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Feeders?
- Thread starter jrobinson
- Start date
pcar
PCar's Reptiles
Well, there is Big Cheese, and Rodent Pro. You can order 25, 50 and more at a time. I have ordered from Big Cheese and found the service to be good. other than that, I just get the pinks and fuzzies from the local pet store and then freeze them on my own.
Hope that this helps.
Hope that this helps.
Itsnowingcorns
Stuffy Brit
I have never ordered off the internet. I get my pinkies and fuzzies already frozen from the pet shop.
Itsnowingcorns
Stuffy Brit
Wow, all this talk of freezing alive sounds really barbaric! I think frozen mice are much more available here in the UK because we are not allowed to feed snakes live mice.
Taceas
USW = UB313
I've used both RodentPro and BigCheese, and I like BigCheese a lot better. After a time, RodentPro's quality started to get really inconsistent, and that doesn't work for me. Big Cheese is perfect each and every time.
BigCheese does cost a hair more, but it makes up for it with the orders arriving vacuum packed, clean, and accurate. Their customer service is top-notch, in my opinion. And if you're like me and don't want 100 to a bag because you're only feeding 15 or so at one time, so you open and close the bag over and over which reduces the fresh quality of the product...Big Cheese worked with me and split up the bags in half. So instead of a bag of 100 pinks, I got 2 bags of 50 each at no extra cost. Which for me, willingness to go that extra step without having to barter is always a welcome sight.
I currently raise and process my own feeders, as *I* control the quality and I get exactly what I want each time without the added cost or inconvenience. I just have a preference over the nutritional difference of fresh meals versus "tv dinners" for my snakes. Just a personal observation that I've noticed.
Convenience is another factor I raise my own. If I've got say, 10 hatchlings...I pull 10 pinks and offer one to each snake. If one or two decides to not eat that day, I just put the pinks back in the nest to grow up to the next larger size for other snakes on another feeding day. There's no waste involved. Where if you had the same 10 snakes in which 2 didn't eat, and were using frozen food...you either re-freeze (max of one time) or toss it in the trash. Well there's ~.30 cents in the trash.
.30 cents doesn't sound like much, but after a while, it adds up especially when you've got a clutch of hatchlings who operate under "I'll eat on every other Wednesday, during a Blue Moon, when the 'coon crosses the road backwards" kind of thing. =P
For the record:
I'm not going to get in the whole discussion again about the differences of husbandry of our fellow herpers over in the UK/Europe. "Different strokes for different folks" is what my dad always said. What other folks do for their snakes is fine by me, so long as their snakes are healthy and well cared for and ultimately they respect my choices of husbandry practices at the same time. =)
I practice responsible feedings, as in only pinks through fuzzies are offered live. Any mouse that has eyes open, teeth present, and is capable of defending itself by inflicting damage on the snake is euthanized humanely before offering to the snake. All snakes are observed while eating to make sure no problems arise, no matter what prey is being offered.
BigCheese does cost a hair more, but it makes up for it with the orders arriving vacuum packed, clean, and accurate. Their customer service is top-notch, in my opinion. And if you're like me and don't want 100 to a bag because you're only feeding 15 or so at one time, so you open and close the bag over and over which reduces the fresh quality of the product...Big Cheese worked with me and split up the bags in half. So instead of a bag of 100 pinks, I got 2 bags of 50 each at no extra cost. Which for me, willingness to go that extra step without having to barter is always a welcome sight.
I currently raise and process my own feeders, as *I* control the quality and I get exactly what I want each time without the added cost or inconvenience. I just have a preference over the nutritional difference of fresh meals versus "tv dinners" for my snakes. Just a personal observation that I've noticed.
Convenience is another factor I raise my own. If I've got say, 10 hatchlings...I pull 10 pinks and offer one to each snake. If one or two decides to not eat that day, I just put the pinks back in the nest to grow up to the next larger size for other snakes on another feeding day. There's no waste involved. Where if you had the same 10 snakes in which 2 didn't eat, and were using frozen food...you either re-freeze (max of one time) or toss it in the trash. Well there's ~.30 cents in the trash.
