Herpatology and morality.

[Kokopelli]

The more seriously I contemplate the way I wish to expand my working with snakes I bring myself to contemplate moral issues that are of importance to me.
Though possibly not the best or most profitable way... I cannot sell or represent something that I do not believe in- I do, on occasion, have to give an answer I disagree with where I work- but that is because I am a subordinate- I have no intention of doing so when I start my own business, regardless of how big or small it'll be.

Therefore, I present myself with questions of morality, so that I will have a defined set of ideals and conduct to which I will adhere. Of course, these are not set in stone for all eternity... and as I experience and grow, some of my ideals may change... but I would like to believe that having the reminder of what I believe in, even if it belongs to the past, will trigger a much deeper contemplation whether or not I should make a step that stands in contradiction to an ideal I once set as important to me.

Just for example, let us say I find over the course of many copulations that a pair of Boas that are DH Sunglow produce babies on a yearly basis- however, every single albino or sunglow they ever produced died upon birth.
On the one hand, it could be just a matter of chance. On the other hand, it may be that this specific copy of the albino gene is weakening enough to actually kill those animals that are homozygous carriers... I am -not- going to discuss whether or not it is moral to sell neonates from that pairing at a normal price... or if to give full details about those things or not... I have found that each breeder has its own set of morals which may or may not be similar to my own... that doesn't mean I am any more right than the other in case we have difference of opinion.

One matter that I have and still am spending allot of time contemplating is our responsibility towards the snakes we keep as I look on into the future.

I won't be here hundreds of years from now… but I do believe that we live in a time where we are essentiality shaping how the herping field will look in years to come- it is a very young field, and indeed, only recently has it begun to develop… in a way, I think that we can't imagine how it will look like… if we stop to consider the changes that happened in the last hundred years- imagine what can happen in a hundred years more, especially as we have barely scratched the surface of the potential.

It is exactly this potential that also scares me however… for I fear that we may be harming the animals that are so dear to us.
Let us contemplate our friends the canines… as the years pass, more and more genetic defects are discovered among pure-bred dogs… hip dysplasia, breathing, ear issues… and with some, even the inability to breed without assistance. In a way, we may have gone beyond the moral boundaries to create an animal that suits our desires… some of which are quite shallow and superficial, on the expanse of their quality of life.

Dogs today are possibly beyond repair- indeed, there are breeders who assist dogs that cannot breed on their own- thus ensuring the passing of weak genes onward… the gene pool become narrower… and those who truly suffer are the dogs we love so much.
Can it be corrected? I suppose so, and I imagine that people who work with dogs are working hard to come up with ways to perhaps reverse the spiral… but that is not for me to say, for I no dog expert.

Snakes however… snakes I know a tad more about(and I really do mean a tad more… I am no expert).
Already we are hard at work, seeking out and mix genes that were possibly never meant to spread…

Several issues that I have thought about:
* By keeping and breeding a select few snakes(and when compared to the wild populace even dozens of snakes are a few) we are removing the process of natural selection from the picture- natural selection is cruel and unforgiving… but it is also the reason why snakes evolved to what they are today to begin with. We cannot hope… nor are we cold enough to be able to cull animals as nature does… thus allowing gene makeups that are possibly less than ideal continue to spread…

* How far should we push the envelope, where do we draw the line… and is a line even essential? These animals are not going live in the wild…
On the other hand, are we not demolishing… slowly but surely, the little place left for these animals to thrive in the wild? Isn't it at all possible that all that will remain will be in our household? A hundred years from now? Who knows.

* problematic genes are discovered all the time… the Jaguar gene in carpet pythons- breeding two "Jaguars" together results in a dead litter. The Super Motley in boas are snakes with a deformed skull structure and few live to become adults(as far as I know, not a single adult super motley exists). How about Stargazing in cornsnakes, that originated with the sunkissed gene-line?
We are also ill-equipped to fully study the implications of what we do… for no one is conducting a major study on longevity of animals of a certain morph to see if there's a statistical link between a certain gene and certain diseases or shorter life-span.

I imagine I would get different responses from different breeders…

My intention with sharing all of these things is to perhaps spark something within the minds of those of us who wish to breed snakes… we do not have the means to give definite answers to these question… but if it will make us think before we act… and contemplate the ramifications for what we do… maybe… just maybe, we can lead the field to a brighter future where our own aspirations are interlaced with true understanding and compassion for these animals.

The pet trade as a whole is a paradox, for financial considerations often stand in contradiction to the humane ones… I feel that those who continue down the path unprepared may act on impulse and do something that stands against their belief… but they may realize it too late… and though they may regret it, it is the snakes that pay the toll.

I am hopeful… for snakes are not the first animals to ever enter our households… and we have the experience of dog and cat keepers and breeders to learn from.

I do hope you don't feel it is a chore to read this... I admit that it has gone quite a bit beyond my original intention to post a sponteneous thread...

Oren.

