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Mystery morph
- Thread starter zarozinia
- Start date
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
Striped Motley
I am fairly certain that it is a Striped Motley. I don’t have a clue why everybody thinks that a Motley with striping has to be a Motley X Striped breeding. I have been selectively breeding Motleys to have stripes for many years and so has many other people and it has nothing at all to do with the “Four Line Stripes”. Motleys can have striping without being bred to stripes. Their look is quite different. Striped Motleys normally have a single wide stripe down the center of their back and it can be quite irregular.
I am fairly certain that it is a Striped Motley. I don’t have a clue why everybody thinks that a Motley with striping has to be a Motley X Striped breeding. I have been selectively breeding Motleys to have stripes for many years and so has many other people and it has nothing at all to do with the “Four Line Stripes”. Motleys can have striping without being bred to stripes. Their look is quite different. Striped Motleys normally have a single wide stripe down the center of their back and it can be quite irregular.
Traci1
New member
Re: Striped Motley
Joe, I'm a bit confused by your post. I don't see where anyone in this thread talked about it's breeding. People are guessing the "morph", and there are two things you can identify, pattern and color. It appears this snake has both stripes and "circles" hence my tendancy to refer to it as a stripe/motley or as you said striped motley. Same difference. However I think the color is mainly what we're guessing at (and I guessed it is a normal)
You didn't mention what "color" you thought it was.
Traci
ecreipeoj said:
Joe, I'm a bit confused by your post. I don't see where anyone in this thread talked about it's breeding. People are guessing the "morph", and there are two things you can identify, pattern and color. It appears this snake has both stripes and "circles" hence my tendancy to refer to it as a stripe/motley or as you said striped motley. Same difference. However I think the color is mainly what we're guessing at (and I guessed it is a normal)
You didn't mention what "color" you thought it was.
Traci
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
Am I in trouble again!? Why me?LOL
I wasn’t really referring to any post on this thread, but post other places about Striped Motleys. Perhaps Striped/Motley got me thinking about other post. I did get the impression that people here were implying that this snake was a cross between a Striped X Motley, which it may be. I may be wrong, but it seems that most people think that if a Motley has striping then it is a cross between a Striped X Motley automatically.
There are a lot of Motleys that have a wide single broken stripe down there back that have not been bred with the Striped Corn line. I have some Motleys that go way back and have never seen a Striped that have striping. The stripe usually has irregular edges and is broken. I have produced Striped Motleys that are striped from head to tail, but the edges of the striped are still irregular.
Why we get anything other than a normal from a Striped X Motley breeding has many different theories. Striped X Motley breedings do produce hatchlings that seem to be a cross between the two and have partial striping. It can also produce hatchling in the clutch that look like Motleys and/or Stripes and they all have the white belly.
My personal theory is that they are much more similar than we think and perhaps have the same origin, but selective breeding has caused the two different looks. When they are crossed, we get the white belly and a mixing of the selective breeding or we go back in time to what the original snakes looked like. This is just my personal theory and I really don’t see how it will ever be proven one way or another, because nobody really knows if their Striped or Motley has been crossed with the other in the past, so we really could never have any base line to start with.
The most popular alternate theory is that they are different genes that are on the same allele that happen to have the same gene for the white belly. I never really liked this theory. Why would they have the same gene for the white belly and have different genes effecting their look on top. I guess it could be said that the white belly genes are different too, but since they are on the same allele, their belly has to be white too and a mix of two different white belly genes as well.
I had a photo of a Striped Motley that looks very similar to this one, but I must have deleted it by accident. The only one that I could find is of this Amel Motley which has some partial striping. He is pure Motley if there is such a thing. I decided chose the photo of this partial Striped Amel Motley that was in a photo compared to a Amel Motley from a Butter Motley out cross from the same male. Most of the clutch from this outcross had very typical Motley pattern like the snake on the right, but I did get two snakes from this clutch that had a lot of striping and one was almost striped head to tail.
I think this snake in this thread is a normally colored Motley that has striping.
I wasn’t really referring to any post on this thread, but post other places about Striped Motleys. Perhaps Striped/Motley got me thinking about other post. I did get the impression that people here were implying that this snake was a cross between a Striped X Motley, which it may be. I may be wrong, but it seems that most people think that if a Motley has striping then it is a cross between a Striped X Motley automatically.
There are a lot of Motleys that have a wide single broken stripe down there back that have not been bred with the Striped Corn line. I have some Motleys that go way back and have never seen a Striped that have striping. The stripe usually has irregular edges and is broken. I have produced Striped Motleys that are striped from head to tail, but the edges of the striped are still irregular.
