Read these numbers, they will blow your mind.

[Austin M]

Austin I didn’t expect to agree with you but I do on many points. There were some big mistakes made by the banks and the building industry over the last decade. But it was not all a lie. There was a real building boom, with real people buying and living in those houses. Now some of those loans should not have been made, no question. But those people have been weeded out over the last few years. Those houses have been foreclosed on and resold at a loss to the banks.

This housing mess is much more complex then people getting loans they couldn't afford in my opinion.

I agree there was a real building boom. We may disagree that the real boom was bad for the country? Contrary to popular belief we have finite resources and maybe we should have been using them on something other than more expensive houses?

We have been loosing jobs and are still loosing jobs. So I don't think we are done weeding out those who got loans they couldn't afford yet. Oh, and I don't think the banks lost too much either. They made their money on the way up and our government, Republicans and Democrats alike, made sure they made money on the way down.

Many people who don’t kneel at the alter of debt made very good money during that decade. I was one. I have spent my entire life staying out of debt. It is one of my highest priorities. That does not say that I don’t borrow money or borrowing is bad because that is not the case. I borrowed a lot of money and I have invested it wisely and repaid all of those loans. I built several homes on speculation over the last decade and have sold all of them at a substantial profit.

What if I sold Kirby Sweepers for a living, and everyone who bought one got a $15k loan in order to pay for it. Lets say I was a debt free person. Although I may not kneel at the alter of debt I would be making a living off of the offerings layed at the alter of debt. If people stopped tithing at this alter of debt I may have to find new work weather I knelt at the alter or not?

If you sold your homes while the offering plate was full, kudos to you! Where would you be if you were sitting on those houses now though?

Why can’t the post office operate at a profit like UPS and Fed Ex? One very good reason is because they don’t need to. They are not a for profit business. It doesn’t matter if they waste money. It doesn’t matter if they move slowly. If they need more money they will just raise the price of a stamp. I mean it’s not like their customers are going to quit using the mail. It is the same with any government run “business”. The government has no place in business. Should never have been there to begin with.

So should we shut down the US postal service, public school system, fire departments, public libraries, or how about our public roads? Again I think I understand you point, but sometimes I wonder if for profit works for everything?

Name one single operation, function, enterprise, where the government is doing a better job than the private sector. I don’t need to wait for your answer because you and I both know there are none.

The military?:noevil:

 

[wade]

This housing mess is much more complex then people getting loans they couldn't afford in my opinion.

I agree there was a real building boom. We may disagree that the real boom was bad for the country? Contrary to popular belief we have finite resources and maybe we should have been using them on something other than more expensive houses?

So should the government tell people what they should be spending their money on? Isn't the decision to build a new home the home buyers decision? Who decides what we should be spending our money on?

We have been loosing jobs and are still loosing jobs. So I don't think we are done weeding out those who got loans they couldn't afford yet. Oh, and I don't think the banks lost too much either. They made their money on the way up and our government, Republicans and Democrats alike, made sure they made money on the way down.

Very few people can afford any loan when they loose their job. If your home goes into foreclosure after you loose your job that is not because you took a loan you can't afford. How many people could borrow money if they could only borrow what they could afford while unemployed?

I know the public perception is the gov bailed out all the banks and now they are rich, but that is sadly wrong. Many banks didn't take the money because of the strings the gov attached to the money. Others who took the money quickly paid it back to get out from under those strings. None of the banks got enough to cover their looses, it was enough money to keep them from going under.

I my small community there have been two fairly large banks go under because their looses were too high for them to remain capitalized. There are two others that are on the brink. The chairman of the board of one of those banks is my best friend. Let me tell you loud and clear, nobody made money going up or down.

What if I sold Kirby Sweepers for a living, and everyone who bought one got a $15k loan in order to pay for it. Lets say I was a debt free person. Although I may not kneel at the alter of debt I would be making a living off of the offerings layed at the alter of debt. If people stopped tithing at this alter of debt I may have to find new work weather I knelt at the alter or not?

Do you expect the gov to guarantee your income during down turns in the market? Do you want a promise that there will always be somebody to buy your product? I can't do that. This is what is called free enterprise. The free part is free to get rich or free to go broke. No promises.

If you sold your homes while the offering plate was full, kudos to you! Where would you be if you were sitting on those houses now though?

If I can't sell my product, I go broke. That is the way the system works. Making good decisions is part of success in business. The people who made bad decisions went broke. Free enterprise.

So should we shut down the US postal service, public school system, fire departments, public libraries, or how about our public roads? Again I think I understand you point, but sometimes I wonder if for profit works for everything?

There are some functions that absolutely should be preformed by the gov. I think the post office is a dinosaur that will soon die. Mail will soon be electronic, they obviously cannot compete with the open market when it comes to moving packages. Public Schools have been under fire for decades. Those who can afford it take their kids to private schools because they offer a better education.

Some activities do not lend themselves to business. Our community offers public libraries and public swimming pools and parks, not because they can do it better than the public sector but because it enhances our community.

I have a hard time blaming everything one the big guys or the rich guys or the government. Sometimes that just sounds like sour grapes to me.

 

[Austin M]

I have a hard time blaming everything one the big guys or the rich guys or the government. Sometimes that just sounds like sour grapes to me.

No sour grapes from me. I think there is enough blame for everyone in this country. I think Americans are spoiled brats that want to get rich quick and want something for nothing. My generation is awful in my opinion. We think cheap, disposable consumer goods are necessities. We want it all and don't want to work hard to get it. My generation wants to start out with a standard of living as high as there parents, who worked 25 years to get where they are. So my generation is the debt generation.

I blame everyone, including myself.

 

[wade]

So my generation is the debt generation.

Sad to say but I agree with you on that.