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Hybrid Markers List
- Thread starter Drizzt80
- Start date
dionythicus
Kiss My Hearse
I have seen crosses of yellow rat/corn, black rat/corn, etc. and I think the fact that someone would know exactly what it was in the wild just by looking at it means there is obviously some sort of "marker" that makes it easy to identify as corn/X. If not, how would anyone know what they were looking at in the wild? Your example gives credence to the point you were arguing against. To say that someone can visually tell a WC animal is corn/X, there have to be obvious physical characteristics from both sides of the gene pool that make that snake stand out as a hybrid. Given that pure corns can look hybrid and hybrids can look pure corn, I don't think we can decisively say, whether WC or CB, that a snake is definitely this, that or the other thing without knowing for fact what the parents' genetics were. Of course when you add more of one species' genes, you begin to lose the "line" between the two. At some point, a recessive trait may pop up in a clutch of "pure" corns and one may look a heckuva lot like a Cali king, which would make me suspicious about the parents, but at that point, what do you do? LOL
Tom Tuttle
Fightin the C
So Very True! This looks more like a pissing contest.
Tom Tuttle
Fightin the C
Yep, I was bored Vinman & came upon this thread. So I just had to read it.
From what I've read, I think an eastern milk would be misidentified as a hybrid!:roflmao: It seems to be the growing trend on this site to call everything hybrids. That is truly sad.:shrugs:
From what I've read, I think an eastern milk would be misidentified as a hybrid!:roflmao: It seems to be the growing trend on this site to call everything hybrids. That is truly sad.:shrugs:
TandJ
Ole' Stoic Viper...
That is irony Tom.. Its like the pot calling the kettle black.. Your one of the many who have insisted and even used the the term Rusty and Ultramel in very close association, yet there has not be sustainial proof that all ultramels are hybrids.. Why the dis there? But come up for air here, looking like a hypocrite in my eyes.. Of course, the trend on the other site is to single out a certain morph and destroy the value too. *shrugs* Go figure eh'..
Thats exactly what I say, I just can't figure out who takes the longer Pee, or whether or not I should get a rain coat and/or build an Ark..
Regards.. Tim of T and J
starsevol
Cohabbing is cruelty...
I strongly suspect that my darling 11 year old Katie is a rootbeer.
I won her at a herp club raffle 10 years ago, and she was donated by someone who bred alot of creamsicles. I suspect she was a "byproduct" plus she is very brown in color.
When she comes out of brumation in 2 weeks, I will post pics and see what you all think.
I won her at a herp club raffle 10 years ago, and she was donated by someone who bred alot of creamsicles. I suspect she was a "byproduct" plus she is very brown in color.
When she comes out of brumation in 2 weeks, I will post pics and see what you all think.
Roy Munson
New member
I hope that group of adult female hybrids I sold you is doing ok. :grin01:
starsevol
Cohabbing is cruelty...
Might not help, but can't hurt.
Since my suspicions of her rootbeerness came to light, I decided not to breed her again anyway.
Vinman
Vinman
Thumbs for you. Not many breeders would take this stance. this is what seperates . A breed form a quilty breeder like yourself. If she is a good breeder I would cross her to a high yellow cal king . I bet she would make some screaming jungles.
starsevol
Cohabbing is cruelty...
Thank you Vin. Jungles are nice snakes, I'm just not "into" them.
Plus I have at least 5 other projects planned and barely enough space to do it all!
Tom Tuttle
Fightin the C
Need glasses or a mirror?
Tim an Ark would be a good start, The raincoat is an optional accessory.
Rusty is the name of the Ultramel homo caramel/het anery from Carol. So where are you coming up with hypocrite?:shrugs:
As you are aware through emails,I also have 2 other lines carrying the Ultramel gene, Ultramel anerys from Don S.,and Goldusts from Carlos, also Ultra Amber from Sandy Sheilds! It's funny I've advertised for a female White Oak to use for breeding trials but nobody can offer one up.
That really makes it seem suspicious as though nobody wants to find out! So What are you doing to prove yours aren't hybrid?:shrugs:
OOPS! I almost forgot about the Ultramel Lavender from Stephen, Guess that's 3 other lines.
Dean the adult group of female corns from you are doing great! They are the best milksnakes I ever bought!:dancer:
Tim an Ark would be a good start, The raincoat is an optional accessory.
Rusty is the name of the Ultramel homo caramel/het anery from Carol. So where are you coming up with hypocrite?:shrugs:
As you are aware through emails,I also have 2 other lines carrying the Ultramel gene, Ultramel anerys from Don S.,and Goldusts from Carlos, also Ultra Amber from Sandy Sheilds! It's funny I've advertised for a female White Oak to use for breeding trials but nobody can offer one up.
That really makes it seem suspicious as though nobody wants to find out! So What are you doing to prove yours aren't hybrid?:shrugs:
OOPS! I almost forgot about the Ultramel Lavender from Stephen, Guess that's 3 other lines.
Dean the adult group of female corns from you are doing great! They are the best milksnakes I ever bought!:dancer:
Last edited:
starsevol
Cohabbing is cruelty...
I would be SUCH a hypocrite if I did that, Vin!!
A little over a year ago was when I started getting suspicious that she's a rootbeer. It REALLY bothered me that I had bred her in the past, with the possibility that the babies I sold to the pet shops "might" be hybrids. Soooo, I got WICKED drunk, logged onto another forum, (ks) and said a few things about hybrids that got me perminantly banned from the site!
