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Baltimore to ban snakes over 5'

The Nothing

Immoral Support
http://baltimorehealth.org/press/2007_02_02_AnimalRegs.pdf

Comments on the rules should be sent to Assistant Commissioner Olivia Farrow at Environmental Health, 210 Guilford Ave., second floor, Baltimore 21202, or by e-mail to [email protected].


they're looking to ban snakes over 5'
green iguanas under 30 inches and over 5'
and ALL scorpions and tarantulas


they're looking at a $80 lifetime permit for people with pigeons and pigs, but not for herps/inverts!
 
LoL. How are they going to enforce such a rule? It's amazing how apparently 'bored' some of these folks are that write up these laws.
 
Okay, am I the only one that doesn't understand what danged a 5'2" snake would be to a 5'8" average sized human?? God, and to think it's coming from my home state...

I will be commenting, don't you worry. They can have my snake right after they take my guns... and only when they pry both from my cold dead fingers, the #&$^@%#$!!! :uzi: :fullauto: :twoguns:
 
stangs13 said:
Im pretty sure that the permit goes for herps also. its a really sad thing.

if it DID cover herps, I wouldn't be spamming this all over the internet
page 9 of the document shows what you CAN get a permit for - Pigeons, Potbellied Pigs, and Chickens
 
My bad, I read it wrong. I have some medicine in my eye and it is kinda blurry.:rolleyes: This really sucks. Many people have over 50 snakes that are over 5ft in Baltimore.
 
The Nothing said:
if it DID cover herps, I wouldn't be spamming this all over the internet
page 9 of the document shows what you CAN get a permit for - Pigeons, Potbellied Pigs, and Chickens

And God knows 50 pigeons are MUCH less of a hazard than a 5'1" corn snake or ball python. This is, without a doubt, the most messed up thing I have ever read. Iguanas under 30" are MORE LIKELY to give us salmonella, are they? I see nothing about water turtles, raw chicken or people who don't wash their hands after using the potty in this ban.

This is just blatant discrimination against reptiles, especially "scary" and "dangerous" ones. There's no other word for it. I have posted this on EVERY site I am a member at (about 8 so far) regardless of whether they are a reptile site or not. This kind of idiocy will spread if it's not slapped down right away. So slap, please, and slap hard!!
 
Is it about salmonella? That's upid. I heard a thing on NPR that said 80something % of raw chicken carries salmonella.

They want to ban snakes that can get over 5 feet? So what do they want people to do? Only keep smaller snakes like ringnecks and green snakes that are more difficult to feed and more likely to escape? Makes sense to me... :shrugs:
 
Okay, maybe I'm not understanding correctly, but from their wording it looks as if you can have a snake until it reaches a length over 5 feet? It doesn't say "snake species" just "snakes".
 
that seems to be correct, Jenni.


It only takes one person to speak up. In Yokohama Japan, a friend of mine was facing a similar ban on reptiles. He, a petstore owner, and 4 other people faced the city council, educated then, and got the law dropped. The same should work in Baltimore. This is clearly a law based on fear, not knowledge.
 
The other thing that is stupid about this law is that it shows the lawmakers for the unconcerned imbeciles they really are.

Yes, they are going to allow Potbelly pigs with a permit. But only up to 120 pounds?? What happens when your little porker reaches 130... 140... 150?? They get taken to the Baltimore Animal Rescue and Care Shelter, that's what, and they languish there because no one will adopt them, and are eventually put to sleep. Of all the exotic animals that could make an acceptable city pet, a Vietnamese Potbelly Pig is NOT one I'd reccomend- whereas, a Corn Snake or Ball Python is. They don't need to do the outside thing, they are quiet, easy to care for (compared to a VPP anyway!), and are pretty much the perfect city pet.

I live in Baltimore County, but I can tell you that I will be fighting this as loud as I can, not only in support of my fellow herp-owners in the city, but also to prevent something this stupid from getting passes and my county going "Oh, golly, gee, we should do that too!"

It only takes 10 minutes to write a decent email... so if you can, please do. Allowing even one city to pass such a horrible law is too much.
 
Good to finally come across someone in the area...

can this be petitioned?
I'm not sure what it takes to gather signatures at a legal level, but with a herp show this weekend, i'm sure you can get more than enough signatures to fight this.
 
Unfortunately, I am not much of a "legal guru." I don't really understand the law with regards to the number of signatures required to stop this from happening. I've also never been to the herp show in Bel Air, so I don't know who is present at the show. I assume MARS (Mid-Atlantic Reptile Rescue) would be there, but I don't know for sure, and to be honest, I wonder if they would chose to fight something like this. I don't know what their political agenda or beliefs are regarding captive reptiles.
 
Hypancistrus said:
Unfortunately, I am not much of a "legal guru." I don't really understand the law with regards to the number of signatures required to stop this from happening. I've also never been to the herp show in Bel Air, so I don't know who is present at the show. I assume MARS (Mid-Atlantic Reptile Rescue) would be there, but I don't know for sure, and to be honest, I wonder if they would chose to fight something like this. I don't know what their political agenda or beliefs are regarding captive reptiles.
Have you tried your local herp society? I am sure they would have more info on this. If anyone can help stop this law is the local herp club.

