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New Bloodred Corn . . .

SODERBERGD

New member
I guess this is the best place to post about this new line of bloodred corns. Perhaps the photo gallery would be better.

How these came to be is one of those looooonnnngggg stories, but for now the main player in the history of this snake is WALTER SMITH. If not for his insight, these new bloods might not have happened. I understand that he got the male we used to make these from Brad McDonald. We have yet to discover the true origins of these gems, but breeding trials will surely lead us to the starting place. Later, you'll see how tracking down the original gene carriers is not so clear. Like many genes, we may never discover the first captive carrier.

I'll go into more details about the family tree of this line in later posts of this thread. Here is one picture of what Rob and Louise Stevens call pie bald or PIED bloodreds. BTW, Rob and Louise have some of the brothers and sisters of my breeders so they'll be breeding these soon if they don't already have some. Since the piebaldism is mostly restricted to the sides, I'm leaning towards calling them pied sided bloods. I always like to look ahead and in case we later see a completely piebald corn like the ball pythons, this will help distinguish between the two in case they're not allelic. Very few of the places where white is located is disjunct from the belly white. Some have a few patches or scales of white on the face and some have smatterings of white disjunct from the ventral lateral junction of white and red you see on most corns. Suffice it to say, the majority of the white on the ones I hatched are connected to the white on the bellies. A nice sideline is that this line carries what you'd call a red sided trait whether or not they have the white laterally.

I'll post some more pictures later today when I get more caught up around here. "Caught up". Yeah, right. The squirmy little buggers don't love the camera so it's not only difficult to get them to co-operate, but the white is in so many places, it's tough to get just the right angle to show their most attractive profile. A better camera would help. I hope my wife is reading this. ahhuuumm

Walter, I cannot thank you enough for calling me three years ago and asking for my participation in this project. I'll give everyone the whole story when I get more time to type.
 

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all i can say is wow thats something. thank you for sharing that pic. mom!!! i want 1!!! :sidestep: lol.
 
Holy freakin' cow, I have tears in my eyes over that one! I am just blown away!! GOD, I love corn snakes!!
 
Ahhhh.....here are the little gems. This is going to open up a WHOLE NEW path for the bloodred corns. Oh boy, I can just see the "pied sided" anery bloods & amel bloods & caramel blood &......well, you get the drift. SWEEEEET!!

What eye candy! Major congratulations to you.
 
Wow... that's weird-looking. It almost looks like the belly pattern and coloration were forced up the sides of the corn. Is there any variation on the width of the normal pattern amongst individuals? (I'm trying to picture a snake with that coloration all the way up to the spine, and no normal pattern... THAT could be fun.)

-Kat
 
Price . . .

hediki said:
would this new blood allow the present blood price to drop a good amount?

Well, these ain't gonna be cheap. I produced about 13 of 'em and I don't want to sell any this year. I farmed out several pairs for safe keeping in case a meteorite hits my snake building. Might have some for sale next year, but suffice it to say, they'll be expensive enough that people will keep buying regular bloods. More variety like this always enhances the marketability of all related morphs.
 
Wow Don, congratulations! That is truly a unique looking snake. I'm glad you chose to share it with us! I can't wait to see what the future holds for this gene!

*dreams* Lav pied sided....butter pied sided....


Very exciting indeed!
 
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Variety . . .

Kat said:
Wow... that's weird-looking. It almost looks like the belly pattern and coloration were forced up the sides of the corn. Is there any variation on the width of the normal pattern amongst individuals? (I'm trying to picture a snake with that coloration all the way up to the spine, and no normal pattern... THAT could be fun.)

-Kat

Just like the pied snakes in other species, "no two alike". I'm seeing the entire scale regarding quantity and location. Here are few other shots.
 

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Wow! That's a darn cool lookin critter. Are these expected to mature like regular bloods? That is, will the pattern diffuse over time to where the top half of the snake is basically red?
 
new bloods

SODERBERGD said:
Just like the pied snakes in other species, "no two alike". I'm seeing the entire scale regarding quantity and location. Here are few other shots.
Hi Don,
What are the chances of that blood having some white-sided rat snake in them? I just got a female white-sided to breed next season with my original blood strain that I have. Very interesting Don............I'll keep looking for most posts on this thread.