.30 cents doesn't sound like much, but after a while, it adds up especially when you've got a clutch of hatchlings who operate under "I'll eat on every other Wednesday, during a Blue Moon, when the 'coon crosses the road backwards" kind of thing. =P
For the record:
I'm not going to get in the whole discussion again about the differences of husbandry of our fellow herpers over in the UK/Europe. "Different strokes for different folks" is what my dad always said. What other folks do for their snakes is fine by me, so long as their snakes are healthy and well cared for and ultimately they respect my choices of husbandry practices at the same time. =)
I practice responsible feedings, as in only pinks through fuzzies are offered live. Any mouse that has eyes open, teeth present, and is capable of defending itself by inflicting damage on the snake is euthanized humanely before offering to the snake. All snakes are observed while eating to make sure no problems arise, no matter what prey is being offered.
Itsnowingcorns
Stuffy Brit
Taceas, I have to say your way is very good and you've explained yourself very thoroughly there. I see what you mean about the wasted mice; the amount of times my snakes have refused because of shedding etc. I just wonder, how can you feed those little babies live to the snakes? I couldn't bear to do it.
pcar
PCar's Reptiles
well, I raise my own pinks and fuzzies too...I just make sure that I know in my head that they are feeders and not pets. my wife has gotten attached to the mice colonies so she doesn't like to help me feed anymore when I have to feed pinks and fuzzies...kinda frustrating if you ask me.
Itsnowingcorns
Stuffy Brit
Hmm, I guess so, maybe it's a girl thing....
Taceas
USW = UB313
Sorry, I didn't mean to start an entire other thread about the subject. =P
I don't feed live for the "coolness" factor a lot of people seem to. I feed live due to the conveience of avoiding the excess waste, the convenience of not having to thaw out, and the results I've gotten from feeding live or pre-killed mice.
Little visual experiment: Based on the pics below, which snake do you think is older? (Send me a PM, and I'll tell you the answer.)
Picture #1
Picture #2
Picture #3
Picture #4
You're probably thinking to yourself "if she kills the ones who can inflict damage, why not the little ones to prevent their suffering?" Easy, pre-killing pinks through fuzzies is a very imprecise practice. If done incorrectly, you get one heck of a mess to clean up. And more times than not, I've got a disfigured baby who hangs on for 15-30 mins..suffering by gasping, squeaking, and pawing at the air...which is agonizing to watch or listen to. Where as when a snake does the business, its over in a matter of a couple of minutes, if not less (straight swallowing w/o constriction).
I also think the fact that the pinks (newborn to just before fuzzy) are still in the "impersonal" stage helps quite a bit. Up until they get fully haired out and become a crawler mouse, they all pretty much look the same. The only way I can tell a difference is the eyes. Albinos (or my "hypo" mice) you can see the red eye through their still shut eyelids, and the black/brown mice have darker eye which appear as a dark bluish color through the skin. So, I don't "know" them or what they'll look like (which for girls seems to be the clincher =P )
But once they get closer to this stage:
...it gets increasingly hard to feed them off. These guys are actually a few days past the point where I stop feeding live, note the open eyes and self-bathing. Thankfully most of the ones in this picture are females, and since I'm needing to cycle out some older breeder females these are being raised up as replacements and won't meet their ends for a year or so.
These guys on the other hand:
...are still at the live feeding stage, but they're almost so damned cute I can't do it. Which might explain why most of the "cuter" ones were saved back and are now just beginning their breeding ages.
Thankfully, if you use the prey size appropriate for your snake, it doesn't take too long for the meal to be done and over with They're generally swallowed quickly enough with minimal human anguish involved, to be honest.
Once you do it a few times, it becomes routine and it doesn't hardly bother you much anymore. Plus, growing up in the country where we butchered our own livestock for meat helps as well.