Maryland Herpetological Society
2643 N. Charles St.
Baltimore, Maryland 21218
United States
410-235-6116
http://www.marylandnature.org

Membership to MHS: $25/yr. individual $35/yr. family
Request Update

I am sure this is a good place to start since they are located in Baltimore.

Another group to hit up for help is

Maryland Reptiles, Amphibians and Invertebrates Club

3401 dodge park rd #t-2
landover, Maryland 20785
United States
301-773-5138
http://www.mdreptiles.com
[email protected]
for people who loves reptiles
Request Update

http://www.mdreptiles.com/
 
Thanks, those are great links! I knew about the herp society... unfortunately, their website seems a bit useless. The other one I did not know about though.
 
I wrote. Got a response saying they had others who support my postion and they will consider...

I also do not live in the city but it'd be great if some of you could do a quick email. you all are bringing up some very good points.
 
Silly is as Silly...

does. I don't know about you guys, but I'm about tired of this sh*t!
 
Cflaguy said:
does. I don't know about you guys, but I'm about tired of this sh*t!

Darn straight! I say we get us some pitchforks and flaming torches and march on City Hall!!! :grin01:

In all seriousness, it does get old after a while, having people constantly attacking your hobby.
 
If anyone is interested in a template, this is the email I sent. I plan on following this up with a written letter.

Good morning, Ms. Farrow,

I am writing to you as a concerned citizen and reptile hobbyist after having read the Baltimore Sun article about your proposed ban of a variety of reptiles, including snakes over 5 feet in length, caimans, crocodilians, and iguanas (except those between the length of 30" and 5 feet). As a proud owner of a captive bred juvenile corn snake, purchased this year at the Mid-Atlantic Reptile Show in Timonium, I am hoping to persuade you to reconsider a ban of these animals.

Ms. Farrow, as a resident of *******, MD, I am familiar with the troubles that urban residents can go through in finding the "perfect pet"- dogs require too much time outside, many people are allergic to cats, and birds are often too loud for the close quarters of an apartment, condo, or townhome. Reptiles, however, are very nearly the perfect city pet. They are quiet, they don't smell, don't require time outside, can often be housed easily in a small home or apartment, and if captive bred and well cared for, the chance of disease transmission is much less than the wide variety of mammalian pets available at stores today.

I was thus incredibly dissapointed to see that you intend to ban all snakes over 5 foot in adult length, while allowing individuals to apply for permits to keep 120 pound Vietnamese potbelly pigs! My corn snake will reach an adult length of 4-6 feet, and most Ball Pythons, another popular snake species, will max out around 6 feet in length, though slightly heavier than a corn snake. Both of these animals make excellent pets for first time reptile owners, and are readily available as captive bred specimens, with a relatively low risk of disease transfer. In addition, both species can easily be housed in 4 foot long aquariums or custom-cages, which fit quite nicely into most homes and apartments. While there are snake species available that grow to adult sizes of less than 5 feet, they are not as commonly available as the more popular corn snakes and ball pythons, and often the only way to obtain a specimen of a less common snake species is to purchase a wild caught animal, which increases the risk of disease transferance, along with reducing already struggling wild populations.

I understand the logic behind your iguana length window, and I hope that this will encourage people to adopt older iguanas as opposed to purchasing hatchlings without full knowlege of the lengths that adults can attain. However, large male iguanas have been known to grow to 6 feet, including tail, and I wonder what will become of these animals once they exceed the limit set by your department? It is exceedingly difficult to rehome large adult iguanas, as is evidenced by the number that are currently up for adoption through Mid-Atlantic Reptile Rescue and other local humane organizations. I believe it would be wise to increase the upper end of the limit to 6 feet, so that loving owners will not have to surrender a beloved pet simply because he has grown slightly larger than average for the species.

I hope that you will reconsider your decision to ban snakes over the length of 5 feet from Baltimore City limits, as snakes can and do make wonderful pets for apartment, condo and townhome dwellers. They are interesting to watch, quiet and, if well-cared for, have a relatively low risk of disease occurence. A person is much more likely to contract salmonella from the raw chicken they are preparing for dinner than from a well-cared for pet snake! I would support a permit process for so-called "giant snakes," such as boa constrictors and burmese pythons, as these are animals that should be available only to dedicated hobbyists who have taken the time to research their very specific needs and husbandry requirements. Captive bred corn snakes and ball pythons, however, are snakes that even novice reptile keepers can easily enjoy within the constraints of their home.

In conclusion, I hope that you will reconsider your ban of snakes and other reptiles in favor of a permit system similar to that described for pigeons and potbelly pigs, which will allow dedicated reptile enthusiasts the chance to experience new species while at the same time protecting city residents from poorly thought out impulse purchases. Thank you very much for your time, and I look forward to a reply from you on this matter.
 
Thats is a great letter, good for you. Please do post her response to this, I am really wondering what she will say.

Keep us posted.
 
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