Another Disappointment

[PnyKlr]

Your 100% right, but thats why I say they need an informational booklet with the CORRECT information for each pet. Given corporate probably makes more money off the supplies than the actuall animals (I'm guessing), they probably have no interest in doing the research, so its up to us as consumers to research before buying. I did it, I researched for 2 days (sounds like a short time but it was intensive) and found out the right way to care for my corn. But then again not everyone is like us on the forum. So I guess the whole bad information thing is just going to keep repeating itself. What could we really do?? If we complain to the stores, they arent going to do anything. All we could do is shake our heads in remorse for the animals getting cared for improperly due to the neglect from greedy corporate suits.

That is it exactly. I worked in electronic retail when I was in high school, and I can tell you that accessories make the company more money than the actual product. My employee discount was "store cost." A Playstation 2 (which was brand-new at the time) did not offer much discount; but the games and controllers? Hoowee what a bargain! I'll let you guys in on a little something: Best Buy, Circuit City, and store like them mark up car audio equipment 40-70%, computers are only 1-3%.

 

[Alsoknownas]

I still hold the belief they should recieve more accurate training or have personal experience before being hired. "Oh, that's a cute snake let me get it" is never going to stop happening, yet such mistakes can be prevented if accurate knowledge on the animal is given.
The employee there, when I told her I was going to get the snake kit, bent down to look at it and went "Hmm... Don't get this actually, the under-tank heater is harmful to the snake and it'll burn it." and thus I wasted a good twenty somewhat dollars for buying everything seperately. I had gone and done research on the animal before buying it, and that includes seeing people who effectively use UTH. Yet, this employee before me told me the flaw and it was my instinct to trust her, since she works there.
Another example is when I was looking for pinkies in this mess they call the freezer. I asked some lady who was finished helping people get fish and she had no idea what a pinky was but I eventually found it. They should inform them on what they're selling atleast. I don't think some of the people i've seen there would be able to get a snake or a bird or a ferret out of it's cage if I wanted them to.
I understand what you're point is about their job, especially since I get paid minimum wage for being a dishwasher in a resturaunt. It hardly gets worse.
If the contracter screws up my tiles, he's completely at fault, I don't care how many bills he has to pay or children he has to feed, it's his job and he should know how to do it. Or else people are going to lose faith in the company, as many are in some pet stores. I make sure those dishes are shiny and clean.
Yes, I agree the costumer should research on his/her own, yet I expect knowledge from an associate.

 

[PnyKlr]

The employee there, when I told her I was going to get the snake kit, bent down to look at it and went "Hmm... Don't get this actually, the under-tank heater is harmful to the snake and it'll burn it." and thus I wasted a good twenty somewhat dollars for buying everything seperately. I had gone and done research on the animal before buying it, and that includes seeing people who effectively use UTH. Yet, this employee before me told me the flaw and it was my instinct to trust her, since she works there.

Ahh, but she DID give you accurate information! A UTH WILL burn your snake...unless it is properly regulated. Do you criticize people for giving the advice "Don't get heat rocks because they'll burn your snake"? That is in the same ballpark as the previous statement: A heat rock will burn your snake if it's not properly regulated.

Had you done all of your research prior to walking into the store, you would have known better.

This "tile guy" analogy is just not working. You're saying that your "tile guy" doesn't know how to do his job. If you would put it as "My tile screwed up because he only knows how to hang tile that lasts for 15 years and hasn't researched the latest-and-greatest techniques so that it'll stay up for 20" then it would be comparing apples to apples. I'm talking about someone who can do the job, but it is not up to ideal standards.

 

[Alsoknownas]

Ahh, but she DID give you accurate information! A UTH WILL burn your snake...unless it is properly regulated. Do you criticize people for giving the advice "Don't get heat rocks because they'll burn your snake"? That is in the same ballpark as the previous statement: A heat rock will burn your snake if it's not properly regulated.

Had you done all of your research prior to walking into the store, you would have known better.

This "tile guy" analogy is just not working. You're saying that your "tile guy" doesn't know how to do his job. If you would put it as "My tile screwed up because he only knows how to hang tile that lasts for 15 years and hasn't researched the latest-and-greatest techniques so that it'll stay up for 20" then it would be comparing apples to apples. I'm talking about someone who can do the job, but it is not up to ideal standards.

You added "...unless it is properly regulated", therefore it is not accurate. She missed 5 entire words.

Had she done all her research before appyling for the job, I would have known better.

It is working, it's directed to outside things interfering with his job. They can't do something because of that, yet they're suppose to be able to do it, as it's in the job description.