Why we get anything other than a normal from a Striped X Motley breeding has many different theories. Striped X Motley breedings do produce hatchlings that seem to be a cross between the two and have partial striping. It can also produce hatchling in the clutch that look like Motleys and/or Stripes and they all have the white belly.
My personal theory is that they are much more similar than we think and perhaps have the same origin, but selective breeding has caused the two different looks. When they are crossed, we get the white belly and a mixing of the selective breeding or we go back in time to what the original snakes looked like. This is just my personal theory and I really don’t see how it will ever be proven one way or another, because nobody really knows if their Striped or Motley has been crossed with the other in the past, so we really could never have any base line to start with.
The most popular alternate theory is that they are different genes that are on the same allele that happen to have the same gene for the white belly. I never really liked this theory. Why would they have the same gene for the white belly and have different genes effecting their look on top. I guess it could be said that the white belly genes are different too, but since they are on the same allele, their belly has to be white too and a mix of two different white belly genes as well.
I had a photo of a Striped Motley that looks very similar to this one, but I must have deleted it by accident. The only one that I could find is of this Amel Motley which has some partial striping. He is pure Motley if there is such a thing. I decided chose the photo of this partial Striped Amel Motley that was in a photo compared to a Amel Motley from a Butter Motley out cross from the same male. Most of the clutch from this outcross had very typical Motley pattern like the snake on the right, but I did get two snakes from this clutch that had a lot of striping and one was almost striped head to tail.
I think this snake in this thread is a normally colored Motley that has striping.
Attachments
aside from the stripe/motley issue do you not think the colouration is very similar to your own photo of a striped lavender Joe.
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=60039
I know the chances are 1,000,000 to 1 but I can but wish
http://www.cornsnakes.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=60039
I know the chances are 1,000,000 to 1 but I can but wish
CornCrazy
What's one more???
So you are saying that the motleys that happen to have striping have stripes with irregular edges? That is opposite from what I have heard in the past. I have always hear that if the stripe was irregular, then it was probably a striped motley.
Here is a picture of one of my striped motleys (from a stripe X motley breeding).
Her stripe is VERY "smooth." I don't know how it can be determined whether zarozinia's snake in question is motley, or striped-motley just by looking at it.
zarozinia...one thing most of us agree on is that this snake is probably a normal. As it grows, its colors will change. Please post an updated picture in a couple of months.
Here is a picture of one of my striped motleys (from a stripe X motley breeding).
Her stripe is VERY "smooth." I don't know how it can be determined whether zarozinia's snake in question is motley, or striped-motley just by looking at it.
zarozinia...one thing most of us agree on is that this snake is probably a normal. As it grows, its colors will change. Please post an updated picture in a couple of months.
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
ZAROZINIA,
I think your snake is a normal Motley that has striping and is in shed and gives it a bluish or purplish cast to it.
CORNCRAZY
I think that perhaps we are saying the same thing, but using “Striped Motleys” in a different way. When I used Striped Motley, it means to me that it is pure Motley that has striping. It does not mean to me that it is a cross between a Striped X Motley breeding that is striped. I was just looking through the tread and have seen Striped/Motley, Striped Motley, and Striped-Motley. I think they mean different things to different people. Perhaps we should use Motley Striped for a cross of the two Motley X Striped.
The pure Motleys that I produce that have striping have irregular edges on their striping. It moves over a scale or two for a while and then lines back up again farther down. Your “Striped Motley” is a cross between Striped X Motley and has clean looking stripes, which is opposite than what I see with my pure Motleys that have striping and seems to be opposite from your statement,
“So you are saying that the motleys that happen to have striping have stripes with irregular edges? That is opposite from what I have heard in the past. I have always hear that if the stripe was irregular, then it was probably a striped motley“.,
or are we just using Striped Motley different again. LOL
Then again, my theory is that the Stripes and Motleys come from the same origin, so there is no real thing as pure Striped or pure Motley, but selectively bred to have the pure look of what we expect or nobody could possibly know if their Striped or Motley is pure because they have been crossed for as long as I can remember.
There is no registry and even though I have had my Stripes and Motleys for at least 15 years, I have no idea what was bred into them before I got them and neither does anybody else. I have also added Stripes and Motleys to my collecting that were sold to me as Stripes or Motleys, but their background is not traceable in anyway.
I am going to go take a photo of a "Pure" Motley that has striping. By "pure", I mean that I have no knowledge that they have any Moltey X Striped in their background.
I think your snake is a normal Motley that has striping and is in shed and gives it a bluish or purplish cast to it.
