Heating Questions: Larger Tank

[Aremus]

I'm upgrading my corn to a final living space, an 18x36 base tank, and would like to switch him over to an overhead heat source (have been using pads, the current one is to small for his tank so $$ is going into his heating either way). This is to encourage him to come to the surface a bit more than he is now.

Setup I have imagined is to have 2 lamps, a day and a night, on either end of the cage. Day side will be set at the normal ~85, and night at ~75. This will be accomplished w/ 2 thermostats on electric timers.

Any recommendations on the types of overhead heating for the day/night?

Recommendations on where to place the heat sources (in or out of the tank)(above or through the glass)

Thanks, any and all comments or questions are welcome

 

[bitsy]

Providing an overhead light source won't actually encourage him up to the surface - Corns don't bask so there's no reason for them to seek out overhead heat. As they're active in the wild at times of lower light (dawn/ dusk/ overnight), using a light as a heat source might actually cause him to hide away even more.

Personally I'd just go with buying a larger heat pad proportional to the size of the bigger tank, and make sure you're measuring temps at floor level, where the snake is, to get the correct stat settings.

The best way to see more of your guy, is ironically to get more hides and ground cover in there. If he feels that he can move around whilst being unseen, he actually might move around the tank more freely. Unfortunately, if you really do have a Corn that prefers coming out overnight, then there's not much you can do about it.

 

[marike]

Providing an overhead light source won't actually encourage him up to the surface - Corns don't bask

Veto.
I can watch mine basking nearly every day for a couple of hours. Younger corns might not do that, because instinct tells them to hide their fragile body .
In my viv, head comes from above (like the sun would do in the wild), and so mine comes to the upper hidings and platfroms, when he seeks heat, and climbs down, when he wants cooler places.

I've got two spot lights (40W and 25W at the moment), regulated by a thermostat, so it doesn't get too warm in the viv. But I'm planning on changing to an creamic heater, that fits into the former bulb socket, because this can regulate the temperature by night, too. By day, the light will be provided with LED lights. That's the plan.

Hope that helps.
Greetings,
marike

 

[bitsy]

No really. Corns in the wild are crepuscular or nocturnal and will avoid direct or strong sunlight. You might observe yours out in the the non-UV lights, but that's an individual behaviour/ preference and it doesn't mean that Corns are a basking species.

Basking is an established survival behaviour that exposes a reptile to the UV in sunlight. UV helps them form Vitamin D3, which their systems in turn use to metabolise calcium. That's why true basking species of reptile can develop MBD if left without UV in captivity - they become calcium-deficient without basking in UV, even if their diet contains a sufficient amount of calcium. Corns do not have this metabolic process, which is why UV is unnecessary for them in captivity.

As your lights are not UV, what you're observing is not true basking behaviour. Many of mine will spend the whole day hidden away and only come out when the sun goes down. A couple are more active during the day and I see them more often. These are individual habits rather than an indication of a species-wide trait.

 

[marike]

I apologize, maybe I mis-phrased it.

So far, I didn't have the possibility to observe wild corns. You say, they don't bask. Ok.
But corns bred in captivity seem to like lying under a heat-providing light sometimes (I know a couple who do this, not only mine). Not all of them, for sure, but some.

And when you wrote "corns don't bask" which I understood as "corn snakes never ever lay in open light positions", I wanted to give a counter-argument.

Hopefully, I explained better this time. Sorry, if I got you wrong.
Greetings,
marike

 

[bitsy]

I expect I misunderstood to some extent as well Marike. I think between us we've probably explained the full range of observed behaviours linked with overhead light/heat sources!

If we're lucky, we'll get a Corn that likes being awake and active at the same time as us.

 

[Redalbino]

Where do they get belly heat from in the wild? would heat from above not be more natural for them? sorry for asking a question on your post.

 

[bitsy]

Good question. Things like stone or earth store heat during the day and then radiate this gradually, providing warm spots of belly heat once the sun goes down. Also, rotting vegetation gives off heat all day and night - like a domestic compost heap would.

 

[Marica]

They get belly heat from surfaces that retain heat past daylight hours like rocks, and unfortunately asphalt. Corns thermoregulate best by direct absorption, hence why a UTH is preferred to overhead lights. It's not that they are incapable of warming up under a heat-emitting light source, it's just more efficient if they have a ground heat source, which also aids with digestion.

Some of my snakes seem to enjoy cruising there vivs and don't hide when there's human or mammal traffic outside their vivs, and others I hardly see unless I take them out. Adding more branches and vines like bitsy suggested may make your snake feel more comfortable outside of his/her hide, it may not, just as the lights may be a hit or miss as obviously marike's snake seems to enjoy it. Every snake is different.

As for recommendations on where to place the lights should you decide to use them, I would suggest placing the fixtures above the screen top, or as I've seen with some custom viv's you could make a box with tight mesh to enclose the lights so that your snake can't come in direct contact with the bulb and to avoid potential burns. I would not recommend placing the heat-emitting lights outside the glass as it would be difficult to regulate the temperature of the glass and it kind of defeats the purpose of using a heat emitting source.

 

[Aremus]

Thanks for all of your input!

I think I've just about decided to stick with UTH and focus on other aspects of the cage to make him more comfortable above ground. I may just have to face it that he's a burrower and enjoy him as he is.

 

[DavidFallows]

My cornsnake likes watching football. He's probably just fascinated by moving images on a screen.

I'm tempted to pick up a light as he gets absolutely no sunlight where he is, and it's hard for us to see him. I know it's probably pointless but it's just a personal niggle I have.

First thing I need to sort is a much larger heat mat for his new viv, and possibly a thermostat to help me judge the larger heat spread. It's been years since I posted here, I only really use places like this when something goes wrong and I need some help.