145 degree hotspot...

My good friend Charlie Green passed away from brain cancer in January, and I bought one of his Freedom Breeder racks. He had been experimenting with HOT hot spots after a friend and I had discussed how darn hot to the touch basking snakes are sometimes found. He had installed heat tape towards the back of the three foot tubs, and cranked them wide open. He was using this method for all his colubrids, but I bought the rack primarily for western hognose.
To back up a little, when I bought my 5 tesseras a couple years back, I sent one with Charlie, one with my friend Clay, took two home and kept one at the shop. I figured this would decrease my odds of disaster. When I got all the subadults back, the Miami animal kept by Charlie was twice the weight of the next largest sibling.

He didn't power feed, or really do anything differently except have a much hotter hot spot than I. And I was already using 105+ degrees! I realize genetics could play a role in this animal's size vs. the others. So to further tinker, I now have a few of my breeder corns (and all my hogs) in his 30 tub rack, being kept the same way. So far, so good. The snakes definitely digest food much quicker, and are hungry sooner. I have not had a single female lay outside of the laying box using this method, which was a concern. The hoggies in particular seem to flatten right out on the hot spot after a meal, often burrowing to get right on the heat. My hogs are having the best breeding season yet, though much more experimentation will be needed before making any claims beyond what I'm observing in season one. Just thought you guys might find this of interest and I'll update as needed. I can also add some photos, even showing the temp gun reading lest anyone has doubts. Thanks for looking!

I some how think this is a terrible idea. No offense, but snakes die in much cooler temperatures.

Interesting Chip!!

I can't see this being for the faint of heart though. Certainly not something I would outright recommend to anyone, but any interesting experiment.

What is the airflow like for the tubs?

If you're using ARS or Vision, the airflow is spectacular. I have some ARS cages, and they work very well.

My experience with snakes is extremely limited, so maybe you're onto something, but it seems to me that it would be more of just a limiting factor.

Basically, with a very hot spot like that, I'd expect that the snakes are going over to it, warming up, then being forced back over to the cooler areas as they start to overheat.

When they've got a more optimal heat zone through, they can just spend most of thier time there safely.

That would be my view of it. Of course, I could be totally wrong and you've hit on something. I guess only time and experimentation can tell. I certainly wouldn't be willing to test it out though with my pets.

Oh wow... I'm sorry but I'm glad this works for you but any hotter than 110 is SCARY. And with 110 you would HAVE to have a much cooler hide in the mid-high 80s. I've heard horror stories of frying snakes even in the 100ish mark. If anyone else is trying to do this you MUST MUST MUST have proper airflow.

I just did some searching through some scientific journals and found an interesting article on the topic. Its a little, ok a LOT dated (1977) but basically they looked at how corn snakes thermoregulate post-feeding in order to maximize digestion. Basically the debate we're having here.

To sum up their findings, it seems that even with max substrate temps at 33C (91.4F), the snakes preferred to thermoregulate at 27.9 (82.2F). That seems to be much more in line with the mainstream recommendations.... Hot spot at 85-90ish with gradient down to 80-85ish.

Here's the article if anyone else wants to take a look. You might have to have google scholar though in order to view:

http://www.jstor.org/stable/view/30155760

Carinata said:

I some how think this is a terrible idea. No offense, but snakes die in much cooler temperatures.

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Snakes don't die at 74ish, which they have access to if the backs get too warm for their liking. I am simply trying to duplicate nature. In over a year, results have been anything than "terrible." I may change my tune after eggs hatch or something, but I am pretty encouraged.

BloodyBaroness said:

Interesting Chip!!

I can't see this being for the faint of heart though. Certainly not something I would outright recommend to anyone, but any interesting experiment.

What is the airflow like for the tubs?

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Excellent. The tops are iron mesh, so the heat rises off pretty quickly. The very rear of the tubs temp gun at around 145, the fronts are mid 70's. There's enough gradient in 36" to not worry about cooking anything, as long as the room stays cool. I remain ready to put thermostats on them if the animals seemed to hold close to the fronts, but that hasn't happened.

There's enough gradient in 36" to not worry about cooking anything

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As long as that's the case, I'd say you're safe. Keep us posted on how this works out! Would definitely be interesting to experiment with...

Maybe take half a clutch raised in these environments, half raised in traditional settings, and keep everything else the same (substrate, feeding frequency/size/etc) and then report yearling avg weights/lengths, give shed records, etc.

I think it's the rack you're using. With any other conventional rack, it would get much to hot and not have nearly enough ventilation.

experiment scrapped

While I thought I'd give this a full season, most of the corns never utilized the back third of their enclosure. I've dropped the thermostat back to 105 on the corns (directly on the heat tape), and I am still running heat wide open for 3 rows of hognose, but outside of immediately following a meal, it just seemed to be wasting real estate for almost all of the corns. Interestingly, two individuals (of 21 corns) were exceptions. This tessera male is the most hot-natured snake in my collection. He would get all the way to the back even on an empty belly, however, there was no way to determine what percentage of his time was spent at a certain temp, etc. so hardly scientific.


Some here have disparaged me behind my back for this experiment, and that's their prerogative. I know no corn snake book or care sheet in existence recommends a 140 degree hot spot. But I think we are often guilty of listening so intently to the words of others, we forget to listen to the animals themselves. Some of you have surely field-collected a corn snake basking on a hot driveway. I've never had a temp gun handy at these moments, but their body temperatures are damn sure a sight over 85. So I thought such an experiment might prove valuable to the hobby. As long as there was a 36" gradient and tons of ventilation, I felt sure I wasn't risking the lives or health of the snakes... I might have been risking a year of production for this group, but those I bred produced normally. And it's proving my best year yet in western hogs.

I encourage you all to break free from the care sheet once in a while. Believe it or not, we probably aren't done learning about the most popular pet snake in the world. If the only advancements to ever be made from here on out are new morphs & combos, you could make an argument that we are all wasting our time. I can save you time on a super hot hotspot, though! And I wouldn't know this for sure if I hadn't tried it.

Well, it's not that it's higher than care sheets recommend... it's the fact that keepers have lost snakes to heating malfunctions where the temps got 90+. I don't know that anyone has a "perogative".

Interesting experiment, but I don't think it's a good idea because of the risk and the fact that there is zero benefit. Even IF the snakes prove to always grow faster. They're growing at a perfectly acceptable rate at normal temps and it's proven to be healthy.