 

[diamondlil]

Good and thoughtful post, Oren. There have been discussions before about issues such as culling, how far to assist non-feeders, whether kinked animals should be bred. Real issues to think about in, as you so eloquently say, shaping the future of herpatology. Each breeder and keeper will draw their own lines they personally will not cross, some are more or less tolerant of other views to their own.
Last year was so bad for my breeding, I ended up with one kinked hatchling. I just couldn't cull her without giving her the chance to feed and grow. In doing so I had to really make the commitment that I would end her life if she didn't thrive or showed signs of being stressed (a nebulous condition to monitor, I had to decide if her behaviour was like normal hatchlings, did she eat, move, grow, thermoregulate as normal, would she show signs of pain or discomfort that I'd recognise?) I also made the commitment that I'll own her for the whole of her life. I will be responsible for her for (hopefully) 20 years, in which she won't be bred even if she grows out of showing her kink, because I know she has a spinal deformity. I don't know if it's due to environmental conditions during incubation or if there's a genetic basis. If her parents show a consistent number of kinked offspring in the future then I'll retire them from breeding. A far cry from just playing with the genetics of colour and pattern. In fact I really had to think about why I'm breeding some of my snakes, and just because I can breed them, should I? I bought them for their beauty, they don't owe me a penny I spend on them because they are beautiful and fascinating. If I could actually give every corn I hatch to good owners then I would, rather than sell them. 5 of my babies have been placed that way to people who stay in touch with updates on their progress.
I'm rambling now (tired after nightshift and needing my bed), but I hope some of that made some sense.

 

[Kokopelli]

Good and thoughtful post, Oren. There have been discussions before about issues such as culling, how far to assist non-feeders, whether kinked animals should be bred. Real issues to think about in, as you so eloquently say, shaping the future of herpatology. Each breeder and keeper will draw their own lines they personally will not cross, some are more or less tolerant of other views to their own.
Last year was so bad for my breeding, I ended up with one kinked hatchling. I just couldn't cull her without giving her the chance to feed and grow. In doing so I had to really make the commitment that I would end her life if she didn't thrive or showed signs of being stressed (a nebulous condition to monitor, I had to decide if her behaviour was like normal hatchlings, did she eat, move, grow, thermoregulate as normal, would she show signs of pain or discomfort that I'd recognise?) I also made the commitment that I'll own her for the whole of her life. I will be responsible for her for (hopefully) 20 years, in which she won't be bred even if she grows out of showing her kink, because I know she has a spinal deformity. I don't know if it's due to environmental conditions during incubation or if there's a genetic basis. If her parents show a consistent number of kinked offspring in the future then I'll retire them from breeding. A far cry from just playing with the genetics of colour and pattern. In fact I really had to think about why I'm breeding some of my snakes, and just because I can breed them, should I? I bought them for their beauty, they don't owe me a penny I spend on them because they are beautiful and fascinating. If I could actually give every corn I hatch to good owners then I would, rather than sell them. 5 of my babies have been placed that way to people who stay in touch with updates on their progress.
I'm rambling now (tired after nightshift and needing my bed), but I hope some of that made some sense.

I feel that your post illustrates another facet- the selling of animals to people who are possibly less than perfect keepers... that too is a bit of a problem... for one thing, you must make a living... on the other, who am I to judge? is it fair that we pass judgement in such a way?
The other side of the coin being ofcourse, that one may end up selling or giving the snake to the wrong hands.

This dillema sharpens if one wishes to make a living from breeding snakes.. or at least have the collection financially sustain itself... these too are lines one should set for himself... and it's not so black and white now is it?

Again, there is no "right" answer... but suffice to say that I would be a deal more at ease knowing that people actually consider these things before facing these dillemas rather than deciding only when they face it.

 

[diamondlil]

I know that I have no control over what happens once I sell a snake. Will it live a long and healthy life, treasured by the new owners? Will it be a passing interest, sold on when the owners gets fed up, maybe swapped for a rarer or more desirable morph? Die because it's kept in bad conditions?
I've bred other animals in the past, gerbils, guineapigs and zebra finches quite successfully. To be honest the ideal situation was with the guinea pigs, they had small litters, I kept most of what I bred and passed babies only to close friends and families. I don't presume to think I'm even close to the ideal keeper of anything, but I do care about and for my animals. So I may well come to the point where I stop breeding the corns and just enjoy my collection for their own sakes. This year I want to see if the pairings I've selected make healthy attractive offspring. Next year I'll be hoping my project trio will produce my very own dream morph. After that, I'm not sure at all if I'll carry on breeding the snakes. I certainly don't take them for granted or expect them to be anything other than pets first and foremost. I don't have to make any money out of them, my main reason for breeding them is the interest in their genetics, along with the pure joy of raising my own pets from eggs to maturity. I guess for me a snake that only laid one egg would be ideal, then I could keep the babies every year!

 

[Kokopelli]

Creating a "dream morph" may end up having bad results... for instance. I am talking about the greater scheme of things rather than the obvious dillema of breeding or not.