Sand: For the most natural-looking enclosure, you may want to consider using potting soil or sand as your substrate. They allow snakes to burrow freely, and are fairly easy and inexpensive to replace. Good pet stores usually carry a product called cal-sand, or something of that nature. Supposedly this is healthy for your animal, even when accidentally ingested, and may be worth a look. If you decide on soil for your substrate, please use only plain, store-bought potting soil, and keep it dry to prevent mold and fungus growth. Dirt obtained from your backyard may contain bugs, pesticides, fungi, or any number of things you don't want your snake exposed to. This is also a good choice if you prefer to use live plants in your enclosure. Don't be surprised if your snake digs them up, though.”

Actually, sand is definitely not good to use with snakes. Besides impaction and irritation issues, it tends to dry out an enclosure far too much, resulting in bad sheds. As for potting soil, I've seen where some use it to set up nice naturalistic enclosures, but it must be a royal pain to maintain and keep clean without constant worry of bacterial buildup. And it'd have to be some very strong plants to survive a 4+ foot snake crawling all over them. ;)

The best options are things like aspen, paper towels, Eco-earth or even Carefresh bedding. However, unless you have the paper towels for substrate be sure to feed in a seperate container to prevent ingestion of the bedding. :)
 
Sand and snakes?

Yeah it's a long winded discussion we have going (where I grabbed it) and I SHOULD preface that these are general Herp substrate discussions and one should ALWAYS research their individual animal.

Because yes Becky, it can be bad, unless your a desert snake. Oui? So with Corns it's certainly a bad idea. Not ALL snakes. Sorry about that one..forgot the context it was written in there. It is a herp generalization to spark further input.

We're kinda Viv junkies with our herps. Spend a lot of time with things other than food in our oven (lol). I really like mine to get as close to a natural habitat as possible. It is, as you said, a lot more work. I live in the country and work form home (self employed) so my herping passion has plenty of resources (time and money).

I shall go and edit my post with the preface to ensure we have no further mis-understandings.

Thanks a bunch for that one....
 
ayasha said:
Strange.... I can't figure out how to edit a post?
Anyone?


you cant...that privlage was removed because people were typing nasty things to other users and then deleted them so rich z wouldnt see them and ban him/her
 
ayasha said:
Yeah it's a long winded discussion we have going (where I grabbed it) and I SHOULD preface that these are general Herp substrate discussions and one should ALWAYS research their individual animal.

Because yes Becky, it can be bad, unless your a desert snake. Oui? So with Corns it's certainly a bad idea. Not ALL snakes. Sorry about that one..forgot the context it was written in there. It is a herp generalization to spark further input.


Uh, I never said anything about using sand, but I will now. Sand is not good for corn snakes--or for most snakes in general--for all the very valid reasons WILDER pointed out.

The only one long winded here is you, Ayasha. And since this is a CORN snake forum, it is generally info particular to CORN snakes that is given out. Save the general herp discussions for general herp forums, please.

I still say aspen is going to be the most often recommended substrate for corn snake.
 
I agree with Becky, generalized herp advice doesn't quite belong up here in the "cornsnake sections". What may work great as a substrate for dart frogs is not going to work for corns, and vice versa. And blanket recommending such things could very well kill some people's animals if they were foolish enough to follow that carelessly posted advice.

And Wilder nailed it right on the head, as far as I'm concerned.

I would not use sand with ANY snake species, period. Not playsand and not even that "reptile sand" that's supposedly completely digestible. There is a forum member here who lost 2-3 Kenyan Sand Boas to impaction from sand. So that clinches it right there for me for not keeping any reptile on sand, desert species or not.

Even when I had my Bearded Dragon, he wasn't on sand either. He had a tendency to "taste" everything, and I knew he'd get plugged up if he had something non-digestible to continually taste. So his substrate was wheat bran: soft, diggable, dust free, and 100% digestible.

I wouldn't use potting soil either. Great way to contribute to the growth of fungi & bacteria, clogging of nostils, potential ingestion through burrowing, and the general dirty appearance of your snake all the time. Not to mention its harder than hell to find potting soil anymore that doesn't contain added fertilizers.

Captive snakes are captive snakes, what we keep them on isn't going to be as naturalistic as in their native habitat. But I'm sure our conditions are a little bit more sanitary and less chance of accidents happening in that same regard.

I am sorry that the original poster didn't research thoroughly or find the forum before they got their snake and now they've had to learn the hard way. Research should always be done BEFORE ever getting a new pet that you're not familiar with. Cedar keeps out moths for a reason. Hopefully with their new snake they'll do a better job.

I use Aspen and only Aspen, for my snakes and my feeder rodents. It's nearly dust free, resin free, neutralizes waste odors, absorbant, and inexpensive (although not as cheap as pine & cedar). What more could you want?

I have tried Repti-bark in the past. But keeping it moist provided too wet of an enclosure for corns and too dry was entirely too dusty and resulted in clogged nostrils, and a very "rusty" looking snake.

:-offtopic
We're all herp-junkies here and we take our hobby seriously and feel very passionately about our critters. So it really gets under my skin when new folks pop in and proclaim "I'm the Queen of Knowledge and thouest shall bow down before me", like we had no clue what we were doing before they ever got here.

Lest I remind folks, yet again, this forum has been around for a few years and there has amassed a wealth of information about everything regarding cornsnakes and other herps as well...if the people would just simply take the time to SEARCH for it. That's that little button up at the top spelled: S-E-A-R-C-H.

Type in your query and it'll pull up most everything that's been discussed multiple times in the past for you to read. Its quick and painless, and very beneficial. But I've used it many times myself, and its invaluable and pretty darn good for answering questions with many different opinions on the matter. It's like asking a roomfull of members your question and getting their answers without none of the hassle.

And I really try to not be the type of member we've had before where every question asked is flooded with a "Do a search" response. So practice by searching for 'sand' and 'cedar' and read to your heart's content.
 
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