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Bella suprised me this morning

N

nicolefowler2005

New member
I have today off so I'm home going through my "snake" journal and I look over at Bella's tank and see a huge skin stuck amidst the greenery!! I feel like a terrible mother because I just fed her last night and everything went normal!! I've been handling her quite frequently the past week or so and she hasn't shown any kind of frustration or agitation at all! I check my snakes over quite frequently and she did not show any sign of blue whatsoever or I never would have fed her last night! My question is....even though she didn't regurgitate could this be harmful to her where she shed the same day she ate? She must have shed overnight because I know that wasn't in there last night


Nicole
 
No. No problem at all. Congrats. Shedding is always a fun milestone and event in our snakey's lives.

I missed a shed once. I handled Dolly and I thought he looked a little dull. He shed the next day. He ate right through it. Yes, I felt stupid. And he was a normal, so no excuse on missing. So far, I haven't missed again.
 
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Usually it's super easy to tell when she is in blue because she looks so dull but this time she honestly looked totally normal and her behavior was as usual, I do feel pretty stupid lol


Nicole
 
We may miss a shed sometimes if they don't show signs. The thing with feeding during shed is that, if you feed very close to the actual shed, the skin can't go down the lump, the snake will probably regurge to shed completely.
If Bella has not regurged and the skin has come off, then no problems for now. Maybe the mice you feed her are not that big and the skin could stretch a bit and come down.
 
Well Bella is 46g and Tessa is 50g and I have them both on Fuzzies about 8g every 5 days. Should I go bigger with more days in between maybe?


Nicole
 
I didn't mean you aren't feeding enough. Just that in this case the lump was not so big as to block the skin.
They are on an adequate schedule, altough at 50gr you can start transitioning to 8-10gr hoppers every 6 days.
 
Ok i was just making sure I wasn't under feeding them! They are both growing up so fast though!! How often do you guys do a total aspen change?


Nicole
 
I wouldn't worry. She knows what she is doing. I offer Rufus mice even when he's about to shed. On 2 occasions he has accepted and eaten the mice, and on 2 occasions he has turned them down. I even have a picture of him swallowing a mouse while his eyes are "In Blue." You can see the lump where he has just swallowed a mouse and you can see his eyes are definitely clouded over.
 

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if you know they are in blue it's ok to wait. But if they are acting hungry and "Hunting" then it's ok to feed them too.

There are a lot of folks that will say it's bad to feed a shedding snake and that it can lead to regurgitation. I'm not going to argue about it, but I will tell you this. I have had 5 pet snakes since I was age 17. (I'm 58 now). Rufus is my 5th snake. I'm not a breeder, I just like snakes. I have had 2 boas, an Eastern King snake, a Ball python, and now Rufus a corn snake. The only snake I ever had feeding issues with was with the Ball Python, and she would refuse to eat sometimes. I got tired of dealing with her so I "re-homed her" to somebody that was more patient and willing than I was at the time. I have never, repeat never, in any of my snakes had regurgitations. (Knock Wood) I know it's always a possibility, but I personally believe that most of the regurgitation issues we hear about are due to improper handling, or incorrect temps.
 
Nicole,
The reason most snakes don't regurge during the shed cycle but some do is timing. If a snake eats at the beginning of the shed cycle then he/she has time to digest before the actual shedding of the old skin. If you feed close to the actual shedding and there is a lump still showing then it is possible the snake will regurge. The reason why is the snake has to contract and expand its body to separate the old skin from the new. If the lump in their stomach prevents the expansion and contraction then they will have to regurge to complete the shed. The younger the snake the more danger there is to the snake from the regurge. This has been witnessed by me and many other long time keepers and breeders. This is why it is highly recommended not to feed during the shed cycle. There is no point in it. No snake will not starve by waiting an extra week to eat. :)

Are you going to the New England Reptile Expo this Sunday ?
 
Omg I had no idea there was a man Expo on Sunday!! I'm so excited now and would love to go!! Where is it? I didn't even know they ever had them in Maine!!


Nicole
 
daddio207 said:
Nicole,
The reason most snakes don't regurge during the shed cycle but some do is timing. If a snake eats at the beginning of the shed cycle then he/she has time to digest before the actual shedding of the old skin. If you feed close to the actual shedding and there is a lump still showing then it is possible the snake will regurge. The reason why is the snake has to contract and expand its body to separate the old skin from the new. If the lump in their stomach prevents the expansion and contraction then they will have to regurge to complete the shed. The younger the snake the more danger there is to the snake from the regurge. This has been witnessed by me and many other long time keepers and breeders. This is why it is highly recommended not to feed during the shed cycle. There is no point in it. No snake will not starve by waiting an extra week to eat. :)

Are you going to the New England Reptile Expo this Sunday ?
Click to expand...

Of the few thousand hatchlings I worked with at RbM, I've only ever witnessed them getting shed stuck around their bellies rather than regurging a meal to shed properly. Maybe the adults knew better, or maybe RbM snakes are just...special. :shrugs:
 
nicolefowler2005 said:
Oh bummer do you have any idea when there will be one in Maine? I have to work Sunday so I wouldn't be able to make it to NH


Nicole
Click to expand...

Northeast reptile Expo usually does 2. One in Portland and one in Bangor but he didn't last year :(

Maine Herpetological Society does one in August/Sept every year in Portland.

New England Reptile Expo in Manchester NH does 3 a year. Maybe you can make the next one :)
 
daddio207 said:
The reason most snakes don't regurge during the shed cycle but some do is timing. There is no point in it. No snake will not starve by waiting an extra week to eat.
Click to expand...

Dragonling said:
Of the few thousand hatchlings I worked with at RbM, I've only ever witnessed them getting shed stuck around their bellies rather than regurging a meal to shed properly. Maybe the adults knew better, or maybe RbM snakes are just...special. :shrugs:
Click to expand...

Like I said, it's all in the timing....
A snake will digest its prey in about 24+/- hours so it is a small window that eating during the shed cycle will cause a regurge. If human intervention wasn't available for the hatchlings with the stuck shed around their bellies then the hatchling has to make a choice. Wait to finish digesting and try to complete the shed process or regurge in order to finish shedding.

The two important points being made are....
1. Regurges especially in hatchlings can be catastrophic for the wellbeing of the snake.
2. Even though the odds are small that the snake will regurge during the shed cycle why take the chance? If you recognize that your snake is in "blue" then there is no value in feeding him/her. Your snake can skip a meal.

If the odds are 10% or even 1% chance that your snake might regurge from feeding during the shed cycle verses zero chance of a negative outcome by skipping the meal why would anybody choose to feed? :shrugs:



This info is based in fact not feelings by herpers that have been around as long as RbM. I've personally witnessed it. Until it happens to you you think "what's the harm?". Well from experience I found out what the harm is!
:)
 
Well thank you I wouldn't want to risk any harm coming to my babies so I will not feed as long as I know they are in blue but with my AMEL it's so hard to tell sometimes because she goes through the process so quickly her eyes are only cloudy for like a day or two tops!!


Nicole
 
nicolefowler2005 said:
Well thank you I wouldn't want to risk any harm coming to my babies so I will not feed as long as I know they are in blue but with my AMEL it's so hard to tell sometimes because she goes through the process so quickly her eyes are only cloudy for like a day or two tops!!
Nicole
Click to expand...

Sorry Nicole,
My last post was meant more for the general public reading this thread. Not you specifically :)

Even I have fed amel morph snakes not realizing they were in their shed cycle.
 
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