Pre-shed behavior in snakes

[oneirogenesis]

I am learning more and more from my snakes about the stress of the shed cycle. Nothing I have read in any of my books on snake husbandry has prepared me for some of their strange behaviors and symptoms prior to shedding. I'm also wondering how many of these pre-shed issues are more characteristic of certain species of snakes.

I have frequently read that snakes hide more, may become aggressive and may refuse food when in their shed cycle. But I have now seen what look superficially like respiratory symptoms in two different species of snakes in association with the shed cycle that are not connected to any underlying illness and completely clear up once the shed is completed. In terms of information, all I have to go on are the experiences of other snake keepers that I read on forums and whatever my vet can tell me. Based on that, I know I am not alone in observing these things.

What strange behaviors have you all noticed in your snakes during the shed cycle? Do they ever actually act sick in some way prior to shedding and "get better" once it's all over? How frequently do they demonstrate different indicators such as aggression, refusal to feed, lethargy, irritability or the appearance of illness? Do you notice any species-specific activities or behaviors during the shed cycle? If the snake does have an illness, does the shed cycle exacerbate it?

It seems that when I try to research snake shedding, I find a lot of information about the mechanics of the sloughing itself and the appearance of blue or milky skin, but not much about how the cycle effects other systems in the body.

 

[Tavia]

When my female garter got her eye infection I bought the book "What's Wrong With My Snake?" by John Rossi D.V.M, M.A. and Roxanne Rossi. Just a little while after that came, my male garter went into shed and his face became really swollen, he was wheezing and clicking and my first thought was an URI but the above book said that also sometimes happens while the snake is in shed. So I waited until he shed before I took him to the vet (watching to make sure it didn't get any worse) and it cleared up entirely within the hour after he shed.
I have noticed that the garters both get those symptoms when within about 5 days of a shed, though neither of them have had it to the degree of the male's first shed with me. Only once or twice has my first corn had anything similar happen during shed and that was only a tiny bit of swelling by it's nostrils.

 

[oneirogenesis]

When my female garter got her eye infection I bought the book "What's Wrong With My Snake?" by John Rossi D.V.M, M.A. and Roxanne Rossi. Just a little while after that came, my male garter went into shed and his face became really swollen, he was wheezing and clicking and my first thought was an URI but the above book said that also sometimes happens while the snake is in shed. So I waited until he shed before I took him to the vet (watching to make sure it didn't get any worse) and it cleared up entirely within the hour after he shed.
I have noticed that the garters both get those symptoms when within about 5 days of a shed, though neither of them have had it to the degree of the male's first shed with me. Only once or twice has my first corn had anything similar happen during shed and that was only a tiny bit of swelling by it's nostrils.

That book is at my local pet store, I think; I really should pick it up! I wonder if stress makes these symptoms worse? I had the same problem with my Woma recently, and it was his first shed with me. He was looking and sounding so awful that I brought him to the vet, but the vet couldn't find any signs of infection and after he finally shed he actually seems healthier than ever. My corn snake seemed to be "sneezing" the very first time I handled her; she shed immediately after and has never done anything like it since. I wonder if the stress of being in a new environment on top of the stress of shedding made a difference that first time.

 

[Sine]

He hasn't done it the last couple of sheds, but my little corn snake used to hide and stay very still.
I knew not to touch him during his shedding but he was very still and didn't move, even when I gently stroked his tail. So I lifted him out and he lay very still in my hands, he was breathing and subtly moving his head to look around so I popped him back in his viv.
As soon as he'd shed, he'd go back to slithering all over the place again.
He still hides and doesn't eat while he sheds these days but the first couple of months when he would just lay there and not move used to really freak me out, I'm so thankful he stopped that.

 

[Hail_Britannia]

Cornwallis doesn't seem especially stressed by his shed, he'll even eat during it. However, I have noticed that when he's in blue, he is almost always to be found sitting on top of his heating pad. Normally he prefers the cooler side of his tank, but during his shed he seems to enjoy the extra heat.

 

[OkeeteeMom]

I'm just now seeing this thread for the first time...and what a good one it is.

