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Live or F/T?

Snake Dave said:
You can easily reproduce that effect. Dangling the prey item and waving it around can easily stimulate a strike and constrict response, which will use practically the same amount of energy as if it were live prey (you can play tug-of-war to help, LOL).
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I've teased my snake to eat loads of times by wiggling etc. it works a treat!

I wouldn't recommened any tug-of-war games though, i'd be too scared of damaging my snakes teeth, which could then lead to mouth rot. I just leave the mouse alone after my snake has gone for it.

I mean i'm sure a mouse struggles when fed alive, but i'm alot stronger than any mouse ;) thats why i don't do it. Similar to why you should try not to flinch and pull away when a snake bites you, so not to damage the teeth/mouth.

All the best

Tom
 
Snake Dave said:
You can easily reproduce that effect. Dangling the prey item and waving it around can easily stimulate a strike and constrict response, which will use practically the same amount of energy as if it were live prey (you can play tug-of-war to help, LOL).
Click to expand...

Please read my initial post.
I am doing exactly that for the snakes that do behave that way.

Some of mine are too smart for that and will only play tug-o-war w/o constricting (they grab it, and seem to figure out it is already dead) and some will not take prey if I am holding it (even with tongs).

Not all snakes behave the same way.
 
Corny Noob said:
I'm trying to figure out why you asked if you weren't going to change your mind with what you were doing anyway...or were you just finding out how (un)popular it was?
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First off, I never said I will never change my mind. I asked because I wanted to know everthing there is to know. That way, I can make a good decision bosed on all the facts. I want to say thanks to all those that had helped me out on this matter and to those that likes to make assumptions. Thanks
 
I have fed frozen thaw and all mine didn't constrict. The funny thing is they just open their mouth and gulp it down; unless I dangle it. I do think F/T is the best way to go, but I do have another concern/question. When you thaw your mice out does it get mushy and skin breaks off easily? I had some that guts would just come out the side of its belly. Do you think those are the ones that has been frozen too long? Am I defrsting it them wrong? This is what I do...I put each mice in it's own zip log bag and defrost it in a cup of warm water(changed when cooled).

Now my other question is...some of you said to use co2. So, should I use CO2 or F/T? I have a total of 9 snakes. Do you think CO2 is cheap enough to use once a week? The more I think about it...the more I think I should just go back to frozen. How about I just frozen them myself? I also did that for awhile, but don't like the fact that I'm freezing them. I just want my babies to have the best. Thanks again guy/gals for all your help!
 
*shrugs*You said you thought live was better for them,sorry for jumping to conclusions but that leads us to believe that you would stick with what is 'better'.
FT/live is a very heated subject for us, and since it puts the snake in the line of sharp, painful, and potentially fatal harm, we're very adiment about our ways.
 
JanuaryLove said:
When you thaw your mice out does it get mushy and skin breaks off easily? I had some that guts would just come out the side of its belly. Do you think those are the ones that has been frozen too long? Am I defrsting it them wrong? This is what I do...I put each mice in it's own zip log bag and defrost it in a cup of warm water(changed when cooled).

QUOTE]

The only time thats ever happened to me is when I heated a pinky up for too long in too hot of water and it went goosh when I squeezed it to see if it was thawed all the way, oops:grin01:
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Never freeze live mice. That's a horrible, inhumane death.

CO2 could be done weekly fairly cheap, but there is an initial cost for the tank , etc. Make a small chamber and you won't use much CO2. This is really only feasible if you breed your own mice, as buying them live is a hassle and can get quite expensive.
 
TWGarland said:
I wouldn't recommened any tug-of-war games though, i'd be too scared of damaging my snakes teeth, which could then lead to mouth rot. I just leave the mouse alone after my snake has gone for it.

I mean i'm sure a mouse struggles when fed alive, but i'm alot stronger than any mouse ;) thats why i don't do it. Similar to why you should try not to flinch and pull away when a snake bites you, so not to damage the teeth/mouth.
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Tom, when I say tug-of-war, I hope you don't think I pull with all my might... LOL. I just wiggle it a bit with the forceps, honestly, that wouldn't cause any damage whatsoever... I would have thought that you thought more of me than that, guess I was wrong :roflmao:
 
Snake Dave said:
Tom, when I say tug-of-war, I hope you don't think I pull with all my might... LOL. I just wiggle it a bit with the forceps, honestly, that wouldn't cause any damage whatsoever... I would have thought that you thought more of me than that, guess I was wrong :roflmao:
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:rofl: Well you did just give me a very funny visual of you digging you heels in, leaning back etc. with a teeny tiny snake on the end of your tongs! :roflmao:

I mainly posted for others benefit, i know you know your stuff man ;) , but for those who don't, tug-of-war doesn't sound gentle! :grin01: , and just a little too much wiggling could do damage, it can only take a tooth or two being damaged/pulled to sometimes lead onto mouth rot/infection.