 

[PnyKlr]

So are you taking no responsibility for not doing the research on your snake? SHE DID give you good information. A UTH WILL burn your snake. She was not wrong. YOU did not research what your snake needs before buying it. YOU did not research the normal behavior of a corn snake before buying it. YOU bought the UTH anyway, without a way to regulate it. Is all of the the employees fault?


I researched many places (including this forum) for months before I ever bought a snake. I researched breeders, location, and prices to get the exact phenotype and genotype, as well as sexes of the corns I wanted. I set up the viv and built the rheostat for the UTH regulation 2 weeks before the snakes arrived. I made sure that the temperature gradients were regular before EVER introducing a snake to the viv. THAT IS RESEARCH. THAT IS BEING A RESPONSIBLE PET OWNER.

Not getting mad at a minimum-wage-getting part-time employee who doesn't care what you do once you leave. So what if they "shouldn't work there" because of apathy, it is the customer's fault for relying on only one source of information.

 

[BeckyG]

The one employee who doesn't need to be cut a break is the misinforming, know-it-all who guesses at things to give the impression that he/she is an authority.

Yes, but those seem to be in the minority, at least in my experience. I know they are out there (we have plenty of that type on this board as well), but so far, I haven't run into any with that attitude.

I still hold the belief they should recieve more accurate training or have personal experience before being hired.

Perhaps, but this is not the employee's fault. They can only go by what they are told when they are trained, and most of them have no reason to doubt what they are told, just like you didn't have any reason to doubt the lady who told you UTHs will burn a snake.

If you disagree with what the employee tells you, you have to contact the company at the corporate level to get things changed. The Petco I shop at has a toll free number prominently displayed in the store where you can call and voice your concerns. This is what needs to be done, rather than screaming obscenities and making a scene in the store. The average employee cannot change things. The corporation can.

Had she done all her research before appyling for the job, I would have known better.

And had you done all your research before buying, you would have known better.

I still say that it is the owner's responsibility to research proper care before buying a snake. Yes, it is sad that too many of them don't, but this is not the fault of the pet store employee.

Pnyklr, don't you just love these teenagers who think they have life all figured out?

"When I was 15, I had the whole world figured out. By the time I was 30, I wasn't so sure."--Jim McNabb

 

[PnyKlr]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to BeckyG again.

Yup. I may only be 25, but I will call myself (appropriately) "wise beyond my years."

I am a college graduate with a good career. At 21, I was a wife, a mother, a homeowner, and I had two cars free-and-clear. I feel I have a bit more "life knowledge" than most 16 year-olds. :grin01:

What's with these kids now-a-days? They won't take responsibility for their actions....or lack thereof.

 

[Hypancistrus]

Case in point. We can whine and complain and argue until we are ALL blue in the face and the employees at PETsMART and Petco and Petland and all the other chain stores (AND OTHER MOM AND POP STORES TOO!!!) will still generally be clueless as to what they are selling and the proper care required to maintain that animal.

Yelling at the employee is entirely ineffective- they don't care (for better or for worse) and are only doing that job because "they like animals" and it pays. I mean, what could be better- a job where you get paid to play with animals?? (Or so they think when they apply!) So that avenue is lost.

Talking to the store manager also doesn't work. The store manager is bound by a corporate office who tells him or her "Thou shalt use Calci-Sand in the juvenile Bearded Dragon cages because T-Rex pays us marketing fees!" So that avenue is a lost cause as well.

If you truly want to see better conditions, there are very few things you can do. First of all, take the time to actually write a letter to CORPORATE. Not your local store, but the corporate office for the store. This information is available online for anyone to have, and yet people are so lazy that they'd rather gripe about conditions at the local pet store in an online forum. Write a letter?? What? That's too much work!

When you write, tell them EXACTLY what you saw that bothered you, and how it should be fixed. If more people did this, then they WOULD respond. As it stands, most people will not be bothered to write.

You can also deny them the money they need to stay afloat. This can only work if we reach the masses. If everyone would buy their supplies at stores that sell only supplies, or care for animals properly, OR online retailers, we are cutting off the money that the chain stores need to stay alive. They don't make money on their livestock, they make money on the bulk dry goods they sell- the heat pads, aquariums, lights and filters. That's where they get their money.

We can also refuse to buy live animals from them. They sell live animals because there is a market for them. As long as there is a market for them, stores will continue to sell them, and their employees will continue to provide the misinformation about said animals that corporate offers them.

Again, these are things that we can do that realistically impact the way in which stores like Petco and Petsmart do business. No one will do these things however, because we live in an era of laziness, where folks would rather blame other people for the ills of the world than step up and try to do something about it.