My little girl (Cassandra) gets a bit sneezy (sounds like little clicks...kind of).

My big girl (Evie) is just now preparing to have her first shed since we've had her. I noticed that the past 2 weeks she's been in her hide. She's normally very active. When I have seen her in these 2 weeks, she drinks a lot of water. Today I went to feed her, not only did I find her in her hide deep down below the substrate, directly on the glass over her UTH (that's a first!), but I also noticed her blue belly, so I skipped this feeding.

 

[Allalaskan]

I know when my corn snake shed last he stayed hidden in his wet hide the entire time. He wouldnt eat as normal and was very defensive. When I popped the top off the humid hide to check on him now and then he would kinda freek out for a second and im sure it was because he couldnt see as soon as I put the lid back on he was fine. As soon as he shed he soaked in his water dish on and off for a few days (took the humid hide out) and but he was very active and when i offered him a mouse he took it from me before I could drop it in his bin with him.

 

[bitsy]

My corn snake seemed to be "sneezing" the very first time I handled her; she shed immediately after and has never done anything like it since. I wonder if the stress of being in a new environment on top of the stress of shedding made a difference that first time.

If it was "sneezing", I think that's actually a physical thing rather than a stress response. The shed starts from the tip of the snout, and the loosening skin can irritate the nostrils. Corns sometimes exhibit the signs of an RI immediately before a shed, but the timing and lack of mucus generally means that the shed is imminent.

If the noises you heard were more like little puffs, then it's more likely to have been the Corny equivalent of a hiss - they aren't terribly impressive when they try to act tough! In that case, handling before a shed (when the Corn is feeling vulnerable due to the impact on eyesight) would have stressed her and the hissing would have been a warning to put her down.

 

[2ndChildhood]

It varies a lot in my house, only thing consistant is that they all prefer the warm side when in shed.

Corn snake: no real issues other than preferring to hide more, as a juvenile would eat as long as he could reach the food from his hide (trying to coax him out of his tube-shaped hide, he stuck his head out far enough, grabbed the fuzzie and went back in). Doesn't eat during shed as an adult, but doesn't have an aggressive bone in his body.

Savu Python: typically goes all crabby, snorts and crackles when he breathes, but clears up as soon as his head sheds. First time I hauled him to the vet figuring RI, but he shed his head the night before and the vet couldn't hear anything the next morning. I had dropped his humidity and upped his heat, so he shed in patches that time. Now I just let him be as soon as he doesn't come out at night and starts snorting at me when he's disturbed. He has sounded this way consistently every shed.

Carpet Python: still a juvenile, but gets very hissy and anti-social when he's in shed, so I typically just leave him be as much as possible.

None of mine like to use a moist hide, and my humidity isn't overly high, but I still get good sheds off of all of them.

 

[oneirogenesis]

If it was "sneezing", I think that's actually a physical thing rather than a stress response. The shed starts from the tip of the snout, and the loosening skin can irritate the nostrils. Corns sometimes exhibit the signs of an RI immediately before a shed, but the timing and lack of mucus generally means that the shed is imminent.

If the noises you heard were more like little puffs, then it's more likely to have been the Corny equivalent of a hiss - they aren't terribly impressive when they try to act tough! In that case, handling before a shed (when the Corn is feeling vulnerable due to the impact on eyesight) would have stressed her and the hissing would have been a warning to put her down.

This is a good clarification, thank you! Ariadne was definitely "sneezing" as opposed to puffing before her first shed.

I guess I should add to the pool of information going on here. I only have two snakes that go off feed prior to shedding: my adult male Rosy Boa (I think he's around 5 years old) and my adult garter snake (tentatively a male). Everyone gets lethargic and hides for about a week before shedding. I notice swelling/looseness of the skin around the neck and head on my corn snake prior to shedding. My Woma's shed thus far has been the worst for pre-shed issues. The deeper in blue he got, the worse he looked and sounded. He didn't want to move at all, his neck swelled up and he "sneezed" every time he was handled. He started looking more like an old man than a snake. Once he shed it was like nothing happened, and he's since been more active than ever. I think he's just a little drama queen.