All the best

Tom
 
One more question...If I order Frozen from a supplier would they tell you how long the mice has been frozen? I figure it'll be cheaper this way since gas is going up and pet stores never know how long they have had there mice in the freezer. Thanks everyone for your help so far!
 
I wouldn't worry too much about mice being over frozen. If it looks freezer burnt, then it's been frozen too long. If not, well, then it's no worse than any frozen thing you've ever eaten and it not harmful in any way to your animal.

I've eaten frozen things all my life, and I'm fine! Plus, as it's been mentioned before, there are more examples than I could list of snakes living a rich full life on f/t. I can't say I've ever heard of an animal being injured from eating something that has been freezer burnt (heck, I think I've done it. I eat food bachelor style)

Don't worry about it, basically. Don't feed your snake anything that looks "off" and he'll be fine. If you're worried about a supplier sending you bad stuff you can always check him out on the BOI.
 
v_various said:
I wouldn't worry too much about mice being over frozen. If it looks freezer burnt, then it's been frozen too long. If not, well, then it's no worse than any frozen thing you've ever eaten and it not harmful in any way to your animal.

I've eaten frozen things all my life, and I'm fine! Plus, as it's been mentioned before, there are more examples than I could list of snakes living a rich full life on f/t. I can't say I've ever heard of an animal being injured from eating something that has been freezer burnt (heck, I think I've done it. I eat food bachelor style)

Don't worry about it, basically. Don't feed your snake anything that looks "off" and he'll be fine. If you're worried about a supplier sending you bad stuff you can always check him out on the BOI.
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Thanks so much
 
I think the better feeder vendors will claim that they are killed and frozen AFTER you place the order, which is why they always allow for a bit of lead time before they are shipped out.
 
I think the big suppliers have probably got such a high turnover, that their mice will not be frozen for very long before shipping.

I feed all mine f/t and they all constrict (I do offer from forceps though, so maybe that makes a difference), I also handle them a couple of times a week, which I believe helps with muscle tone.
 
"One more question...If I order Frozen from a supplier would they tell you how long the mice has been frozen? I figure it'll be cheaper this way since gas is going up and pet stores never know how long they have had there mice in the freezer. Thanks everyone for your help so far!"

The impression that I got from the service where I ordered was that they try to keep as few frozen as possible in the interest of efficiency/economy. That is also why it may take a little bit longer for a reputable service (I have seen rodentpro and The Mouse Factory both recommended in these forums) to process your order, in that they aren't necessarily just grabbing it out of the freezer and shipping it right out (my first and only order took much longer than I expected, but from what I can tell it was good quality).
 
ILOVECORNSNAKES said:
I was told that frozen have less nutrients. Is this true?
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I haven't read any studies, but isn't there enough anecdotal evidence of corns living long, full lives on f/t to consider it non-issue? That is debatable, of course, but for me knowing so many snakes having lived long lives on f/t vs the one's I've seen with serious injuries due to live feeding (at the two local reptiles rescues), I don't even consider it worth looking into.

Considering the mice my corns are eating have not been processed in anyway, or pumped full of hormones, antibiotics, or preservatives, I'm kind of jealous they eat so much better than me ;_;
 
Yes, I have made up my mind and will start feeding frozen thaw again. Will it be ok to feed live once every long while? Maybe once a month for them to have some fun and excitment?
 
well, considering most of us have stated the facts already, that last question is in the realm of opinion. There are people who feed nothing but live, there are people who feed f/t only. The best thing you can do is access the facts and risks, then make an informed decision.

If you're looking for opinion, personally I wouldn't. I don't think there's any point, I don't think animals "enjoy" killing, I think they enjoy eating, and I don't like the risk. But again, just my observations and you're going to have to decide for yourself.
 
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