The one thing I can and will say, that I hope loads of people read and internalize is this- DO NOT TRUST WHAT YOUR LOCAL PET STORE TELLS YOU! It is usually wrong, regardless of the reason. If you are going to purchase an animal, YOU need to take the time to do the research and YOU need to know the animals requirements and the ins and outs of the equipment before you go to purchase it, so that YOU are not misled by store employees. I don't even talk to chain store employees anymore, other than to ask "Where do you keep aspen bedding?" That's the limits of their knowlege as far as I am concerned.

 

[PnyKlr]

*sigh* All this reputation I can't give!

Good post, Hypancistrus.

 

[Alsoknownas]

So are you taking no responsibility for not doing the research on your snake? SHE DID give you good information. A UTH WILL burn your snake. She was not wrong. YOU did not research what your snake needs before buying it. YOU did not research the normal behavior of a corn snake before buying it. YOU bought the UTH anyway, without a way to regulate it. Is all of the the employees fault?

She WAS wrong, because a UTH did not burn my snake yet. If my snake is never burnt by an UTH, then it turns out she is wrong. So far, she is wrong. I did not buy the UTH without a way to regulate it, currently I have no UTH. I bought the lamp. Yes, that is the employee's fault, as she told me it is better. It is also my fault for listening to her, yet she is still at fault.

I researched many places (including this forum) for months before I ever bought a snake. I researched breeders, location, and prices to get the exact phenotype and genotype, as well as sexes of the corns I wanted. I set up the viv and built the rheostat for the UTH regulation 2 weeks before the snakes arrived. I made sure that the temperature gradients were regular before EVER introducing a snake to the viv. THAT IS RESEARCH. THAT IS BEING A RESPONSIBLE PET OWNER.

And I research for 1 day, yet my snake is fine, as is everything slightly involved with it. Don't you think it makes sense for both the customer and the employee to do their part, because not everyone is you. Certainly not everyone is going to research.

And had you done all your research before buying, you would have known better.

Had she done all her research before appyling for the job, I would have known better.

Is anyone catching on yet? I said that because he said what you just said. I can use the same logic. I'm not saying we should be clueless and them complete experts, i'm simply saying they shouldn't be clueless.

You're saying the customer should have ALL the knowledge down, and i'm saying both should have an adequate amount of knowledge down, because every customer is NEVER going to have ALL the knowledge down. I'm coming up with a solution to the problem, yet everyone is just repeating the problem.

 

[Alsoknownas]

Also, what's all this about yelling at the employee? Who's yelling at the employees?

 

[Raiden The Almighty]

To be honest its not a strictly manegemt problem. The employess really should be expected to know about every single animal in the store. If they cant due then they should be isolated to a single area like just herps or birds or fish. At my local pet shop there are several people that are very well educated and have the experience. there getting paid paid minimum wage but they take the time to learn.

To say that just because they dont get paid enough they dont have to learn the information is completely irresponsible. I mean if you type "corn snake" into a search engine on a computer you can find a wealth of information in about 3 seconds. The majority of online care sheets have accurate reliable information. not to mention the fact that most petshops have books on the proper care of animals that the average employee could thumb through on abreak or while waiting for some customers.

 

[Roy Munson]

The one employee who doesn't need to be cut a break is the misinforming, know-it-all who guesses at things to give the impression that he/she is an authority.

Yes, but those seem to be in the minority, at least in my experience. I know they are out there (we have plenty of that type on this board as well), but so far, I haven't run into any with that attitude.

I think you're right about this. I saw a lot more of this in the past. One thing I like about my local pet store is that the staff is honest. 95% of the time I ask a question they answer: "Uhhhh. I don't know much about that." :grin01:

 

[Bobo's Mama]

Just throwing my 2 cents in here. In all of my VAST experience of being a snake owner of a year and a half. I have never once asked a petstore employee for advice on their care. I got all my information from this forum, or from other various care sheets on breeders websites. I also bought the Cornsnake Manual as well. Its still under my bed I think! ...........

But on the other hand, the one time that I have asked a petstore employee about something, it was about rats, and it was a positive experience! I bought 2 female rats as pets, but the Petland I got them from had kept the males and females together. So, naturally they were both pregnant when I brought them home. They were unsocialized and mean as heck, biting and nipping constantly. I went to Petsmart to buy some bedding and ended up getting into a conversation with the rodent lady. I told her about my situation and she explained to me what I needed to do to get them used to me. Its called forced socialization, where you just hold them until they get used to you. After I spoke to her, she gave me her direct ext. and told me to call her if I needed anymore help. I thought she did a great job of helping me. I went online to double-check the info she gave me, and.....she was right!:eek1:

 

[Wintermute]

I mean if you type "corn snake" into a search engine on a computer you can find a wealth of information in about 3 seconds. .