I haven't noticed any temperature preferences prior to shedding. I think I'm going to pay closer attention to that.

 

[Peanut Lover]

My 2 month old Peanut is going through his first shed since I got him (he's an anery corn). The process started about a week ago but he still hasn't shed! He was in blue for a couple days but is now back to normal-looking. Peanut acts pretty much the same as he normally does (this makes it extra tempting to handle him even though you shouldn't). He has never ever tried to strike at me, and he has still been a sweetie, even in this shedding phase. Really the only difference is that he he seems a little more skittish (running away more) and that he's been spending more time on the heating pad. I've been spraying down his tank and put a humidity hide in, but he doesn't go in it. I didn't even try to feed him even though I bet he'd eat. I really hope he sheds soon! I miss playing with my little buddy!

 

[skizerweiser]

quick question. is there an easy way to tell if a snake is male or female/

 

[Nythain]

quick question. is there an easy way to tell if a snake is male or female/

Easy way, sure. Take it to a reptile vet and have it probed. Cheap DIY easy way, nothing incredibly accurate. You can get a hopeful approximation by examining the tail (subtle differences in tail length, girth, and taper due to the location of the hemipenes). The third option, which should usually only be done on young snakes and only done by a professional, is "popping".

See http://www.cornsnake.co.uk/sexing-corn-snakes.php

 

[skizerweiser]

can I keep 2 corn snakes together in the same aquarium? Also if male and female do they have to be kept separate to breed?

 

[Guruofchem]

can I keep 2 corn snakes together in the same aquarium? Also if male and female do they have to be kept separate to breed?

BAD idea to do so. Corns are not social animals naturally, and most folks will tell you that cohabbing them leads to one or both being harmed eventually. If it is a breeding pair, definitely separate, and do your homework on corn reproduction before trying it. This forum has plenty of useful info, and several good books are also available; Soderberg's and the Loves' books are highly recommended - click the names for links to Amazon entries for each.

 

[Zombiegirl]

With regards to shedding: Omnom (my more active corn) is always out and about, exploring and watching the world go by. When I don't see him for days on end, he is getting ready to shed, and as he has trouble shedding on his own, when he is ready he will come back out and sit in the front of his viv waiting for me to help him. Kiyohime (my shy girl) is NEVER out and about to be seen unless you happen to see her at night come out to get a drink...I never know when she is going to shed and have fed her several times *literally* the night before she has shed >.< She is a snow stripe so being able to tell when she is in blue is difficult.

 

[Myca]

When my female garter got her eye infection I bought the book "What's Wrong With My Snake?" by John Rossi D.V.M, M.A. and Roxanne Rossi. Just a little while after that came, my male garter went into shed and his face became really swollen, he was wheezing and clicking and my first thought was an URI but the above book said that also sometimes happens while the snake is in shed. So I waited until he shed before I took him to the vet (watching to make sure it didn't get any worse) and it cleared up entirely within the hour after he shed.
I have noticed that the garters both get those symptoms when within about 5 days of a shed, though neither of them have had it to the degree of the male's first shed with me. Only once or twice has my first corn had anything similar happen during shed and that was only a tiny bit of swelling by it's nostrils.

John Rossi is my Rat and Snake vet.

 

[MegF.]

Very quiet, don't move around. My green trees perch in one spot and don't move. Amazons tend to go to ground or hang out in the plants. Rattlesnakes goes into her hide and doesn't come out. Any time they don't move around a lot I know they are going into blue. Swelling of the head. Clicking, wheezing sounds. refusal to eat (although a lot of mine will eat no matter what.) In cases where I've had sudden death in a chondro, I've found that it is often just after shed. Don't know if it is so hard on the body that if they were compromised in some way it does them in....can't tell.

 

[skizerweiser]

at what size do corn snakes start eating fuzzy"s?

 

[MegF.]

Depends upon the cornsnake. The food item should be as wide or slightly wider than the biggest part of your snake...that's usually mid body.