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do your snakes seem happy living together?

JTGoff69 said:
:roflmao: And look at his points now! :grin01:

Rich made an example of some clown over on Fauna for doing the same thing there a few weeks ago too. Little corney tried to get me on Fauna too but he didn't have any rep power. So I just returned the favor and put him in the red with the click of the mouse. :dgrin:
 
DAND said:
Rich made an example of some clown over on Fauna for doing the same thing there a few weeks ago too. Little corney tried to get me on Fauna too but he didn't have any rep power. So I just returned the favor and put him in the red with the click of the mouse. :dgrin:

Seems like I wasn't the only one to red dot him yesterday, and a big thanks to Rich for replacing our points he took away. :cheers:
Sad, very sad, esp. since inevitably he WILL be back here under a different name. :twoguns:
 
My snakes were happy living together, until I had to seperate them so I didnt get a pregnant snake at 18 months.

How do I know they were happy? They told me. :crazy02:
 
Well, we do know that snakes can definitely feel fear. That is an emotion isn't it? And when they are not feeling fear what do they feel? My guess would be some sort of comfort (anti-fear). Why else would they seek out nice dark warm places? Those places feel comfortable, that's why.

Anyway, perhaps in some species of snake and in some individuals the comfort response is triggered by being near a familiar snake. I have been herping for garter snakes for 17 years, and I have never found a single wild garter snake on it's own. Every single time they have been in a group or with at least one companion. This goes for looking under things as well as basking out in the open. Housing them they seem to be less stressed in groups as well. I know they aren't corn snakes, but it does show that some species are more comfortable being housed with other snakes.

Perhaps some individual cornsnakes have a similiar brain setup which triggers comfort chemicals in the presence of familiar snakes?
 
Joejr14 said:
How do I know they were happy? They told me. :crazy02:

Ladies and gentlemen, let's give a BIG cornsnakes.com welcome to Doctor Dolittle!!! :wavey:

regards,
jazz
 
Sisuitl said:
Well, we do know that snakes can definitely feel fear. That is an emotion isn't it?
Whilst I don't at all think you're wrong, I think fear is more classed as a survival instinct....emotional responses would be things like joy, anger, frustration, love, sadness, empathy...IM very HO...
 
Clint and Sisuitl have equally valid points. Is it true that snakes lack the part of the brain that allows for comlex emotions such as love, joy, anger, and jealousy? Yes. These are very human and complex and need the areas of the brain that are unique to humans and some species of apes. These would include the cerebrum and frontal lobes. The cerebrum is the outer part of the brain that allows for thinking and comlex emotions. This part is lacking in the snake's brain. The frontal lobe is part of the cerebrum, but it gives a person individuality. Individuality and higher thought processes are what allows people to feel love, joy and anger. Those emotions are not only complex, but based on the individual.

Now, from the scientific disection of the brain, there is no way a snake can be happy. This is complex and based on individuality. We can see, however, that each corn snake has some form of individuality because they all respond differently to the same stimulii. They may be lacking in the frontal lobe, but it seems as though they have a small portion of it, just by the observation of many different snakes' responses to stimulii. They do seem to lack the cerebrum though. Just last night I had taken off the lid to one of my containers to see how the snake reacted, and she kept trying to go through the side of the container, even after I showed her that the top was off by lifting her upper body to the lip. It still took her 45 minutes to crawl out of the top, so I would have to say that based off my observation, corns do not have the ability of complex thought. the thought process would be more like "something changed" instead of, "the lid is off, go up".

Back to Sisuitl's point. Snakes do feel fear, but it is not the complex fear we think of, it is more of a defense mechanism. Remember back in 5th grade when we first strated studying the brain stem because of frog disections? The basic, primal response is "fight or flight". The fear that snakes have is the "flight" response being triggerd because the snake is threatened. Only after continual "flight" responses are shown to not be truly threatening, then the snake begins to get comfortable. This is called conditioning.

I do agree that some snakes are more comfortable in the company of others. It may be possible that SOME corns are comfortable with others, and SOME are not. Corns (lacking most of the frontal lobe, if not all) are highly unlikely to be comfortable around others unless conditioned to be so. After 7 years of cohabitation, I think that my corns are conditioned to be comfortable with each other. I may seperate them for a month or more to see if there are any noticeable differences. I'm scared that when one dies, though, the other will follow shortly because they have spent their entire lives together, and maybe need each other around. Again, highly unlikely, but it is something that I have thought about several times. Only time will tell unfortunately.
 
I SERIOUSLY doubt that your snake will even notice the absence of his tank mate/ best pal, let alone die shortly thereafter of a broken heart. The reason they choose the same hides is because the temps, or other environmental factors are suitable.


Obviously, I keep my own snakes in individual containers. I work at the local Nature Center, which does not. You can lift the big water bowl/hide on the warm end on a cooler day, and every corn will be under there. On a hot day, they migrate to the other end. When hungry, they start to mill around about the same time. But I would never draw the conclusion that they are social animals.
 
I wouldn't say that they are social either, just that out of the thousands in captivity there may be a few that are comforted by the presence of another snake, since other species of snake demostrate the capacity for that behavior.

Anyway, I've never herped for wild corns, but it seems to me that they would be solitary. I've heard that they don't actively hunt, but rather wait for something to come by their hiding place. If that is the case then it would not be very useful to share your burrow with someone. I may be completely misinformed on that point though.

This behavior may even be a result of captive selection. Who knows. Maybe the corns who are less stressed by being kept in groups eat better, and have better immune systems thus surviving? Or perhaps this behavior does occur in wild corns, but those that seek each other's company starve to death? Just lots of random thoughts here. Probably all wrong but oh well. :shrugs:
 
I know that rattlers wait around for food, but I'm not sure if corns actively hunt or not. If not, then it would seem that in the wild, corns will avoid each other so they can better feed. If they actively hunt, then there may be the possibility that they do live together in some way to increase their ability to survive. Could anyone who herps for corns or has anymore knowledge of this subject please post their info? I am really interested in this now.
 
Solitary ambush feeders, if the environment allows. Not that they won't crawl about when food is scarce, but exposing themselves is risking life. Very seldom have I found multiple snakes in the same spot herping. 5 copperheads once, even a corn and a mouse under the same plywood once!
 
I have one corn and want another. im getting the next from the same place. The corn i'm geting will be the same age as the one i already have. if I put them together now will it be the same for them. If they were born together and were together for their whole lives?
 
For the best survival rate. For the best results keeping your animals healthy. For doing what is best at your disposal: DO NOT HOUSE YOUR SNAKES TOGETHER!!!
 
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