Exactly, so why can't potential pet owners do that themselves?

 

[Hypancistrus]

The employess really should be expected to know about every single animal in the store. If they cant due then they should be isolated to a single area like just herps or birds or fish. At my local pet shop there are several people that are very well educated and have the experience. there getting paid paid minimum wage but they take the time to learn.

If chain stores and even local pet stores hired only people who knew what they were doing, and knew how to care for every animal in the store, they would go out of business because either they won't be able to find people to meet that criteria OR they'd have to raise the amount that they pay their workers.

I can tell you that when I was 17 years old, I started working at my local Petsmart and I knew how to care for each animal that we sold. I also knew where to find the info to any questions that I did not already know the answer to. During breaks and on my own time, I was reading magazines, books, and internet sites for every animal imaginable (and I had been doing that since the age of 8 or 9). I am an extreme case though, in that this is my HOBBY. I love taking care of animals, and designing naturalistic vivs for fish and herps. It's a passion for me, and that means that I am willing to put the research into knowing how to take care of these animals.

So in the past 15 years of working with fish (and maybe 8-10 of reading about reptiles, birds, mammals, insects, etc.) and other animals, I have amassed a tremendous amount of "book knowlege," along with quite a lot of practical husbandry info as well. I also have obtained a college degree in fisheries science. I could use this information as a pet store employee to benefit my customers... IF the pet store could afford to pay me for my services. As it stands, they can't, and even if they could offer me a price to make it worth my while, I wouldn't work for them, because:

1) In all my years of researching, reading, studying, caring for, and observing animals and their humans, I have determined that most people that come bursting into the local pet store needing help really shouldn't have pets. They are too inept and lazy to care for them properly. So I would probably refuse more sales than I'd make, and I'd be promptly fired.

2) I'd be telling customers that a Clown Knife fish cannot live in a 29 gallon tank, and two corn snakes cannot live together in a 10 gallon, rodents should not be kept on cedar or pine bedding, and baby beardies should not live on sand, all of which denies the store a sale, and also goes against a lot of their company policies. And so they'd fire me.

For these reasons and others, chain stores will never have a high percentage of knowlegeable employees. They may get lucky every now and then and get teenage Hypancistrus or the like, but eventually that person is going to move on to bigger things, like college, a career, and a family. And then they are stuck hiring a new teenager who will probably be like the rest of the majority- just in it for the paycheck.

 

[Hypancistrus]

I told her about my situation and she explained to me what I needed to do to get them used to me. Its called forced socialization, where you just hold them until they get used to you. After I spoke to her, she gave me her direct ext. and told me to call her if I needed anymore help. I thought she did a great job of helping me. I went online to double-check the info she gave me, and.....she was right!:eek1:

She sounds like a stellar employee. Did you write a letter to the store or call them and tell them what a knowlegeable employee they have?? If they don't hear about these good things, then they will probably listen to the 50 or so people that have complained about her because she wouldn't sell them a guinea pig to live its life in the hamster cage they had in their cart. She could end up being canned for not satisfying her customers, when in reality she is doing everything right. Yet another thing that drives experienced people away from the pet care business....

 

[PnyKlr]

Raiden, I have often considered you to be a very bright boy. I do, however, think you need to look into the business side of all this. The company is here to make a profit, plain and simple. A previous poster hit the nail on the head by saying "they would have to pay knowledgeable people more money."

She WAS wrong, because a UTH did not burn my snake yet. If my snake is never burnt by an UTH, then it turns out she is wrong. So far, she is wrong. I did not buy the UTH without a way to regulate it, currently I have no UTH. I bought the lamp. Yes, that is the employee's fault, as she told me it is better. It is also my fault for listening to her, yet she is still at fault.

Alsoknownas: I am not the exception to the rule. Many people on this forum researched properly before purchasing (whether it is a snake, or somethine else). Regardless, YOUR temps are un-regulated. If you had a UTH on your tank, unregulated, and your snake was not burned, YOU ARE LUCKY. UTHs get to 110F in one hour. In previous posts, you state that you are constantly turning off and on your lamp, or moving closer. You also mention that sometimes you wake up at the temp is 95F. By golly, are you doing anything to make sure your snake as appropriate regulated temperatures? It seems to me, that you have the information now, and aren't doing anything about it. I apologize if you have fixed the problem, and have not posted about it yet, but I think you are still moving your lamp.

I stand by what I said before: Buyer beware. Re you going to buy the undercoat on a new car just because the salesman tells you that you need it?