Final thoughts on the subject:
Snakes don't eat carrot-sticks...they eat a once-living creature, and once you get past that realization your view widens to realize what is actually in those plastic wrapped meat containers at the butcher shop. And once you realize where that comes from, you become more concerned with how your meat was processed and what went into that package (artificial ingredients, etc). It's made me a more aware shopper, to the point I buy most of my beef and pork from a locally own and run shop that kills the animals and processes them from death to refridgerated meat case. I don't have to settle for "unknowns and mystery meats" any longer.
And the same is for my mice, I KNOW what I'm feeding them is healthy without additives or artificial ingredients. I have the list of ingredients in my mouse food at hand, I see the nutritional quality of it. And my mice aren't housed in massive barns that smell of ammonia and are mass produced for quantity rather than quality. They're raised in a un-crowded, clean environment in my heated garage with plenty of good food and fresh water. My adult breeders are well taken care of, and I do dote on the babies from time to time as I would do any other pet in my house.
Its just getting past the stigma that PETA and the various other "pet saving" associations perpetuate and the honesty and truth behind it all. There are exceptions to the rule everywhere, you just have to find them. I treat all of my feeders with respect and dignity before they meet their end, what more can someone ask? I don't prolong suffering, nor condone it in any fashion. I don't feed live because "wow dood, its kewl to watch a snake be natural". It is an awesome thing to watch how instinct takes over in a captive bred specimen, but at what length are you willing to put a pet in harm's way? Me?
Not much risk of injury is left to ones without a means to defend themselves, id est pinks - fuzzies.
Does that all make sense? I had to compose this over several different times today, so just making sure it's all coherent and free-flowing.
Maybe we can start a thread on the subject elsewhere, perhaps? =)
I don't feed live for the "coolness" factor a lot of people seem to. I feed live due to the conveience of avoiding the excess waste, the convenience of not having to thaw out, and the results I've gotten from feeding live or pre-killed mice.
Little visual experiment: Based on the pics below, which snake do you think is older? (Send me a PM, and I'll tell you the answer.)
Picture #1
Picture #2
Picture #3
Picture #4
You're probably thinking to yourself "if she kills the ones who can inflict damage, why not the little ones to prevent their suffering?" Easy, pre-killing pinks through fuzzies is a very imprecise practice. If done incorrectly, you get one heck of a mess to clean up. And more times than not, I've got a disfigured baby who hangs on for 15-30 mins..suffering by gasping, squeaking, and pawing at the air...which is agonizing to watch or listen to. Where as when a snake does the business, its over in a matter of a couple of minutes, if not less (straight swallowing w/o constriction).
I also think the fact that the pinks (newborn to just before fuzzy) are still in the "impersonal" stage helps quite a bit. Up until they get fully haired out and become a crawler mouse, they all pretty much look the same. The only way I can tell a difference is the eyes. Albinos (or my "hypo" mice) you can see the red eye through their still shut eyelids, and the black/brown mice have darker eye which appear as a dark bluish color through the skin. So, I don't "know" them or what they'll look like (which for girls seems to be the clincher =P )
But once they get closer to this stage:
...it gets increasingly hard to feed them off. These guys are actually a few days past the point where I stop feeding live, note the open eyes and self-bathing. Thankfully most of the ones in this picture are females, and since I'm needing to cycle out some older breeder females these are being raised up as replacements and won't meet their ends for a year or so.
These guys on the other hand:
...are still at the live feeding stage, but they're almost so damned cute I can't do it. Which might explain why most of the "cuter" ones were saved back and are now just beginning their breeding ages.
Thankfully, if you use the prey size appropriate for your snake, it doesn't take too long for the meal to be done and over with They're generally swallowed quickly enough with minimal human anguish involved, to be honest.
Once you do it a few times, it becomes routine and it doesn't hardly bother you much anymore. Plus, growing up in the country where we butchered our own livestock for meat helps as well.
