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Okeetee and Creamsicle?

Yeah, I'm just saying they don't seem knowledgeable enough to know an amel from a creamsicle. So while it's possible that it's got emory influence, I'd put my money on it being a regular amel. But at this point, there's no way to tell for sure and it doesn't really make a difference.
 
LOL....HEY Terri, I guess you posted yours as I was finishing typing mine. :smash:

That's what I get for writing a long answer, hey? :)
 
Yeah, I'm just saying they don't seem knowledgeable enough to know an amel from a creamsicle. So while it's possible that it's got emory influence, I'd put my money on it being a regular amel. But at this point, there's no way to tell for sure and it doesn't really make a difference.
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Well, I have to say I don't agree with you here. I would put my money on that it is exactly what it is said to be, for the simple reason that the pet shop owners DO NOT make up the names of what they have by looking at them but by what the name is given on the list. Yes, I agree, they don't seem knowledgeable enough to know an amel from a creamsicle, and I am certainly betting they aren't knowledgeable enough, so that is why I would say it was labeled as they were "told" it was from the shipper. I would think that IF the shipper told them they had received creamsicles, then the breeder would know that the "amel" came from Emory background.
 
DdotSpot said:
Welcome to the forums Tormoni! Sit back and relax and watch your thread get off topic quick :-/

It looks like the petstores were right on with your cornsnakes, they look to be an Okeetee and a Creamsicle. Good looking ones too.

Hediki...I wish you wouldn't be so quick to jump down someones throat about their husbandry practices on their very first post...I might give your critism a little more thought IF you actually owned a cornsnake. Phew, feels good to finally get that out...

Having said that, I will have to painfully agree that you might want to re-evaluate using sand, its harmful to the snakes if it is ingested.
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sry my bad, i didnt even see that it was there 1st post i dont nomaly look in that area. im sry tormoni for just jumping at u like that, we all make mistakes (like wat i just did). :cheers: , good luck with them :cool: , and again i apologize for being so obnoxious
 
Thanks Mike and Dianne! I didn't even THINK about it being further away than a creamsicle x creamsicle crosss. DUH! :grin01: Of course if it was a creamsicle x amel it would have more red. Note to self: must have more coffee before posting in the am. LOL
 
In response to an apology PM that I got...
I figure I would post my reply for all to see...
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Tis not a problem, I post on forums for input and that's what I got. I am still just a little confused about why it's such a HUGE deal about my substrate. A lady at where I work has two corns and a couple other larger snakes and she says that she's used the same stuff as I am and she's never once had a problem, no snakes have died on her.

I guess I'm also still a little confused about the whole ingesting of the substrate. Kinda makes me wonder if ingesting substrate is such a huge NO NO, and people work so hard at NOT letting these creatures eat anything BUT the mouse, how in the hell do these creatures survive in the wild?? Whether or not they are desert snakes or not, sand is everywhere and im sure there is NO Snake in the wild that can avoid ingesting some when it eats, seems pretty inevitable to me, yet these snakes DO survive in the wild. Now surely, one could POSSIBLY die of ingesting a piece of substrate causing a compaction, but what are the odds, seriously. Like a child swalling a quarter, or a small rock.

I have, however, taken a closer look at the substrate that I am using (after reading all the posts), and ran a few home tests on it. While the pieces look large, they do dissolve fairly quickly when submerged in water, down to a very fine, sandy texture. I believe some of it even disolved into the water. So if it did this in water, I would imagine the results would be better if submerged in reptile somach acid. I can't help but think that a person would rather blame his substrate for why his reptile died than to admit that something else may have been wrong. Has anyone actually done an autopsy on a deceased reptile to determine the cause of death, or are we guessing?
But that's my thinking on the matter, I may consider changing substrate if I find that it may be causing problems (exessive regurgitation, timely defecations)

Thanks again for all your input and the rest of the forum members, it hasn't gone without thought.

Tormoni :cheers:
 
It's your call, but reptiles don't typically show obvious symptoms every time there's a problem. If you're lucky you might catch impaction early if it's not bad or you may come home to a dead snake one day and it'll be too late then. Most everyone else uses aspen or paper towels or something similar because it's considered safer. We're all just concerned for your snakes. Aside from the abrasiveness of the particles and its tendency to get everywhere (between scales, in the mouth, in the water dish) it's just not natural for corns to live on sand. These aren't desert animals and calci sand was primarily designed for leopard geckos, bearded dragons, and other desert lizards from what I can tell. You can keep using it and hope for the best, but it's really just an unnecessary risk with no benefits.

Also, the digestion of a snake is a function of temperature. Unless it can heat up adequately, it won't be digesting much of anything so I wouldn't count on the stomach acids constantly dissolving the stuff. Again, no one can do anything but offer you advice and mine is to read some of the better caresheets out there and adjust your methods accordingly. Here's a start for you: http://www.cornsnakes.net/care.php3

Not to put down your co-worker but just because her corns haven't died doesn't mean they are healthy. Many (not all) of the people who post here have raised successive generations of corns from hatchlings and know what they're doing. If they do something (or don't for that matter) there's probably a reason behind it. Anyway, do some more research and decide for yourself. We all hope your corns will do well.
 
Tormoni said:
But that's my thinking on the matter, I may consider changing substrate if I find that it may be causing problems (exessive regurgitation, timely defecations)

Thanks again for all your input and the rest of the forum members, it hasn't gone without thought.

Tormoni :cheers:
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**headdesk**
 
Tormoni...I work for a vet. We have sent snakes in for necropsies several times and have gotten results back saying that the cause of death was impaction due to sand ingestion.

As for snakes eating in the wild...yes, they ingest dirt, leaves, etc. That is why snakes have SO many babies. Only a small number of them actually survive. I am sure that the majority of the babies in the wild die because of predators and illnesses, but some of them are bound to die due to impaction, as well.

In my opinion (which you can take with a grain of salt...or sand...in this case), if there is a risk involved with any aspect of the care of my snakes or other pets, then it is my responsibility as an owner to minimize those risks as much as I possibly can. For example, if my dog was one to chew up his toys, I would find toys that he couldn't chew up OR he simply would not have any toys. We see several dogs at our clinic every year that have to have surgery because they have eaten some kind of foreign object. I honestly do not think the risk is worth the potential problems!

None of us can MAKE you change your substrate. All we can do is hope you don't regret that decision in the future. I hope you get lucky and nothing bad happens due to your decision.
 
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