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Non-eater King Snake

B

broken_20_2

New member
I'm a little hesitant to post this, considering that I have been reading all of the Controversial Topic threads the past two days (makes one a little gun shy). I have a B/W Cali King that has only taken 1 meal in the past three months. A little background on this snake... He has, to this point, always eaten live. When I got him I had just decided to stop breeding mice (I only have 3 snakes and it wasn't worth it). So, I feed my feeders to him. He had an excellent feeding response, the mouse had hardly hit the floor before it was wrapped up. I continued to feed live until one day the King just wanted nothing to do with the mouse anymore. I have tried a number of different feeding methods:

1. Live (adult mice, fuzzy rats)
2. F/T Brained (adult mice, fuzzy rats)
3. Freshly killed (adult mice, fuzzy rats)
4. Live scented with Anole (fuzzy rat)
5. F/T washed with bar soap (adult mice)
6. Freshly killed washed with bar soap

I only try once a week (Friday is my feeding day). The only time that he ate was when I used the Anole to scent the fuzzy rat. On this occasion, I also used thongs to tap the rat against the Kings side in an attempt to get him to strike. He did not strike, but once I threw the fuzzy down on him, he turned around and ate him. I was not sure if it was the Anole or the agitation, so last week I tried again without the Anole to no avail. I really don't want to continue to use an Anole and get him "hooked" on that. I don't want to house and keep an Anole alive just to get my King to eat. And since I'm not willing to feed my only Corn to him yet (just a joke, put the stones down), I'm not quite sure what to do. If the only option I have is to scent his meal every time, I will do it. I was just hoping someone else had another suggestion first. Thank you in advance, and I apologize if this is still considered a "newb" question (not sarcastic).
 
I think you can use a frozen anole, or an anole shed, if you don't want to keep a live anole. (I have a whole live scenting library of toad, anole and tree frog, as well as a frozen died-of-natural-causes toad for toad-guts scenting- for all the good it does me...)

There is also chicken broth and tuna water which work for some. Maybe another type of rodent?

I have a non-feeding snake that I have tried EVERYTHING on- I'd be ecstatic if she'd take an anole-scented anything, or even an anole itself.

There's a thread, like a FAQ in development, by Fender Player, that has even more suggestions.

Hmmm, I wonder if you could get a King to feed by scenting the mouse with another snake's scent.

Good luck- I feel for you.

Nanci
 
CaptBogart said:
How old is the Cali and what are your temps? How about lighting? Is he losing weight?
Click to expand...

I'm not sure of age, I bought him as an "adult". My guess would be between 2-3 years. He is a little under 4 ft. My Temps are around 84 on the warm side, and I keep my apartment at 73 at all times. My snakes are in my bed room, so every morning I turn on my light and open the blinds for a little natural sunlight. The enclosures are far enough from the window that the sunlight is not affecting the heat, it just lights the room a little. Then when it gets dark outside, I turn off my bedroom light.
 
Nanci said:
Hmmm, I wonder if you could get a King to feed by scenting the mouse with another snake's scent.
Click to expand...

I have thought of that, but my Corn is only about a year old and still very skittish. I think I would either end up getting bit, or the mouse/rat I was trying to scent would end up in it's mouth. :grin01: I also have a Ball Python... but the potential for disaster is ever greater. :eek1:

I will definitely try the chicken broth/tuna method this Friday!

Thank you for your suggestions and support.
 
I also have a Cal King that has recently become reluctant to eat. He did the same thing last year around this time. I wonder if it's just something about this time of year.
 
My perfect-feeding Cal King who has never missed a meal for me (3 month old) skipped his last two feedings, but went blue, shed eight days later, and ate again last night. I've never noticed a relationship between him going blue/not feeding before, but maybe it was just luck that I've never attempted to feed him while going blue. It's very difficult to tell when he's blue except his normally very dark chocolate belly turns more of a dusty milk choc color. But it's very apparent by behaviour- he goes into hiding and stays gone for over a week.

Nanci
 
Nanci said:
My perfect-feeding Cal King who has never missed a meal for me (3 month old) skipped his last two feedings, but went blue, shed eight days later, and ate again last night. I've never noticed a relationship between him going blue/not feeding before, but maybe it was just luck that I've never attempted to feed him while going blue. It's very difficult to tell when he's blue except his normally very dark chocolate belly turns more of a dusty milk choc color. But it's very apparent by behaviour- he goes into hiding and stays gone for over a week.

Nanci
Click to expand...