Final thoughts on the subject:
Snakes don't eat carrot-sticks...they eat a once-living creature, and once you get past that realization your view widens to realize what is actually in those plastic wrapped meat containers at the butcher shop. And once you realize where that comes from, you become more concerned with how your meat was processed and what went into that package (artificial ingredients, etc). It's made me a more aware shopper, to the point I buy most of my beef and pork from a locally own and run shop that kills the animals and processes them from death to refridgerated meat case. I don't have to settle for "unknowns and mystery meats" any longer.
And the same is for my mice, I KNOW what I'm feeding them is healthy without additives or artificial ingredients. I have the list of ingredients in my mouse food at hand, I see the nutritional quality of it. And my mice aren't housed in massive barns that smell of ammonia and are mass produced for quantity rather than quality. They're raised in a un-crowded, clean environment in my heated garage with plenty of good food and fresh water. My adult breeders are well taken care of, and I do dote on the babies from time to time as I would do any other pet in my house.
Its just getting past the stigma that PETA and the various other "pet saving" associations perpetuate and the honesty and truth behind it all. There are exceptions to the rule everywhere, you just have to find them. I treat all of my feeders with respect and dignity before they meet their end, what more can someone ask? I don't prolong suffering, nor condone it in any fashion. I don't feed live because "wow dood, its kewl to watch a snake be natural". It is an awesome thing to watch how instinct takes over in a captive bred specimen, but at what length are you willing to put a pet in harm's way? Me?
Not much risk of injury is left to ones without a means to defend themselves, id est pinks - fuzzies.
Does that all make sense? I had to compose this over several different times today, so just making sure it's all coherent and free-flowing.
Maybe we can start a thread on the subject elsewhere, perhaps? =)
I might try Big Cheese once both my snakes are on fuzzy's. Which will be soon. I did find a pet store about 25 mins away that sells fuzzy's and pinks in groups of 5. They breed them in their own store and feed their reptiles with them. I bought 2 sets of each. The only problem I found is they are packaged in brown bags and when I got home the one set is more hopper size. I'm hoping she will be able to eat them after she finishes up her set of fuzzy's. Now my boy ate 3 pinks last time, if he does the same this time I'm going to give him a small fuzzy, I'm saving two from her first group.
If I had more snakes I would raise my own mice but with only with only two corns it doesn't make sense to go through the trouble. You sound like friends of mine who raise farm animals. You have the farm animals and then you have pets. They are two different things.
Hee hee keeping the cute ones is how my cousin got her one daughter a pet mouse. She was taking care of her other daughter's ball python and she fed live. Well her mom put the mouse in and it ran up her arm and hid in her hair. She couldn't feed it to the snake. Instead she went to the store, bought a cage and another mouse that her husband fed to their daughter's snake. lol! She said she just couldn't do it.
Jean
If I had more snakes I would raise my own mice but with only with only two corns it doesn't make sense to go through the trouble. You sound like friends of mine who raise farm animals. You have the farm animals and then you have pets. They are two different things.
Hee hee keeping the cute ones is how my cousin got her one daughter a pet mouse. She was taking care of her other daughter's ball python and she fed live. Well her mom put the mouse in and it ran up her arm and hid in her hair. She couldn't feed it to the snake. Instead she went to the store, bought a cage and another mouse that her husband fed to their daughter's snake. lol! She said she just couldn't do it.
Jean
Itsnowingcorns
Stuffy Brit
Taceas, if only snakes did eat carrot sticks! Thank you for replying, I understand what you're saying, and I think it is better to feed them this way now you've explained it all. Not only do you know what you're snakes are getting if you think about it, it would probably be exactly the same in the wild except with all the pain added in for the adults. Also in the wild snakes would eat these anyway, isn't keeping snakes in captivity all about trying to mimick their natural habitat? Anyway thanks again for clearing that up with me and anybody else who may have had similar thoughts on the matter.
