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New corn / temperatures

horned_frog_guy

New member
I just order an 05 female caramel from South Mountain; she will be here tuesday. I have got her cage all setup, but I am worried about her burrowing and burning herself.

My setup:
-10gal
-screen lid
-1.5" aspen
-2 hides (one warm, one cool)
-4" water dish
-UTH (stuck to 6"x8" ceramic tile)
-rheostat (dimmer)

My temps with full power are:
85 warm side, 77 cool side

If I stick my finger into the aspen and touch the glass its HOT (wouldnt want to touch it for long). Should I be worried or is this normal?

Thanks!
 
You might be a little worried if it feels that hot. Try putting a thermometer right against the glass to get a temp reading. That will give you the best idea if it is too hot. My guess would be that if it is 85 on top of the substrate, then it is probably too hot against the glass.
 
How are you measuring the temperatures?

A digital thermometer with a probe works best to measure the temperature of the bottom glass that may come into contact with your new snake.

Temperature readings of just the ambient air will give you 'false' readings.

A reading of 85 degrees is not congruent with your statement of being "HOT" to the touch. Hope this helps.
 
The temp of 85 was attained by placing a digital thermometer on top of the substrate. The glass beneath the aspen was indeed hot to the touch
 
Basically it seems like you are running into the problem that the bottom glass is much hotter than the aspen substrate. Whats happening is the uth is heating the glass to a high temperature, whereby the heat is then being radiated and dispersed into the substrate and air, causing a lower temperature on the top of the substrate.

My recommendation is to measure the actual temperature of the bottom glass below the substrate. Adjust the temp. accordingly (if it needs to be) so the temp. is safe (>90). The top of the aspen may now be lower, but if your snake lays on this portion of the viv, the heat will radiate toward your snake and be absorbed by the snake, much like what the aspen and air are doing.

The lowering of the temperature on the bottom glass is essential, because your snake can, and more than likely will burrow down through the aspen to the glass bottom where the temp. is the hottest. If the temp is hot that it feels like it will burn your hand, then it will burn your snake, who may lay there for an extended amount of time, which will lead to burning your snake. Unfortunately, snakes are not the smartest in this department; therefore, it is up to you to set the proper temp (I know you are trying to do this, otherwise you would not be here). Hope this helps. Good luck.
 
Def get a digital. When I set up my tank above the substrate (aspen) was ~85, when I moved the probe to the glass it was 123.
 
danvega said:
My recommendation is to measure the actual temperature of the bottom glass below the substrate. Adjust the temp. accordingly (if it needs to be) so the temp. is safe (>90). The top of the aspen may now be lower, but if your snake lays on this portion of the viv, the heat will radiate toward your snake and be absorbed by the snake, much like what the aspen and air are doing.

I am confused about this as well. I have read conflicting recommendations regarding where the probe is placed. From what you said danvega, am I understanding correctly that the probe should be placed on the glass below the substrate? I was reading this post: Basic heating question which advised to put the probe on top of the substrate. Which is why I am confused.

Right now I have the probe on the glass below the aspen and its reading about 92 deg. (I am working on lowering the temp a bit). But when I touch the substrate surface it doesnt feel warm. Granted, our body temp is higher than what the surface temp probably is (~80) but I should still feel some warmth. So, will this still be a problem for my corn? I am asking this question because he comes tomorrow and I want to make sure the temp is just right before I put him in the viv. I have researched this question but I am getting conflicting answers. What is a good temp range for the glass? I know you mentioned <90 but I am still unsure. Thanks in advance!
 
Put it against the glass. What good would it do for you to know that the top of the subtrate is say 82 degrees if your snake burrows? It is best to know what the warmest temp is that your snake could come into contact with. If it is low to mid 80s on the surface then it will be much warmer against the glass. If you are using a lamp it would be beneficial to have the probe on the surface of the substrate or rock/basking spot. Hope this helps with some of the confusion.

I suppose you could always get two thermometers and put one probe against the glass and one on the top of the substrate and maintain a happy medium. :shrugs:

You might always try a little less substrate. I don't know exactly what temp a snake will start to burn at but I would keep the glass below 90 for sure. I keep my probe on the glass and never let the temp get over 86. I have never had any problems with my yearling corn doing it this way.
 
^^Zwyatt has it right on the mark.

Like he said, what's the point of measuring the substrate if the glass is going to be much hotter (or something to that effect).

The key is to attain a 'happy medium' of your temperature gradient.
You have the cool side, right. Then you need the hot side. Remember, (you probably already know, but..) snakes cannot regulate their heat with out your help. And, at the same time are not the brightest when it comes to moving away from heat that is too hot. A too high temperature leads to the obvious of burning the snake, but also can lead to other problems (respiratory problems for example).

Anyways, you will need to experiment a little to find a 'happy medium'. The range is something like ~82-90f or the hot side. If the glass is just below 90, the top of the substrate will probably be around 82. This all depends on the type of heat source, the thickness of the aspen layer, and the particle size of the aspen. The smaller the particle size, like sani ships verse the more common shavings is going to hold more heat and be hotter.

To try to clarify my above post, I'll give it another try:
1. The under tank heater heats up(highest temp)
2. The glass heats up(pretty close if not the same as the highest temp--some heat dissapates across the entire glass, some heat transfers to the aspen, some heat transfers to the air)
3. The aspen heats up (lower temp then the bottom glass---the aspen closer to the glass will be hotter than the aspen farther away from the glass)
4. The air above the uth and aspen heats up (lowest temp)

As this transfer of heat occurs, heat is dissipated and essentially lost (not really but for the purpose of this discussion it is). The key point to remember is the highest temperature, which the snake could potentially come into contact with (which it will, if you are using aspen, because cornsnakes love to burrow and make tunnels through the aspen) should be no more than 90----this is on the glass below the substrate.
Hope this helps a little bit more.
 
Both of you were extremely helpful, thanks! I just wanted to make sure, as the other post said otherwise. Thanks again... now if I can just get my rheostat set properly...
 
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