UTH not enough?

[Arson]

I've just set up my first viv for my new corn arriving in a few days and I'm trying to make sure the temps work out well. I have a 30g long and I'm using a ReptiTherm UTH designed for 30g-40g tanks. The UTH covers a nice portion of the bottom (slighly less than half). Now, the packaging says to give at least 6 hours before accurate readings can be taken.

On the cool side I have the corn's water dish and will have another hide soon.

On the warm side I have another hide. I've put the probe for the warm side inside the hide for now.

I'm reading on the cool side: 75F ambient air temperature.

I'm reading on the warm side: 85F at the probe inside the hide.


Now, I know that sounds about perfect, but the probe is inside the hide and on the substrate. I thought I would need an ambient air temperature of at least that much. Does this sound like it should be enough? I've not yet learned what the proper temps should FEEL like since I've never seen a snake viv before in person.

I've decided to suspend the probe inside the hide to see if anything changes. Hell, I might just need to give the UTH more time to heat up. It's been running about 8 hours now.

Thanks in advance!

David

 

[DAND]

That should be fine. If it is too cool for the snake the snake will burrow in the bedding and get on the glass/plastic (whatever your viv is made of) bottom if it needs to.

 

[Arson]

After I suspended the probe and let it settle, the temp was 82.5F. However, after giving it more time resting on the substrate the temp went up to 88F. The room that this viv is in will heat up another 3 degrees or so during the day, so that should be just fine I'm thinking. The cool side was hoverying around 77F. Do you think that's too high?

Yay? Nay?


By the way, a HUGE thanks to J_Daniels for suggesting a thermometer found at Wal-Mart. The thermometer is usually designed for indoor/outdoor household use and measures the humidity and temperature at the base and at the end of a 10ft long probe. It was only $14.95, MUCH better than the $29 plus shipping I was about to pay for one online. So, I bought two.

 

[DAND]

Between the water dish and the second hide on the cool side it'll be fine. If it gets too warm it'll take a little dip in the water bowl or it can get onto the second hide.

 

[predaza]

ur viv sounds the same temps as mine and my baby snow corn has been fine in it for over a week so dont worry
good luck

 

[Arson]

Looks like my temps on the warm side are topping out at 91F

 

[MegF.]

91 is a little on the warm side. The 86 and 75 are better. Mine spends most of her time on the cool side, even after eating. I'll never figure them out!

 

[Arson]

91F was the temp on the substrate and not the ambient air temp. I admit I purposely opened my blinds and windows to see how high the temp would get in a worst case scenario. I think I can keep the temp down below 90. That, and I'll move the hide just a bit off-center from the UTH and see how the snake likes it. If she spends on all time on the cool side...well, I'll know what to do.

 

[MegF.]

Just for info too. If you do have a snake that likes to burrow (like my Aztec) you might want to cover the bottom of the tank over the UTH so that they don't lay directly on the glass and get burned. I used a piece of paper towel taped to the glass with substrate over it. Or if you want to get fancy, you can get the cage mats.

 

[Heather]

I would suggest the same thing. After feeling just how hot it was on the glass over the UTH, I always make sure there is something such as paper towel covering it (especially if it's a loose substrate like aspen). It's more a safety precaution; my corn tends to stay either on the cooler end or just off of the heat, even while digesting.

 

[Sandra]

Arson,

Our snake will here Tuesday and we're setting up the viv tomorrow. Where in Walmart (what dept) did you get the thermometer, and what brand is it? I hate that store, but we're going to go so I can get the thermometer you mentioned. While we're there, are there any other viv goodies I should look for? After Walmart we are going to Pet Supermarket. Hopefully we can get everything from those 2 stores.

Thanks!

 

[Arson]

Hi Sandra.

I bought the thermometer near the Lawn & Garden section where the outdoor thermometers are kept. The brand name was Acu-rite Indoor/Outdoor Digital Thermometer. It had an LCD digital display for Indoor (measured from the base), Outdoor (measured from a probe), and humidity (measured from the base). The things I was sure to get from the petstore were a bag of shredded aspen, a heavy ceramic water dish, and a wire screen top. I had hides already from when I kept fish.