She was a great breeder, last time laid 26 eggs with 24 hatching.
Also, I don't know anyone with a high yellow Cal king!
stephen
corn breeder
Thats True!
It REALLY bothered me that I had bred her in the past, with the possibility that the babies I sold to the pet shops "might" be hybrids. Soooo, I got WICKED drunk, logged onto another forum, (ks) and said a few things about hybrids that got me perminantly banned from the site!
Well,if you think of the (hundreds) of breeders that produce (thousands) of baby corns each, solely to sell them wholesale,that dont care about anything more then the numbers they produce and dont think twice about if they are breeding a emoryi or a black,grey rat or other type into what they produce.Can you imagine the percentage of cornsnakes that are so called pure? This is not something I am making up, I personally know of 3 people who do that! One of the guys I talked to was feeding rat pups that were fed a special diet,so his animals would grow huge and he told me that most of his females have 3 clutches a year!
Ok, I dont think this is right at all and would never do it!
I plan to do things a little different this year as far as breeding goes.
First, all my breeders are excersized by swimming for at least 20 minutes every 5 days! I have done this in the past and found that females usually wont get egg bound when this is done.
Second, all the females I plan to breed will only be bred one time to the male that I plan to use for them,I was told that they should be bred 3 times,but I am hoping that a single breeding will be good.The reason is alot of my females second clutched ,which took a heavy toll on them,not only did all those eggs go bad because I wasnt able to notice them being gravid and the eggs were found a few days later in there tubs.By only breeding them one time I am hoping that they wont second clutch!
Alot of my animals are now out of hybernation and I am only using paper towels in there boxes,with aspen it is harder to see whats going on with them. So this should enable me to keep a closer watch on them.
There food is only the best available and rodents I produce,there drinking water is bottled water of higher quality.
So I wish everyone a great breeding season!:cheers:
It REALLY bothered me that I had bred her in the past, with the possibility that the babies I sold to the pet shops "might" be hybrids. Soooo, I got WICKED drunk, logged onto another forum, (ks) and said a few things about hybrids that got me perminantly banned from the site!
Well,if you think of the (hundreds) of breeders that produce (thousands) of baby corns each, solely to sell them wholesale,that dont care about anything more then the numbers they produce and dont think twice about if they are breeding a emoryi or a black,grey rat or other type into what they produce.Can you imagine the percentage of cornsnakes that are so called pure? This is not something I am making up, I personally know of 3 people who do that! One of the guys I talked to was feeding rat pups that were fed a special diet,so his animals would grow huge and he told me that most of his females have 3 clutches a year!
Ok, I dont think this is right at all and would never do it!
I plan to do things a little different this year as far as breeding goes.
First, all my breeders are excersized by swimming for at least 20 minutes every 5 days! I have done this in the past and found that females usually wont get egg bound when this is done.
Second, all the females I plan to breed will only be bred one time to the male that I plan to use for them,I was told that they should be bred 3 times,but I am hoping that a single breeding will be good.The reason is alot of my females second clutched ,which took a heavy toll on them,not only did all those eggs go bad because I wasnt able to notice them being gravid and the eggs were found a few days later in there tubs.By only breeding them one time I am hoping that they wont second clutch!
Alot of my animals are now out of hybernation and I am only using paper towels in there boxes,with aspen it is harder to see whats going on with them. So this should enable me to keep a closer watch on them.
There food is only the best available and rodents I produce,there drinking water is bottled water of higher quality.
So I wish everyone a great breeding season!:cheers:
TandJ
Ole' Stoic Viper...
I can't prove they are not hybrid, I can't prove or disprove any corn is a hybrid.. You can't eithier and you know that.. Unless your going to foot the bill for the Corn snake gnome project no one can say with 100% certainity ( What a bill that would be... ).. Good luck.....
Please do, post our e mail conversation, it would not bother me in the least.. In fact it might give me a refresher about what I figured was going on.. Heck Tom, I might just have things remembered wrong and I digress if I do..
I think thats funny too, because I know there was a few listed for sale too..Of course you wanted a breeding loan.. My bad, but $40 and the cost of shipping shouldn't be to much for you.. I can't sell you one, because I don't have one.. I only know for sure of one person that has a grey oak, and there might be another person I remember meeting here in the forum that has one, other wise they seem to be rather uncommon to say the least.. However, I have provided a link to someone who sells them..
http://www.sunshineserpents.com/Rat snakes/White Oak.htm
Regards... Tim of T and J
Vinman
Vinman
You got Tom wrong He want's to prove if the ultra gene came from the gray rat. Now I came up with the idea that maybe if ultra did come from a gray rat maybe it is the white oak phase is a ultra gray rat. Now if he produces hybrids that are ultra from that cross Then we know that the ultra gene came from the gray rat .
I purpose a better one we should take up a collection to get a DNA test done on one of the first ultars that is still around. That would put a end to the whole story and it wont cost more than a few bucks from each member. Look what kinda of a reputation the sight would get from doing the test.
TandJ
Ole' Stoic Viper...
Vinny, I have stated in the past, I don't think that there is only one line of ultramel floating around at all.. I think there is more than one type of ultra gene floating around, as far fetched as that might seem.. Your 100% convinced that the "Peach" is something different, while there are people who think your nuts, I don't think you are personally.. *lol*
Vinny, the best way to find out for sure is gnome mapping, not cheap and very time consuming.. I understand what your saying, and that is a very noble idea, but it is not the all inclusive proving test..
Regards.. Tim of T and J