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Can you help with this Puzzle?

HanneysCorn

HanneysCorn

Canadian Cornaholic
I bred my Normal female (hets unknown if any) and my Caramel male (hets unknown if any) and was lucky enough to hatch out 10 little cuties by this morning. But I got a 'big surprise' with the 5th, 6th, and 7th little cutie when they finally ventured out.

I was expecting all normals het caramels. These look like very light hypos, but nothing like the hypos I am used to seeing. At first I thought they were amels, until I saw their black eyes. There is just a slight gray edging to their saddles but it is there.

Here are the pics of these guys:

CS0501x0630.jpg


CS0501x1600.jpg



CS0501x1915.jpg


Here's a pic of Mom:


Rocky.jpg


And Dad:

Ramses.jpg



Last year the caramel was bred to a ghost, and here is one of his offspring, yearling size:


Fleur3.jpg


I always considered Fleur a normal. Is she hypo too? If yes, then that would confirm to me that I can definitely be sure that Casper and Rocky both are het hypo. Is that the case.

I have a hypo female that I purchased when she was just a few weeks old. As I remember it, she looked nothing like any of these combos.

You always hope that you get these 'surprises', but when they happen its always nice to know there is somewhere to go to get some opinions. I would appreciate any and all opinions...maybe I will get this puzzle together :)



Thanks muchly,

Hanneys
 
Fleur looks like a hypo to me, I would never have considered her a normal, although I am no expert. What's her belly look like?
 
Did you buy the parents at the same time from the same breeder?

The hatchlings look suspiciously like Ultra or Ultramel and possibly Caramel.
 
I agree with Clint. That was my first impression when I saw them, an ultra or ultramel of some sort. Nice looking little ones. Congrats. :)
 
Your caramel looks like an amber to me. There's basically zero black on it. As far as the babies, my first thought was amber.

As far as the ultra/ultramel thing, dunno. :shrugs:
 
Thats one nice caramel, definately not amber. However the three in question look like amber hatchlings. Great looking, Let me know if you decide to part with any. Thanks Tom :cheers:
 
History on the Parents as I know it:

Normal Female:

Purchased from a bin of hatchling cornsnakes at the Reptile Expo in Mississauga Ontario. I had no interested in cornsnakes at the time; but my husband wanted one, so I said take your pic. She was 'where it all began'. I fell in love with her colour, began to devour all info on corns that I could, and got 'hooked'; so regrettably I have no info on her.

Caramel Male:

Purchased one year later from a couple in Ingersoll ON who were moving and had to be snakeless. They were not really 'into' corns as I could see it; more into balls and pythons. I do remember him telling me that this caramel, and a pair of amel stripes I also purchased were originally Stateside 'critters'.

So no, they are not related at all.

When I first saw these heads pipping, I automatically thought amel...and believed it until I had them out and saw their eyes and the very faint line of gray outlining the saddles.

Like I said, I am really confused. Perhaps after first shed it will be more obvious if there is 'to be' more blackening.

Clint and Gardenmum: Oh wouldn't that be nice....I have followed some of the discussion about this ultra and caramel issue but really don't understand it all. I was not planning on holding back any of this clutch, but I guess I should now...here's hoping my luck holds and there is a pair in there. :)

Mike: I will get those belly shots for you. I took a look and her 'black' checkers are more a 'glossy gray' than black. Will take a pic or two tomorrow. Just thought she was a normal...its was her hets I was interested in and she was my first ever 'holdback'. Only having the phenotype to deal with (ghost x caramel) I just didn't think she could be anything but normal.

Joejr: Your right, there is very little black on Ramses. I often wondered about that. But I also wondered about his 'pattern'. He has no real side markings at all; his background seems to blend right into his saddles. But I do have an amber and he is so different; more of a grayish tan background with similar saddle colours.

Believe it or not, some of you are asking the same questions I asked myself over the past few days. It is helping me learn so much. I did post on the Canadian part of the forum and was referred to post here. There is such a 'wealth of knowledge' in this site and I do appreciate all your comments.

Ruth Hanney
 
My caramel has more of a tanish/silverish background that's slowly becoming yellow with time. It seems there is so much more variation with the caramel gene.

Picture212.jpg
 
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