 

[J_Daniels]

I also always recommend that if your going to use a screen top, which I do, you buy some sort of bricks or weights to rest on top.

The clamps which come with most tops just aren't enough, as they either allow the snake to push up the lid in the middle, on the far edges, or the corners... depending on how large your tank is and where you place the clamps.

For example, I house my adult Anery and Snow together (I know, I know but I really don't want to go into that conversation right now) in a 55 gallon that was given to me by a friend without a lid at all. I went to the nearest pet store to buy a screen top, which by the way I love, as its hinged in two places to open at both ends, and it came with two latches. No matter where I put the two latches, that lid would still push up somewhere. So now I have the latches in the middle, and landscaping bricks on each end.

It may sound like overkill, but trust me, you DO NOT want to go through the h**l that is trying to recover a lost snake. Believe me, you need the bricks with screen tops. The snake will find a way up there, and it there is any way possible, it will get out (or worse, kill itself by getting say only its head out and hanging there. My friend lost a snake like this while at work one day).

JCD

edit:
Here's how I have mine set up...

 

[Arson]

I guess I'll know if the UTH is not enough once I get my snake. If she spends all her time on the warm side, then I probably need to bump it up. Likewise if she spends all her time on the cool side, vice versa.

 

[Sandra]

I stuck my probe directly on the glass and the temp is already 96 after less than 30 minutes. YIKES! The temp on the other side is 75. The heat mat seems to be a little overzealous. I do plan to tape a paper towel over the mat - would one of those green mats be better to minimize the heat? Should I be monitoring it above the substrate?

Arson - thanks for the info on the thermometer. What are you doing with all the extra wire on the probe??

 

[Arson]

heh, good question because right now it's all over the place. I planned to line the wire neatly along the border and then drop it down to the substrate along the back wall.

Does anyone think this probe might pose a threat to the snake. Would she try to eat it? I once had a cat that ate about 6 feet of yarn. I remember because I tried to pull it out (I was about 10 years old).

 

[J_Daniels]

The probe that I bought had adhesive on the bottom, so when I cleaned out my cage, I stuck the probe to the bottom of the tank, and used clear mailing tape to secure the wire across the bottom, and all the way up the side. Then I just rolled up the excess and put a wire tie on it, and I leave the unit sitting on top of the Viv.

As far as the snake eating it, I wouldn't think that's too likely, as it should never smell like food.

JCD

 

[janew]

Heat mats DO get hot! All heat sources should really be controlled by a thermostat. Tape the probe to the floor of the tank at the hottest part of the mat (temp could vary by as much as 10 degrees F on different points on the mat, so you'll need to measure with a decent thermometer), and set it at about 83/84, again using a thermometer rather than relying on the thermostat dial.

Over 90 degrees on the substrate is way too hot, you're asking for burns and regurge problems allowing it to get that high.

 

[Arson]

Here is a quote straight out of the Corn Snake Manual by Kathy Love:

"Spotlights or hooded reflectors may also be used to direct incandescent light to a special basking rock or branch that the snake can utilize easily. Be sure that such a source of radiant heat is aimed at only one end of the cage so a cooler and darker retreat exists at the far end. The basking temperature on the perch site directly under the lamp should be approximately 95 degrees F. This slightly 'too hot' spot allows the snake to thermoregulate properly to reach the temperatures it desires or needs, but also lets it move away from it when warm enough just as it would do in sunlight."

--- Bill Love and Kathy Love, Corn Snake Manual, Copyright 2000 by Advanced Vivarium Systems Inc.


Now, I understand this is referring to radiant heat sources, but it also suggests that even 95 degrees is tolerable by corn snakes when needed or desired. I don't see where 91 degrees is an issue as long as the snake has plenty of alternative spots with much cooler temperatures.

Anyone?

 

[MegF.]

I would think that as long as you have gradients of temps available, the snake will pick what is comfortable for them. My warm side is actually two gradients. The UTH is under half of the hider cave, so it's warmer in one section of the cave than the other. I also have a log in the cool end, and a basking rock with my amels favorite hiding thing....a paper towel. She also likes laying in the planter that her plant is in (no tray). My amel actually spends more time in the cool side even if she's just fed. So far there's never been a problem, so it must be right for her.