I have noticed that my King will refuse to eat when in blue. The first time it happened a panicked a little... it takes him so long to shed (longer than my Corn). So, I believe that behavior is "natural". My Corn, on the other hand, will not refuse a meal, even in blue.
 
BeckyG said:
I also have a Cal King that has recently become reluctant to eat. He did the same thing last year around this time. I wonder if it's just something about this time of year.
Click to expand...

I was wondering if it was "the time of year". I don't see how he could sense the change though. He hasn't been outside since it started cooling off, and the temp stays constant in my apartment. The only thing that I can think of is that now that it's colder out, the humidity has dropped a little. It's still in normal range, but it is a change. This is my fist winter with my King, so I'm not sure what to expect.
 
The decrease in day length is one possible indicator if there is exposure to natural light, but there seem to be factors that reptiles can detect because even those that are on regular lighting and controlled temperatures can seem to sense when it is winter and time to brumate.

Since this is an adult snake, it is very likley that the reluctance to feed is due to the season. They would be slowing down in activity and finding a place to brumate - give their body a rest prior to breeding season. If he is not losing weight, you may wish to simply reduce the feeding schedule to once every 3 weeks instead of as often as you have been offering food. He will let you know when he is ready to feed more often.

You can keep a dead anole frozen and thaw to use it for scenting - I have one now that has been in the freezer for 3 years and still works fine. Cal kings that are reluctant to start feeding on mice will prefer snakes for their first several meals and can be converted to mice by using the fresh shed skin of a snake around the thawed mouse's body - this may work for you if you want another option to keep you snake eating.


mary v.
 
vanderkm said:
The decrease in day length is one possible indicator if there is exposure to natural light, but there seem to be factors that reptiles can detect because even those that are on regular lighting and controlled temperatures can seem to sense when it is winter and time to brumate.

Since this is an adult snake, it is very likley that the reluctance to feed is due to the season. They would be slowing down in activity and finding a place to brumate - give their body a rest prior to breeding season. If he is not losing weight, you may wish to simply reduce the feeding schedule to once every 3 weeks instead of as often as you have been offering food. He will let you know when he is ready to feed more often.

You can keep a dead anole frozen and thaw to use it for scenting - I have one now that has been in the freezer for 3 years and still works fine. Cal kings that are reluctant to start feeding on mice will prefer snakes for their first several meals and can be converted to mice by using the fresh shed skin of a snake around the thawed mouse's body - this may work for you if you want another option to keep you snake eating.


mary v.
Click to expand...

Thank you very much for your addition. I have noticed lately that my King is always on the cool side. Even though I had not planned on brumating, I guess he is bound an determined. Makes life a little easier on me... :grin01:
 
I knew there was a reason to keep those old sheds laying around!

My corn will eat when totally blue, too.

She just put me through feeding hell this summer- but we've compromised with a decrease in frequency no matter how hungry she looks (from once a week to once every 10-14 days) and FK instead of FT- but I bet with the decrease in frequency she'd even go back to FT now. Also- she went from eating within minutes of being put in her container to taking up to three hours to get going.

Nanci
 
broken_20_2 said:
I was wondering if it was "the time of year". I don't see how he could sense the change though. He hasn't been outside since it started cooling off, and the temp stays constant in my apartment. The only thing that I can think of is that now that it's colder out, the humidity has dropped a little. It's still in normal range, but it is a change. This is my fist winter with my King, so I'm not sure what to expect.
Click to expand...

They know. Even though my temps stay pretty constant, and I keep their tank lights on summer hours, they still know somehow that it is getting to be winter outside.

None of my corns has stopped eating, so what I was really wondering is if it is something peculiar to Cal Kings, since both of ours are displaying the same behavior.
 
My female blocked the entrance to her hide with a pile of aspen and hadn't eaten in about three weeks too. Today she ate a small live mouse. I don't use any additional heat other than ambient, (75-80), and is one of the snakes kept in the naturally lit room. I still offer prey on feeding days in case she takes it, like this time. My male Cali hadn't eaten in two, but he just shed and attacked his mouse as soon as he picked up its scent... Good luck
 
Update

I tried to feed my King again on Friday. This time, I thawed out the mouse and then rubbed it all over the tail end of my corn (I was surprised my corn didn't freak out). I used the thongs again to hit the King in the side with the mouse, trying to invoke an attack. The king didn't seem interested. When it coiled up in the corner, I dropped the mouse right in front of it, half on it's head. It smelled it for about 30 seconds, then dug in. We'll see how next week goes...
 
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