It is YOUR fault you rushed into buying a snake, and if you haven't had any problems yet, thank goodness for the snake's sake (with no help from you). Fix your tank issues before you complain about people giving information.

All you young ones should learn from this. Take a look at the ages of the people telling you not to rely on the employees, and the look at the ages of the people complaining about them. You'll see a bit of a trend.

*Ahem* We told you so. :crazy02: lol

 

[Alsoknownas]

Raiden, I have often considered you to be a very bright boy. I do, however, think you need to look into the business side of all this. The company is here to make a profit, plain and simple. A previous poster hit the nail on the head by saying "they would have to pay knowledgeable people more money."



Alsoknownas: I am not the exception to the rule. Many people on this forum researched properly before purchasing (whether it is a snake, or somethine else). Regardless, YOUR temps are un-regulated. If you had a UTH on your tank, unregulated, and your snake was not burned, YOU ARE LUCKY. UTHs get to 110F in one hour. In previous posts, you state that you are constantly turning off and on your lamp, or moving closer. You also mention that sometimes you wake up at the temp is 95F. By golly, are you doing anything to make sure your snake as appropriate regulated temperatures? It seems to me, that you have the information now, and aren't doing anything about it. I apologize if you have fixed the problem, and have not posted about it yet, but I think you are still moving your lamp.

I stand by what I said before: Buyer beware. Re you going to buy the undercoat on a new car just because the salesman tells you that you need it?

It is YOUR fault you rushed into buying a snake, and if you haven't had any problems yet, thank goodness for the snake's sake (with no help from you). Fix your tank issues before you complain about people giving information.

All you young ones should learn from this. Take a look at the ages of the people telling you not to rely on the employees, and the look at the ages of the people complaining about them. You'll see a bit of a trend.

*Ahem* We told you so. :crazy02: lol

Keywords: Many people on this forum

Yes, I woke up once and the tempature was 95 degrees. It was getting too hot in my room, and yes, I did take action by keeping my door open all the time as opposed to always having it closed. The temps now are almost always 75-78 on the left and 80-84 on the right. I don't have to do anything now but check it. In a few weeks when I get some money I plan to get a bigger viv with a dimmer, and when winter comes, an UTH. Things like that you can only learn with trial and error, there is no research I could have done to prevent that. Many people use lamps effectively and many use UTH effectively, and i've heard the arguments between the two.

In response to the car salesman analogy, I was under the impression petco hired and/or trained experienced and knowledgable specialists. If I knew at the time that wasn't the case I would have researched more on UTH and eventually would have gotten the kit. But alas, she could have saved me with 5 little words, a spec of knowledge.

Nope, I haven't had any problems as of yet, the snake looks and acts fine. I researched husbandry, feeding, housing for about a day and I had all the correct information to keep a snake. It took a day for me, it can take the same for anyone else. As stated, I think we should both do our parts, or else this employee is useless.

Your age comment just goes to show your level of maturity. I didn't think anyone would resort to an age comment. Age doesn't have much to do with this, it doesn't correspond with right and wrong. I simply have an opinion, as do you. Of course it's easer and more profitable to hire unexperienced workers as sales associates, yet I do not agree with it. Of course it's more easy and profitable to not release a cure for AIDS if there ever was or is one, yet I do not agree with it. I'm pretty sure when I'm 30 i'll have the same outlook.

 

[PnyKlr]

Your age comment just goes to show your level of maturity. I didn't think anyone would resort to an age comment. Age doesn't have much to do with this, it doesn't correspond with right and wrong. I simply have an opinion, as do you. Of course it's easer and more profitable to hire unexperienced workers as sales associates, yet I do not agree with it. I'm pretty sure when I'm 30 i'll have the same outlook.

Maturity is not quoting you in a way that just states the opposite, like you have done to me and a few others in this thread.

You are right, age doesn't correspond with right or wrong. It does, however, offer some life lessons and experience that someone who is younger might not have. In your case, many people who are older than you are telling you how things are, yet you feel the need to argue about it, and are taking no responsibility for your lack of knowledge.

When you are 30, you probably still won't like the hiring process at these place, but you will understand the purpose for it and stop whining about it. You are picking and choosing which parts of my words you would like to respond to, and that shows YOU'RE immaturity. You say you learn from trial and error, well learn from this, DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH BEFORE GETTING YOUR ANIMAL!

I still think it's funny that you think the employee gave you bad information about the UTH. She was right. Just because she didn't state how to rectify the problem, doesn't mean she's wrong or giving bad advice. You, in all your wisdom and maturity, should have known better.