CORNCRAZY
I think that perhaps we are saying the same thing, but using “Striped Motleys” in a different way. When I used Striped Motley, it means to me that it is pure Motley that has striping. It does not mean to me that it is a cross between a Striped X Motley breeding that is striped. I was just looking through the tread and have seen Striped/Motley, Striped Motley, and Striped-Motley. I think they mean different things to different people. Perhaps we should use Motley Striped for a cross of the two Motley X Striped.
The pure Motleys that I produce that have striping have irregular edges on their striping. It moves over a scale or two for a while and then lines back up again farther down. Your “Striped Motley” is a cross between Striped X Motley and has clean looking stripes, which is opposite than what I see with my pure Motleys that have striping and seems to be opposite from your statement,
“So you are saying that the motleys that happen to have striping have stripes with irregular edges? That is opposite from what I have heard in the past. I have always hear that if the stripe was irregular, then it was probably a striped motley“.,
or are we just using Striped Motley different again. LOL
Then again, my theory is that the Stripes and Motleys come from the same origin, so there is no real thing as pure Striped or pure Motley, but selectively bred to have the pure look of what we expect or nobody could possibly know if their Striped or Motley is pure because they have been crossed for as long as I can remember.
There is no registry and even though I have had my Stripes and Motleys for at least 15 years, I have no idea what was bred into them before I got them and neither does anybody else. I have also added Stripes and Motleys to my collecting that were sold to me as Stripes or Motleys, but their background is not traceable in anyway.
I am going to go take a photo of a "Pure" Motley that has striping. By "pure", I mean that I have no knowledge that they have any Moltey X Striped in their background.
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
Pure Motley with striping
Here is a Striped Motley from my original line of Motleys that I have had at least 15 years and is pure Motley as far as I know. He has the irregular Striping that I see on my pure Motleys with striping.
I don’t think anybody can tell if Zarozinia’s Motley is a pure Motley with striping or a cross between a Motley and Striped, nor do I think that anybody knows if their Motleys or Striped have the other in their background distantly.
Here is a Striped Motley from my original line of Motleys that I have had at least 15 years and is pure Motley as far as I know. He has the irregular Striping that I see on my pure Motleys with striping.
I don’t think anybody can tell if Zarozinia’s Motley is a pure Motley with striping or a cross between a Motley and Striped, nor do I think that anybody knows if their Motleys or Striped have the other in their background distantly.
Attachments
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
Amel Motley with striping
This male Amel Motley with striping is pure as far as I know. He is a sibbling to the above Amel Motley with the normal pattern in the comparison photo. He is also a half sibling to the normal Motley with striping in the previous photo. He is a result of a Snow Motley with striping( My old line) X Butter Motley (Rich Z).
This male Amel Motley with striping is pure as far as I know. He is a sibbling to the above Amel Motley with the normal pattern in the comparison photo. He is also a half sibling to the normal Motley with striping in the previous photo. He is a result of a Snow Motley with striping( My old line) X Butter Motley (Rich Z).
Attachments
ecreipeoj
Striped Topaz SK SG Free
Butter Motley partial striping
This Butter Motley is pure Motley as far as I know. (Rich Z X Rich Z). I have seen Striped Butter Motleys being sold from this same line that are striped head to tail and advertised as “Striped Butter Motleys” and were represented as pure Motleys. I think Rich Z’s Motley and Stripes are like mine, as far as he knows they are pure, but he can not trace them all the way back. He has probably added new blood to his two groups over the years as well, which also can not be traced back too far.
This males partial striping is irregular. If you look close it moves over a scale or two and then lines back up again. Of course, you see this in some areas of Stripes too, but less often.
I have been saying that my Striped Motleys have a wide stripe down their back. What I actually meant is that they have the appearance of having a single stripe down their back, where Striped Corns are suppose to have four fairly even stripes, therefore the original name of “Four Line Striped” Corns.
This Butter Motley is pure Motley as far as I know. (Rich Z X Rich Z). I have seen Striped Butter Motleys being sold from this same line that are striped head to tail and advertised as “Striped Butter Motleys” and were represented as pure Motleys. I think Rich Z’s Motley and Stripes are like mine, as far as he knows they are pure, but he can not trace them all the way back. He has probably added new blood to his two groups over the years as well, which also can not be traced back too far.
This males partial striping is irregular. If you look close it moves over a scale or two and then lines back up again. Of course, you see this in some areas of Stripes too, but less often.
I have been saying that my Striped Motleys have a wide stripe down their back. What I actually meant is that they have the appearance of having a single stripe down their back, where Striped Corns are suppose to have four fairly even stripes, therefore the original name of “Four Line Striped” Corns.