Thanks
 
Doubtful . .

franklin said:
Hi Don,
What are the chances of that blood having some white-sided rat snake in them? I just got a female white-sided to breed next season with my original blood strain that I have. Very interesting Don............I'll keep looking for most posts on this thread.

Thanks

White sided in most snakes is an all-or-nuthin' deal. You get white from the belly to the dorso-lateral line or not at all. I don't see how it could be in this line. I've been breeding the dam of my line to other bloods for many years and all the babies are classics. Nothing at all unusual from breeding her to several bloodred males over the years. Well, 'till now, that is.
 
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Pretty cool looking critters, Don! Any pics of the adults? What do they turn out looking like at maturity?
 
What an incredibly awesome development. From the looks of everything so far, they seem like they will mature like normal bloodreds, but who knows. Maybe the white will go pink?!?! lol Awesome Don. I can't wait to see how these guys progress. And I second Rich...lets see these adults! :)
 
very cool snake

and Franklin, I had the same idea! I bought some white-sided everglades to breed with a bloodred. I figured it would make some awesome red snakes, and whitesided corn (hybrids) would look cool. If you do the breeding, I would love to hear about your results. I have a 2003 and 2004 female WS glades, the 2004 is poss het hypo. Don's WS bloodreds look like what I expected the offspring to look like (some red would likely "bleed" into the white, just as it does on the WS glades, and just as it does on the belly of the bloodred.)
 
Nothing special . . .

Rich Z said:
Pretty cool looking critters, Don! Any pics of the adults? What do they turn out looking like at maturity?

The parents are just bloodreds. Of the six or seven I got from my half of the breeding loan with Walter, only one showed any white on it. I estimate approximately 10 white scales in a total of two or three places. These were just what you and I have seen for years, Rich. Bloodreds where the belly white snuck up a few places. This one looks like many I have had over the years. I never thought much about it, but when Walter said he had one with quite a bit, we put them together. The rest of the story is gonna wow ya. I discussed it with Serp and a few others in the past couple of weeks. The jury's still out on the heritable mechanism, but I'm reasonably sure it's recessive from the progeny ratio.

Suffice it to say, Mama and one of her daughters has a few white patches out of place, but all the other are just good, red, bloods. Nothing to write home about. ROB, did any of the F1s you got from Walter have inordinate amounts of white out of place? I know the Grandsire of these has quite a bit. Post a picture of the grandsire to show how that white looks against red. BTW, the white does not go pink. It stays white if the sample breeders we have are accurate representatives of this trait. I'm sure they are.

Don
 
Don said in email that the white stays white.

I'd love to see a picture of an adult, too.
 
I think it's a safe bet that it's heritable, given how many of them popped out of the same line. I can see this being the same mutation as the ones known in whitesided yellow rats and black rats. But, as always, that wouldn't mean it had to come from one of those species. IMO this is a more extreme expression of the same thing the diffusion gene does. Like all the plain-bellied corns we've seen so far, it appears that the belly pattern is not simply absent, but rather it never completed its journey down to the belly and is sitting on the sides of the snake.

The big question now is whether it's:
A- an allele on the Diffusion locus
B- a mutation on an independent locus
C- a mutation on an independent locus that only expresses itself when diffusion is present

I'm also very curious about how it will behave in homozygous motleys and stripes. It'll take several years to get answers to any of these questions, but it should be plenty of fun in the meantime. :)

BTW I like the term pied-sided. I'm sure it'll get shortened to PS or something.

Oh, and Don if you need additional meteor-proofing, I'd be happy to volunteer for that duty. :D
 
SODERBERGD said:
BTW, the white does not go pink. It stays white if the sample breeders we have are accurate representatives of this trait. I'm sure they are.

Don

Lol I wouldn't expect it to. That was just a joke Don. :)
 
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